[Closed] Dub less durable than gxp - replacement bb?

Hope – normally decent bearings but have they made a dub spacer thing yet?

https://www.wiggle.co.uk/hope-dub-bottom-bracket-conversion-kit

Hope have a dub adaptor.
Prime and other generic ones - don't bother - worse than sram.
Sram ones, well we have had poor life out of them on bsa. Small bearings? Alignment issues? Dunno, but it's worse than GXP.

If I was starting from scratch with either BSA or BB92, I wouldn't use dub or a 30mm spindle system. It would have to be a 24mm one, so shimano or gxp. PF30 would be ok as it's bigger, but I don't have that.

Yeah Sram did say dub was going to be better - but on bsa it doesn’t leave a lot of room between the axle and bb shell for bearings with decent sized ball bearings in them. A little better than a 30mm axle crank - but it’s only about 1mm better I think.

Can’t say I think I’d notice the difference in the stiffness of a 24mm axle vs 28.999mm one.

The SRAM DUB BB has at least 3 different spacers included for the chainline adjustment. I don't think the Hope convertor option provides for chainline adjustment. I used a Hope BB and a generic convertor, and the chainline was wrong. I had to use a SRAM BB, which is a shame because I know the Hope will be bombproof.

Edit: scrub that, thought it was pressfit.

Interesting - with dub I’ve just run the 4.5mm spacer on the outside of the driveside bb cup and that’s worked fine. Taken up the slack with the plastic collar on the left crank (would be nicer if this was a metal collar as the plastic feels cheap) and no dramas really.

Just checking prices and the Hope bb is about £80 + dub converters at £16.

A local bike shop have Sram ones for £32 in stock.

Are the Hope bearings likely to last 3x longer do we think? Looking online once the Hope bearings go pop they are £16 each (per side) to change. Nice that the cups are reusable - presuming the Sram ones are ‘disposable’?

Edit - actually just noticed there’s a specific Hope tool you have to use to install the cups too - £££

Oooo, just found the wheels manufacturing dub bb for bsa. £75.99. All in price - unlike Hope at say £80+ the sleeves to fit dub.

Looks like it has bearings that fit straight to the cranks rather than sleeving out a 30mm bearing to fit.

Not sure what tools the wheels one needs to fit - I have 3 different bb tools already - for dub / ht2 / gxp + one for bmx I think (maybe wrong on that - might be pressfit). Oh, plus one bike is bb30 so I have a press tool for that too.

Ah. A DUB thread.

Ive got BSA. My first DUB BB was ok - lasted about 14 months through all seasons. Since then, the best I've had is 7 months, the worst 2 months.

I have a thread about a badly faced kingdom Vendetta undoubtedly contributing to this, but they have been equally crap on my other bike with better tolerances.

They have all failed from seized/rusted bearings.

The problem then is that the soft alu axle rotates and wears, and then even with new bearings its loose and the axle is buggered. At least with shimano the crank axle is steel to resist this.

No better than BB30 IMO. Just not enough space for seals and bigger ball bearings. I should think it would be much improved with T47.

I shall be changing my cranks back to Shimano in the fullness of time for these reasons.

Yeah - my first one I’m sure was going well on a Bird Aeris 145. The gammy one is on a Marino custom frame. Maybe the Bird had a more square machining of the shell / threads? Either that or I was lucky first time, not so much second time.

Just ordered a wheels manufacturing one to try instead this time rather than throwing money at disposable Sram sub ones. The Hope solution is more expensive and it just sleeves out a 30mm bearing. The wheels one looks like it has the correct size bearing for the 29mm axle but we’ll see when it arrives.

My dub crank has some of the anodising worn off where the bearing sleeve sits on the non-drive side - but not completely worn off and no appreciable groove so far.

I read somewhere this is more likely to be side to side play than rotational. My bearings are seized / completely dead yet but wouldn’t want to leave them much longer.

Have you checked that the Marino is actually faced properly?

Taken up the slack with the plastic collar on the left crank (would be nicer if this was a metal collar as the plastic feels cheap) and no dramas really.

Cane creek do a decent metal preload adjuster which is miles better than the generic sram ones.

