Viewing 39 posts - 41 through 79 (of 79 total)
  • 12sp = rubbish
  • Premier Icon benpinnick
    Full Member

    I believed a lot of stuff online that suggested for the best shifting on new 12 speed you needed a Shimano chain.

    This is indeed true, unless its muddy. The SRAM chain affords way more room so clears mud better and the shifting isn’t far off the shimano shift, and much better if the chain is filthy. Admittedly Im only a few rides into this experiment so take it with a pinch of salt, but the difference from ride 1 was notable.

    Premier Icon plop-pants
    Full Member

    I thought my sram xx1 was crap. Just couldn’t get it to index right in the larger sprockets. Sometimes the mech would have a spasm and fling the chain to the middle of the cassette. Just couldn’t work it out. Went on for months. Then, one day when I took the chain off to clean it I spun the cranks to check the BB and noticed the chainring was bent. Straightened it and VOILA! Perfect shifting. 🙄

    Premier Icon GolfChick
    Free Member

    Yep I found sram x01 to be crap in really muddy conditions, would start off fine but the muddier it got it would then clog up and not shift at all. I had a few rides like that, would work perfect in nice conditions but as soon as mud got involved it was utter tosh. I swapped to AXS and has been flawless since, no cables to get gunked up.

    Premier Icon kelvin
    Full Member

    I did love my 10-speed Saint shifter

    Best shifter ever. One day I won’t be able to say that, hopefully…

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    Box Components as a replacement, anyone used their drivetrain yet for comparison

    Can you remove the wheel on the 9 speed stuff?

    Premier Icon argee
    Full Member

    Always prefer 11 speed, seems to be the one that worked the best, 12 speed was just a little too many without changing the width of the cogs, not quite sure why they didn’t push wider ranges on 11, rather than going full in for 12 speed

    Premier Icon inbred853
    Full Member

    @dangeorbrain, I assume so, any reason why it wouldn’t?

    Premier Icon sirromj
    Full Member

    My 9sp = rubbish at the moment but because I’ve been too lazy to fettle it properly.

    Premier Icon montylikesbeer
    Full Member

    I have gone from 3 x 9 to NX 1 x 12 for 6 months in Rossendale.

    Consistently 3 rides a week with the last 2 months as muddy as you like.

    My cleaning regime of the whole drive train gets done after each ride including a deep chain clean

    Though not a scientific study I can reflect it has not skipped a beat, I’m happy with it and I’m not easily pleased

    Premier Icon Joe
    Free Member

    What a pain in the arse. I can’t believe we are here. When is 13 speed coming? MTB lagging behind the campag guys!

    Premier Icon VanHalen
    Free Member

    Fair enough I’ll have play and see if I can get it to work. Not what you expect brand new stuff to do. Normally you get that lovely ‘its all new and running super smooth’ feeling for more than 2 rides when you get new gears in my experience.

    When I built all my other bikes I’ve ever had I just set it up to index and off we go.

    Maybe I was hoping for too much? I love that clean new drivetrain feeling.

    The bikes is still ace so thats all good. I’ll go and ride some wet muddy slidy trails to cheer myself up.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    I’ve just ordered a Sram 12 speed chain to test the theory the mud flows through it better. If nothing else the oil slick colour should look savage.

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    I assume so, any reason why it wouldn’t?

    @inbred853 you couldn’t on their 11speed kit.

    Given the cost of their nine speed stuff is as much or more than decent 10 11 or even 12 speed I’ll be honest it makes no sense to me.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    Given the cost of their nine speed stuff is as much or more than decent 10 11 or even 12 speed I’ll be honest it makes no sense to me.

    This. Just buy 11 speed and have done with it. Sram GX with a Sunrace 10-46 or Shimano SLX with a Sunrace 11-46.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    Never had a problem tbh, I was pretty early to the GX 12 speed party and it’s been pain free and super reliable even in horrible conditions. At least as good as the 11 speed that it replaced and better than the 10 speed 1x setups I used.

    (I’m still using all of those on various bikes so that’s a day to day comparison; as much as I love the 10 speed Saint and my fancy X01 11 speed, the GX is the workhorse and it deals with the worst conditions)

    Premier Icon nickc
    Full Member

    Never had an issue with 12sp stuff regardless of the conditions, but they are significantly more sensitive to indifferent set-up than anything else I’ve used in the past. My only advice would be check the B setting clearance, it makes a heck of difference to how well it shifts.

