• This topic has 503 replies, 39 voices, and was last updated 6 years ago by matts.
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  • 2017 TT'ing thread
  • weeksy
    Full Member

    That doesn’t sound like any fun at all !

    matts
    Free Member

    One other thing – have you done many/any all out 20 min efforts on the road before? If you have done testing on Zwift, you may find that you can push more Watts out on the road. How does your profile compare from the turbo to the crits you’ve been doing – HR/Power ?

    matts
    Free Member

    That doesn’t sound like any fun at all !

    It’s not. 😈 😈 😈

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    crosshair
    Free Member

    Best 20min power is identical from the first Hillingdon I did and the last indoor FTP test I did- 313w.

    I am ‘fitter’ now though so I’d hope to improve on that slightly outside.

    Lol @ 20mins 🙂 I was gonna treat anything over 20mph as a success 😆

    TiRed
    Full Member

    You’ll be fine. And no, they aren’t a lot of fun. Just aim for about 320 watts going out and more coming back. Pedal hard in the downhills to keep your heart rate up. Come along to a Wednesday evening Hillingdon TT. Eleven laps of the same circuit makes for more consistency and pacing. Well that’s what I tell myself.

    winterfold
    Free Member

    Empty the tank is a better term than sprint. I might manage 400W compared to 900 in my old fart effort at a proper sprint

    It’s a continual progression of greater than FTP effort – sporting courses make this much harder to manage. Reviewing your HR trace after the event can help you see how well you achieved it

    crosshair
    Free Member

    320?!? I would end up walking back if I try that. I’ll start at 290 and keep cranking it up by 10w each quarter I think.

    It’s all a little bit academic as my 3 min, 370w Anaerobic intervals the other day only got me 25mph on the flat 😆

    mrblobby
    Free Member

    Well Crosshair, my plan was to ride Bentley tonight but don’t think I’m going to make it so may well join you on H10/3 tomorrow night. Looks like it’ll be cold, wet and windy, can’t wait 😉

    matts
    Free Member

    And it’ll be a northerly wind, which makes for an effective headwind both ways.

    Enjoy. 😉

    DT78
    Free Member

    I appear to have bought a boardman team tt….a quick n+1 just before baby #2 joins. Not sure if I’ll get many actual races in, but at least it removes the chores of fitting clip-ons/swapping wheels/generally faffing about.

    Looking forward to sorting the position on the turbo and seeing how it performs.

    Anyone seen a cheap standard sram chainset, bb30, so I can swap my power meter over…

    Kryton57
    Full Member

    bought a boardman team tt a quick n+1

    Welcome to the club 😀

    [url=https://flic.kr/p/TVseVU]FullSizeRender[/url]

    £800 from Halfords per chance?

    mrblobby
    Free Member

    Nice work DT78. Needs photos.

    Got a few things to do to my TT bike. Got one of them new fangled Aerocoach single rings to fit, so need to remove the front mech and I might switch the base bar STI back to brakes only (must be worth at least half a watt 😉 ). Got a new fork to trim and fit. And got a couple of tweaks to do to the pole and pad position. And I really need to get the stupid plug out the rear hole on the seat post so I can move the saddle to the rear position, I’m beginning to suspect the thread’s been glued I can’t get it to budge 😕

    Though having said that, racing has just not been happening this season. Picked up an injury at the beginning of March that is really making training and racing difficult. Only raced once so far this season. Just a club event but a win is a win 🙂 And a stressful lesson learnt in making sure I know where the parking and sign on is for the race before I set off 😉

    Welcome to the club

    Kryton, that’s some tail light you have on there 😉

    crosshair
    Free Member

    Ah cool MrBlobby! I should know a few faces now 🙂 I suppose I had better actually join at some point 😀

    What’s the form on warming up? Sign in, get a start time, make sure you are back ready to go before then??

    mrblobby
    Free Member

    What’s the form on warming up? Sign in, get a start time, make sure you are back ready to go before then??

    Pretty much. Sign on will be about half six. The start is a few mins up the road from the kebab van lay by so give yourself a bit of time to get there.

    matts
    Free Member

    I’m beginning to suspect the thread’s been glued I can’t get it to budge

    It might be threadlocked. Try heating the bolt a bit with a soldering iron.

    DT78
    Free Member

    Yep halfords c2w along with a 2 up trailer for the nursery run. They will both get used on the commute (if I’m racing that evening) but not at the same time!

    Pickup should be Friday.

    Debating which wheelset to use I have cosmic sls in the loft and 404s on the Sunday bike….will the comics be that much slower?

    Eyeing up tri spokes on planetx…

    mrblobby
    Free Member

    It might be threadlocked. Try heating the bolt a bit with a soldering iron.