I've had a Praxis BB on my hardtail, still going strong and it's seen a lot of slop. I think they are about £25 from Merlin Cycles. I think it's a slightly different BB tool though but don't quote me on that one

Have you checked that the Marino is actually faced properly

Nope - I’ve never had a bad shell faced tbh. I’ll have a look when I take the bike out - I’m sure the local bike shop nearest me will happily part me from an extortionate amount of money for it. Always feel ripped off in there but it’s very local for emergencies. Working on a few other lbs places relationship wise to find a good one I can use instead. Just bought a new frame from one so that should help.

Cane creek do a decent metal preload adjuster which is miles better than the generic sram ones.

Good tip - I’ll look out for one of those.

I’ve had a Praxis BB on my hardtail, still going strong and it’s seen a lot of slop. I think they are about £25 from Merlin Cycles. I think it’s a slightly different BB tool though but don’t quote me on that one

Argh, I’ve put a deposit down on the one I’ve ordered in now for £79 (not praxis).

Edit - doesn’t look like Praxis makes a dub / bsa compatible bb so I feel better about that now.

I didn’t think SRAM had ever made a good bottom bracket.
And isn’t the only difference between a Dub and standard one a thin little piece of plastic?

keep us posted when you get this, my sram dub has suddenly started to seize and isnt very old at all, hasnt really been washed (or even ridden) much recently so im a bit stumped as to why, but i will try a wheels one next, never had great life out of the hope 30mm bb i had a few years back either

does the specific dub wheels one come with any spacers? be interesting to see what it needs on a threaded shell, as i cant actually see any instructions for it anywhere....hopefully its just been designed around the standard bsa so no spacers/shims etc required?

I have to admit I’ve got no idea what it comes with or how it works. I don’t even know which bb tool I’ll need to use to tighten it up. Will report back on this thread when I’ve got it in my hands and working out how to fit it. The bike shop (Certini Bristol) have ordered it for me today as it’s not one they hold in stock.

My dub bb has had what I’d think is an average life in terms of conditions - last March / April it did some bridleway / road rides locally so it definitely saw some mud then. Not a clue what it’s done on miles, but it’s one of 2 mtb’s I have and I’ve also got a road bike. Strava is showing my full annual mileage at 2400kms ish at the moment. So let’s say that bike has done a 3rd of that distance or just over - so 800-1000kms - and a lot of it was in the summer.

I've just replaced a SRAM DUB BB on a Spesh Enduro that's done just shy of 3 years and about eleventy hundred Kms on it with a Nukeproof one (all I could get at the time) folks saying they aren't up to much, so we'll see how it gets on.

I replaced a GXP with Praxis and it's lasted ages, good price too.

No dub Praxis bb though that I can find.

When the gxp goes pear shaped on the other bike perhaps I’ll try a Praxis one on there.

Everything about dub BB’s and cranks is terrible. The bearing longevity is a lottery at best , I have seen the NDS bearing fail after just two months on a new bike that had been barely used. Having to crank them up to 58nm is also a terrible idea , if you don’t have a breaker bar and good technique you are buggered when it comes to removing them. The bearings also run directly on the spindle so if you run them when there is play the bearings will score into it and destroy them.

You can replace the bearings on the Sram BB units if you are persistent enough. I did have another mechanic hold a flat head on the lip of the bearing and hit that with a drift to get it out enough to get purchase onto the back of it but it came out easy enough and the new one pressed straight in and ran smooth afterwards. This way you can also put good quality bearings in rather than the cheap originals. I wouldn’t put hope ones in either they are sold as an ‘upgrade’ but are no more durable than the stock bearings.

A lot cheaper also than buying another BB too especially the wheels mfg and hope ones £80!?!!? I have shimano cranks and BB’s are £20 and last at least a year if not more and won’t write off my cranks if I leave it a bit too long before replacing. SRAM definitely should have stuck with 24mm , the bearings are more durable and I’ve never rode down a trail and thought ‘I wish my cranks were stiffer’.

You can replace the bearings on the Sram BB units if you are persistent enough.

Its pretty easy to pull the bearings out of a DUB BB, but they're not standard width and I've never been able to find them aftermarket.