    Premier Icon inbred853
    Full Member

    @dangeourbrain, can’t find any ref on Google or YouTube reviews of Box not being able to be removed from frame due to derailleur, would be a show stopper for me, have you got any links/ refs to this?
    I’ve sent a message to Box for clarification, I’ll post if I get a reply.
    I’d rather not have 10/11/12 speed as I’m happy with 9, just want a bigger gear range tbh. As for cost, I’m not looking at top end drive trains.

    Premier Icon cloggy
    Full Member

    My Big Dog came with GX shifting and a SX/NX cassette. It came with the cable adjustment several turns too tight but once I’d slackened it off properly [took several goes] it’s been perfect. I ride 5/6 days a week and have washed the mud off once.

    Premier Icon munkyboy
    Free Member

    Isn’t someone doing 9 speed wide range now? So better set up / reliability, same range but only compromised in steps between gears. Sounded a good approach rather than +1 gear per year

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    @inbred853

    The Box One derailleur features the familiar limit and B-tension screws for simple set-up, but I did encounter a clearance issue between the upper cage and the bulky Horst Link pivot on the Whyte T-130. This wasn’t a problem with the 11T cog on the Shimano cassette, but it was with the 10T cog on the SRAM cassette where the cage fouled on the frame before it could reach the final gear.

    Box Components sent out a longer B-tension screw to reduce the frame interference issue.
    A longer B-tension screw helped to achieve the necessary clearance, but the decreased chain wrap left gear changes feeling a little sluggish as a result. However, hardtails and other rear suspension designs may not have this problem in the first place.

    There were clearance issues with our pre-production derailleur and the bulky horst link pivot on the T-130.
    Another issue I discovered was rear wheel removal. Because the mech doesn’t rotate far back enough on the hanger, you’re left with minimal room to release the cassette from the dropouts. There’s no way of turning the CamClutch off like you can with a Shimano derailleur, so the process is a whole lot harder than it needs to be. As such, I had to unbolt the derailleur to install or remove the rear wheel, which is terribly annoying. Again, this may be a non-issue for other frames.

    From this very site.

    It wasn’t a non issue with other frames.

    Premier Icon inbred853
    Full Member

    @dangeourbrain, cheers, so specific to that frame it seems. I should be fine as only have a hard tail. Might give the Prime 2 or 3 a try, Prime 1 a bit to expensive , been though the cassette is a thing of much lovelyness.
    Looks like Box have updated thier gear since 4 years ago as well.

    Premier Icon dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    No, not just that frame

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Full Member

    Sounded a good approach rather than +1 gear per year

    Seems to be disadvantages without benefit – the gaps would be really annoying, the shifting would be rubbish. I don’t think there’ll be an ever increasing number of gears because 12 is just about right.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    I don’t think I’d buy Box components – what’s the obsession with 9 speed? Nothing wrong with 10 or 11 speed.

    Particularly 11 speed you get a good range, it’s not as finicky as 12 speed, and it’s not even expensive. If you picked up the new Deore 11 speed and a Sunrace Cassette it’s not expensive and works well enough (I fitted it onto a budget build for my nephew recently). Fits on a standard hg freehub and you can get the wheel out with no issue. Also probably lighter than the box stuff unless you buy the fanciest one – but then that’s on a level with quite fancy Shimano or Sram stuff.

    Premier Icon lillski74
    Free Member

    Must be your set up.

    12 speed is the way forward – can be heavy tho if entry level spec

    Premier Icon inbred853
    Full Member

    @joebristol, no obsession, just fancy trying something different from the two S’s. Prime 9, same gear range as 10/11/12 speed.

    @dangeourbrain, hopefully just affects the 11 speed/full sus setup then, should be ‘reet with my hardtail.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    I still don’t get it – the box 3 groupset (9 speed) looks to be about £180 for mech / cassette / chain / shifter.

    For a squeak over £200 you could get a deore 11-51 cassette (11 speed), Deore 11 speed mech, deore shifter, deore cranks and chainring and a Sram pc-1110 chain.

    You’d have closer stacked gears, a groupset you know will just work (and you can get the wheel out with no dramas) and it’ll most likely shift nicer. Not sure which option is heavier.

    Premier Icon longmover
    Full Member

    I did love my 10-speed Saint shifter

    Best shifter ever. One day I won’t be able to say that, hopefully…

    The XTR 12spd shifter isn’t far off the saint, I do find the shift a little bit heavier though.

    Premier Icon 13thfloormonk
    Full Member

    I think I just got two rides out of my 11-40 GRX setup and the shifting is all to cock again.

    Same problem every time, a bit slow shifting up the block, but then jumps second biggest cog on to top cog. Then very reluctant to shift off top cog again.