    Hmm well one side is plastic so going at it with a soldering iron might not be the best idea. Might attack it with a dremel.

    Debating which wheelset to use I have cosmic sls in the loft and 404s on the Sunday bike….will the comics be that much slower?

    I don’t think the Cosmic’s are regarded as a particularly good aero choice.

    Eyeing up tri spokes on planetx…

    I’d stick with the 404 unless I had evidence that the PX tri spoke was quicker.

    TiRed
    Full Member

    Eyeing up tri spokes on planetx.

    What you put on the front doesn’t matter as much, and your Zipp 404’s would be a very good choice. IF you want more speed, look for either a used disc (£600), an 808 to match logos 8) or a Hed Jet 9 (about £350). Covering a 90mm deep section wheel is my strategy, but as you can see, there isn’t a huge amount to be gained, and in some instances a disc is not as fast.

    Going too deep on the front can be a mistake if you are not a heavy rider, as the bike can be unduly affected by cross winds.

    crosshair
    Free Member

    I reckon MrBlobby works at the Met Office 😆

    That was the wettest I’ve been in a long time!! Literally had to wring my socks out afterwards.

    Anyway, TT done. It was strange!! Time absolutely flew by. And it never really hurt- it was just a battle against the numbers.

    Pacing was awful. Finished a bit too strong I’d say. 306w average, 307w weighted.

    The second quarter has the downhill and the roundabout hence the low figures.

    Stayed in the drops the whole way but there’s not really room to hide my sizeable frame behind my Garmin 😀

    umop3pisdn
    Free Member

    What you put on the front doesn’t matter as much

    Complete nonsense. Front wheel aerodynamics matters much more than the rear where airflow is much more turbulent. Even the wrong tyre on the front makes a difference.

    A disc is always faster… you’ll notice that all the manufacturers that claim their deep wheel option is faster than a disc don’t happen to make a disc 🙂

    DT78
    Free Member

    Is that graph for a pair of wheels or just comparing the rear?

    crosshair
    Free Member

    Deep in thought during warmup

    Just sitting back down after my sprint for the line…

    mrblobby
    Free Member

    DT, I’d assume wheel only.

    Complete nonsense

    +1 🙂

    A disc is always faster… you’ll notice that all the manufacturers that claim their deep wheel option is faster than a disc don’t happen to make a disc

    … and that the Pro teams they sponsor pretty much always use some other manufacturers debadged disc for time trials (debadged Lightweights are a common sight.)

    TiRed
    Full Member

    Obviously going from an open pro to a 900 mm deep section will have an improvement on the front. What I meant was that choice of front wheel is insensitive once you’ve gone to deep section, and the 404 is already aero. Plenty of riders have given up on 900 mm front wheels because what you gain in aero, you lose in bike handling due to side winds. If you are light, this is a real concern.

    As for discs, I’d agree they are always faster, unless it’s a very hilly course and weight is going to play a sizeable contribution to power requirements. All things being equal, I’d get a disc.

    nathb
    Free Member

    Well done CH!

    I might pop to Hillingdon tomorrow and see what I can do over 11 laps 😆

    TiRed
    Full Member

    There is a Westerley Wednesday segment that starts immediately opposite the clubhouse and is 11 laps anti-clockwise. You’ll see it listed on your Winter Series races.

    And yes CH that was a text book first TT. You were supposed to go off at max heart rate, hard as you can, blow up and die on the way back 😉

    The Wednesday TTs are a lot of fun, and a great place to learn about pacing.

    crosshair
    Free Member

    26.22 official time and 9th out of 15 starters.
    This isn’t going to be a regular occurrence (famous last words as the new TT bike appears 😀 ) but I can definitely see how you get into it- mostly by laying in the bath saying “Shoulda, woulda, coulda…. ” 😆

    nathb
    Free Member

    Great, is it a standing start TiRed?
    I’ll be using my disc cx bike so not expecting sub 28 mins lol

    There’s no one cutting you up in TT’ing so no excuses I guess…

    crosshair
    Free Member

    I don’t think it counts as a real British TT without potholes, lorries, angry commuters and getting changed in a cold layby 😆

    hjghg5
    Free Member

    First evening TT of the season for me tonight. Due to logistics (my OH needs the car) I’m riding straight out from work so I’m on the road bike rather than the TT bike (I’m not commuting on aero bars and a disc wheel!). I’m just going to use it to refamiliarise myself with the course, catch up with people and set a crap handicap to improve on next time 😉

    matts
    Free Member

    I don’t think it counts as a real British TT without potholes, lorries, angry commuters and getting changed in a cold layby

    A natural Alf Engers in the making. 😆

    matts
    Free Member

    Check out this Engers film promo

    1:15 – look at his position – and check the gear he’s pushing. 😯

    TiRed
    Full Member

    I’m not commuting on aero bars and a disc wheel!