Any pointers on where to find the online?

Google should be able to tell you , I can’t remember the code.

Thats a cop out. I searched extensively and couldn't find any.

It was extensive enough, honestly, that I don't believe your original statement.

Thats a cop out. I searched extensively and couldn’t find any.

It was extensive enough, honestly, that I don’t believe your original statement.

Depends on the DUB BB, but

30x40x7
30x40x6
29x42x7
29x42x6.8

https://www.kineticbikebearings.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=DUB

https://www.hambini.com/bb86-bottom-brackets-with-a-30mm-or-sram-dub-crankset/

lol offering the rantiest idiot on the internet as a gauge isn't really selling anything to me.

Nice one bigyan.

When I was searching a couple of years ago 30x40x6 was absent.

Hambini is a really knowledgeable bloke and has interesting and relevant stuff to say, but you do need to filter out his internet persona. Some people can't get past that.

@scienceofficer how do you know what I have and haven’t done? You are just some random person on the internet. You can’t have looked with much effort , I found it after minimal searching and I don’t even care about it.

If you can't comprehend how I've already answered that question in my responses above, theres not really much else I can say on the matter.

 but you do need to filter out his internet persona

You mean  that time he asked people to comment on a journalist's vagina? Or that other time he encouraged his users to follow (in real life) the same journalist after YouTube took down his video? Or that other time, he cyber-stalked her to see if she'd broken lock-down rules, which resulted in the Police having to go round to his house to have a quiet word. Or that time he wrote two blog posts which included google street views of the same journalists house, and made false accusations about her car...

The man can fairly be described as a dick. I don't think anyone needs to take any notice of his opinions

Two things to sum up this thread don’t buy dub cranks or BB’s and don’t argue with idiots on the internet.

The man can fairly be described as a dick. I don’t think anyone needs to take any notice of his opinions

Agreed, but being a dick is not mutually exclusive of skill, knowledge or experience.

Well this developed since I last looked at it!

Hambini seems to make some sense (I’m not of an engineering background though), but the guy comes across on his online videos as a complete bellend.

What he’s saying about dub bearings in that link seems to make sense to me. But I’ve got dub and so t want to change out a relatively expensive crankset.

If the wheels manufacturing setup doesn’t have better longevity I’ll have to chalk it up to experience and see if the above linked bearings are any better pressed into the dub bb shells.

Some useful stuff on this thread as always from stw (ignoring the handbags at dawn)!

Tbh you'll be swapping the crankset soon enough when the carbon/Alu bond fails

Tbh you’ll be swapping the crankset soon enough when the carbon/Alu bond fails

It’s not Raceface......

We have a crankset ready for the bin due to a now badly scored axle. Just takes one missed seized bearing and you are on a downward slope of ever shorter BB life. It's gutting as I have years old ht2 cranksets and decades old square taper cranksets that are still good. (and get subbed in when something modern like dub fails again).

So much bullshit just comes back to the fact that SRAM realised the only customers that count are the OEMs not us. I don't think any informed buyer would ever buy into a SRAM bb standard from choice- they've never made a decent BB. But stick it on enough new bikes and you've got relatively little choice. And as above, they're not always a cheap component to replace like-for-like, so selling a nice crank with a shite bb cheaply to Specialized makes it very likely you can sell shite bbs pretty expensively for years.

Ironic really that they figured this out off the back of the 15mm axle fiasco where their superior product and standard got killed by OE buyer power. But while learning that lesson they took it as "how to make people repeatedly buy a jobby"

I’ve had good success with Hope BBs with GXP adapters and SRAM or with Shimano cranks. Definitely changed frame and cranks more often than changing bearings - and the same Hope cups and bearings are a constant. Thousands of miles and many years before they need changing - long enough that I don’t think of them as a consumable, they seem so permanent.

I've replaced my DUB Press Fit with a Nukeproof one, due to the fact that they have a 2 year guarantee, which I'll be making use of when that date comes round.

However, I've also set up a regime of taking the cranks off every 200 miles so that the ******* crank bolt doesn't require medieval levels of force to shift it. This seems to be working OK so far.