    Will replace cables, check derailleur hanger (again…) then think I’m going back to 2x with a smaller cassette. I think big cassettes just ask too much of a rear mech for reliably smooth shifting. My utterly neglected 105 11-28 road setup doesn’t need ANY attention…

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    An 11-40 cassette in 11 speed should be fine. Never had an issues running 10-42 cassettes with 11 speed GX. Setup and forget really – hardly ever needs any tweaking of cable tension. So should should be fine with 11-40 as long as the mech is designed to cover that range.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    13thfloormonk
    Full Member

    I think I just got two rides out of my 11-40 GRX setup and the shifting is all to cock again.

    Same problem every time, a bit slow shifting up the block, but then jumps second biggest cog on to top cog. Then very reluctant to shift off top cog again.

    Definitely an outright fault rather than an issue with 1×12 though… I mean, it’s not like 11-40 is even especially big.

    Premier Icon 13thfloormonk
    Full Member

    Yeah, shouldn’t have posted in anger (well, mild frustration), am sure this is my fault somehow, but I maintain that both 1xbig cassette setups I’ve had (SRAM then Shimano) have been significantly more fickle than anything I’ve run previously.

    Still, 2m of fresh outer purchased and ready to fit, another evening tweaking GRX beckons… 🙄

    Premier Icon droodling
    Free Member

    Got 12sp sram on 2 bikes. Runs smooth on both. You do have to make sure the gap between jockey wheel and casette is spot on, but easily done with the right tool. Two thumbs up from me.

    Premier Icon inbred853
    Full Member

    @joebristol, not for you to get it, personal preference and all that, I might try the eight speed 11-42 version now you’ve mentioned Deore🤔
    Joking aside, all I need is a shifter, derailleur and cassette, happy with my Jones’d XTR 960 cranks and 32t oval ring. Will buy a used 9 Speed Shimano XT derailleur off of the Bay to suffice at the mo, used the former to replace my mates FUBAR’d one while I was in summer single speed mode.
    I’ll post up a report of my Box experience once I buy and install it, probably early next year.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    13thfloormonk
    Full Member

    Yeah, shouldn’t have posted in anger (well, mild frustration), am sure this is my fault somehow, but I maintain that both 1xbig cassette setups I’ve had (SRAM then Shimano) have been significantly more fickle than anything I’ve run previously.

    Sorry, I didn’t mean it’s your fault! I meant that whatever the fault is isn’t a 1×12 or wide-range fault, it’s some generic old-school shifting fault same as always. Maybe made a little worse by putting 12 cogs in only a little bit more space than 11 but it actually comes down to only .2mm on a SRAM cassette as they’re a little wider.

    Premier Icon VanHalen
    Free Member

    Well, I had a play and got it a bit better.

    it was much drier today though (still gopping! So dead good fun) so im still not totally convinced. I’ll try it in the rain n proper slop again soon no doubt!

    It just seems a bit fickle for something you thrash through crap for 7 months of the year?

    Premier Icon sillyoldman
    Full Member

    My XT 12 spd has been bang on for over a year now. Not touched it.

    Premier Icon jjxray
    Free Member

    Just to add my penny’s worth to an already crowded thread.
    I swapped from my stock 2×9 Shimano acera to a 1×12 SRAM eagle gx in July and I love it. Shifting is satisfyingly crisp and precise across the range whereas the Shimano was slow and clunky and I could never get perfect indexing no matter how I adjusted it. The eagle did take a bit of care with installation and setting up, particularly the b gap, but once you’ve nailed that it’s been fit and forget.
    Not really a fair comparison given the entry level nature of acera vs GX eagle and the fact I’ve only been using the SRAM for 4 months, but it really does put a smile on my face when out riding.
    As others have said though, it’s not great in thick mud and mine has gummed up a couple of times this winter with the deep claggy clay and chalk mud we have locally (jockey wheels in particular). However I’d be surprised if many drive trains would come out of that unscathed.

    Premier Icon Scienceofficer
    Free Member

    GX Eagle early adopter here. Set up is a little more finiky, and its also slightly more intolerant of bent mechs and derailiers.

    X-sync 2 chainrings are brilliant and although the cassettes are super spendy they do seem to last.

    I’m less impressed with GX chains, which repeatedly split around the pins, and the rear mechs which eat Jockey wheel bearings way before the teeth wear out, and the main B-pivots wear and go baggy, resulting to too much waggle at the mech hanger for reliable shifting.

Viewing 39 posts - 41 through 79 (of 79 total)

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