    Why not? I do. I keep my TT and other race bikes in the office when I bring them in, but I do at least cover up the skin suit with a “jersey of modesty” and not wear the pointy hat, so as not to offend my colleagues sense of decency.

    My frame was filet brazed by Alf Engers’s builder, Barry Chick 8) . That will be my only TT claim to fame.

    matts
    Free Member

    So apparently Engers rode a 56-12 for the 49:24. 😯

    You should wear the skinsuit and lid for commuting. And get a little beeper to use when your stopped in a bunch at the lights.

    Deep breaths.

    Band the front wheel up and down a couple of times.

    beep beep beep beep beep GO!!

    .. then casually clip in and saunter off to work.

    Jamz
    Free Member

    Complete nonsense. Front wheel aerodynamics matters much more than the rear where airflow is much more turbulent. Even the wrong tyre on the front makes a difference.

    A disc is always faster… you’ll notice that all the manufacturers that claim their deep wheel option is faster than a disc don’t happen to make a disc

    Actually Reynolds make a 92mm deep Carbon Clincher and a disc and they claim that their CC is faster. I often think it might be so as not to put triantelopes off? Whatever the case, my disc (Citec) certainly feels faster than my Reynolds Aero 92.

    Anyway, I’ll stop being an annoying pedant now…

    hjghg5
    Free Member

    At this time of year most people in my club use their road bikes in an attempt to get a softer handicap for the points competition 😉

    I can’t keep the bike in the office and I’m not leaving the TT bike outside (I worried enough about my powertap pedals today!) I have however been known to commute in a skinsuit with a jersey over the top (most of the time my OH will drive over with my TT bike and I’ll ride out on my commuter and meet him there, it’s just that today he was riding elsewhere).

    Anyway, that was my fastest non-aero time round the course, not that I’ve done it on the road bike too often. I also set a new max 20 minute power figure 🙂

    And as we were waiting for the start a Team Sky car came past and gave us a bit of horn based encouragement 🙂

    matts
    Free Member

    It was prob the Team Sky bus driver from last year and he was probably telling you to get out of the damn road. 😆

    hjghg5
    Free Member

    They slowed down, waved and did a bit of a tune with the horn, definitely friendly horn rather than angry horn! 🙂

    DT78
    Free Member

    So picked up boardman and on the turbo Couple of questions.

    Not used bar end shifters before. Is the rear shifter normally very stiff? This is like 2 finger stiff. I was expecting minimum effort to maintain position

    The r bend vision trimax bar doesn’t seem very adjustable. I am used to ‘bracing’ against a j bend. Probably bad form but I can’t see any easy way of really gripping a r bend. Do you just basically rest on it rather than grip it properly?

    Any good resources to research to get a starting body position?

    Jamz
    Free Member

    So picked up boardman and on the turbo Couple of questions.

    Not used bar end shifters before. Is the rear shifter normally very stiff? This is like 2 finger stiff. I was expecting minimum effort to maintain position

    The r bend vision trimax bar doesn’t seem very adjustable. I am used to ‘bracing’ against a j bend. Probably bad form but I can’t see any easy way of really gripping a r bend. Do you just basically rest on it rather than grip it properly?

    Any good resources to research to get a starting body position?

    My bar end shifters (Dura Ace) do require a firm push to change gear (and there is a solid click when it moves). I tend to have my thumb over the top and my index finger underneath. The front shifter is quite nice and smooth in comparison. So I think what you describe is normal.

    I had r bends when I first started, didn’t like them at all – the wrist position was very unnatural – so I quickly swapped for j bends. Like you I also brace off the j bends at times so they are much better. Bear in mind that when you un-do bar end shifters you have to turn the opposite way to expected. If you do them up too tight then you won’t be able to get them out and you will have to buy a new set (I speak from experience here!)

    With regards body position, I would say just spend a month getting used to the bike and aerobars first, but always think about your position when riding. The two most important things are to shrug your shoulders up (i.e squeeze them together to reduce frontal area) and to get your head as low as possible. Notice that is just the head and not the whole upper body – a low head is more important that being super low at the front. Obviously that stands within reason – there’s no point being on the extensions and still having your body at 70 degrees to the horizontal. But in the first instance dont worry too much, just set the bars reasonably (comfortably) low and then focus on practicing a shrug while keeping the head as low as possible. You should be looking through your eyebrows. But at the same time make sure the tail of your helmet does not start to stick up into the wind, it must remain flat to the back. A good position takes many months, if not longer, to perfect and then hold (certainly at distances over 10 miles) so don’t try to do too much all at once – build it up slowly. Just remember, head down, shoulders up.

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