At the same time I pop the seal off of the BB bearings to repack with grease as the non drive side is feeling less smooth than new after 700 miles ridden since April this year.

@joebristol Has the new BB arrived yet? Did you need a new BB tool? First impressions, worth the money?

Thinking of buying one but can do without having to buy another BB tool

Not yet - I need to ring the lbs and see if they’ve got it in yet. Will come back and update this - also hoping I don’t need yet another bb tool. I’ve got at least 3 already.

Looks like it needs the FSA MegaExo pattern tool. 48.5mm 16 notch type.

@windysurfer

Bb has now arrived - seems ok - has enduro branded bearings in it. I’m goi g to pop the seals off and fill them with waterproof grease to give them the best chance of lasting ok.

Bb looks to have a big spacer like the 4.5mm Sram one which I use with a 73mm bb shell. Also appears to have 2 red rubber seals that go in somewhere. No instructions with it - apparently they’re online so will go hunting for those.

I’ve not checked if any of my tools fit - but it has 16 notches on the cup. That rings a bell so I’m hoping I’ve got one that’ll fit that!

So fitted the wheels manufacturing dub bb today. Instructions are a little bit odd. Generic for 30mm bbs - not dub specifically. Got 2 x 0.5mm spacers, 1x approx 4 or 5mm spacer then a few inbetween.

With the big spacer on the right hand side (ala standard dub bb)when it’s all torqued up the non drive side collar is clamped tight enough it can’t be moved.

So I think that big spacer is too big - tonight I’m going to try one that looks about 2-3mm thick at a guess. I’d rather have a bit of play the take out with the collar than risk binding the bearings / not having the crank arm fully located on the splines.

Just to add to the thread, I've just replaced an Uberbike DUB BB which I haven't had a great deal of miles on.  The driveside bearing was completely shot, I've now stuck a SRAM BB on there that I sourced at a reasonable price to see how that fares.  I won't buy the Uberbike again.

I’ve heard the Uberbike ones aren’t much to write home about - maybe they’re cheap ish bearings 🤷‍♂️

Bearing quality seems ok with the wheels - think they’re enduro bearings with the blue seals. Just not a very thick bearing for large diameter ball bearings in this bsa / dub standard.

Found my sram lower jockey wheel has seized in sympathy for the bb now too. Just ordered a few 626 2rs / llu replacement bearings 🤦‍♂️

I've ordered a new bike, which is scheduled to arrive this week, unfortunately, it also has a SRAM Dub Descendant chainset. The first thing that I'm going to change will be a swap for a set of Shimano XT cranks, not only are they an absolute doddle to install, but the oldest bike in our household has an XT BB that is entering it's second decade of use.

The answer is always to get rid of anything that relies upon SRAM tolerances or a shitty compression fit.

Not only is my Trek a DUB, but it's a Pressfit DUB too !!!

I can't wait for the fun and games.

I’ve heard the Uberbike ones aren’t much to write home about – maybe they’re cheap ish bearings 🤷‍♂️

When I get round to it I'll see if I can get the bearings out and source decent replacements for a reasonable price, the cups still look like new.

Not sure exactly how I get the bearings out though as no instructions I can find.  I'm guessing a hammer and screwdriver to punch them out?

I’ve ordered a new bike, which is scheduled to arrive this week, unfortunately, it also has a SRAM Dub Descendant chainset. The first thing that I’m going to change will be a swap for a set of Shimano XT cranks

I said the same thing when I bought a Spesh Enduro. First DUB BB lasted 3 years and was replaced only a few months ago with a Nukeproof one which is also fine and dandy (so far, only done a few months) Try them before swapping for something else, I've been pleasantly surprised.

Further to this thread, I've replaced my latest failed SRAM Dub BB with a hope 30mm and their dub adapter. So far so good!

@onecheshirecat let us know how that Hope bb goes.

I’ll update on the wheels manufacturing one. Fitted it with the thinner spacer and took up the slack with the collar on the crank. Will see how it goes!

Also managed to replace the bearing in the seized jockey wheel I had on my gx Eagle mech - Wych Bearings got 2 bearings out to me next day even on their standard postage option. Both them and Kinetic are both extremely efficient at dispatching orders I find.