Don’t rugby players get tested for steroids? I’d have thought they were the most obvious abusers.

The ones I trained with in the 80s/90s certainly weren’t tested. Abuse is the wrong word. Steroids were developed in the cold war for sporting use.

the benefits and side effects of EPO could be replicated with better training

Though the major thing with EPO is it facilitates even better training 🙂

It’d be quite handy for multi-week bike trips where you just get so knackered after a while.

Steroids were developed in the cold war for sporting use.

they are natural and have been investigated for over a 100 years

Clearly some of the eastern europeans did wide scale drug missuse to improve performance where as the west left it to athletes to cheat.

Only one runner has got within 1 second of her record set in 1983 for example

I had a pint of it at Cavs Pub in Harrogate at the end of the stage, wasn’t the best beer I’ve ever tasted TBH.

globalti – Member
What are the side effects? I thought EPO had exactly the same effect as training at altitude. You do have to be aware of blood thickening though

That’s a fairly major side effect isn’t it? Didn’t dopers have to sleep wearing a HRM to wake them up if the heart rate dropped to a dangerous level due to blood thickening to have a quick spin on the rollers?

Didn’t dopers have to sleep wearing a HRM to wake them up if the heart rate dropped to a dangerous level due to blood thickening to have a quick spin on the rollers?

I think there were a number of sudden deaths amongst otherwise healthy cyclists in the 80/90s that were later attributed to this.

Thats why, prior to a positive EPO test being developed, the UCI introduced the 50% haemocrit level – it was a “health and safety ” measure.

Didn’t dopers have to sleep wearing a HRM to wake them up if the heart rate dropped to a dangerous level due to blood thickening to have a quick spin on the rollers?

Before testing and when they took massive doses yes. Once testing started, they moved onto micro-dosing which didn’t have the same risks.

I’d probably give a low dose a whirl. Why not? I ride for fun, riding faster/further is more fun.

OK so it’s ‘fake’ fitness, but then that makes riding a bike is just kidding yourself you’re faster than a runner.

Thats why, prior to a positive EPO test being developed, the UCI introduced the 50% haemocrit level – it was a “health and safety ” measure.

Ahhh, Mr ‘50%’ Riis (who IIRC hit 60’something before the limit was introduced)

Can’t remember if it’s Riis or Hamiltons book that went into the details but it all sounds really simple, feeling tired take A, sore take B, and C and D as perscribed. No more dificult than some recovery drink from Torq and a paracetamol.

Ahhh, Mr ‘50%’ Riis (who IIRC hit 60’something before the limit was introduced)

I think his nickname in the peloton was “Mr 60%” 😀

The mind boggles with men who cheat not to even win or win money but merely to elevate their perceived rankings in their cycling club to their peers. Weird.

I personally find it far more mind boggling that there are people who coast through life without a hint of competitiveness, happy to kid themselves they just don’t care. I reckon it’s fear of failure myself.

^hence why his nickname is Mr 60% hahaaa

I’d rather be more interested in how some recreational drugs affected performance on a mtb ride. Like Ectasy for example, but it could go both ways. I’d either have the ride of my life or get distracted by the exquisite beauty of some tree bark or some such.

hey are natural and have been investigated for over a 100 years

True, but for sporting use they were a cold war thing.

Clearly some of the eastern europeans did wide scale drug missuse to improve performance where as the west left it to athletes to cheat.

Use. Not misuse. It wasn’t left to individual athletes in the west, coaches and doctors were the ones leading the development of drug use. Exactly like cycling.

The history of dianabol is an interesting case study. The breakfast of champions.

^hence why his nickname is Mr 60% hahaaa

Not that unusual, I have a friend whose natural haemocrit level is 55% (no doping, just live in Colorado at 2000m asl).

Riis’ was something around 64% at it’s peak and 41% normally….that is unusual! unless you moved to the summit of Everest and did intervals on a turbo for a year I doubt that you’d ever get close to that naturally.

I had a bike accident out in Bolivia, resulting in me being in hospital in La Paz (4500m above sea level I think) for 9 days having already been at altitude for a couple of weeks, it was really frustrating when i got back home with my arm in a sling as the rest of me had never felt better and I had so much energy it was unbelievable.

Is it Graham Obree that was investing in a more portable cheaper altitude chamber for sportsman i think?

oh and is the runner in the photo above Roger Daltrey???

Is it Graham Obree that was investing in a more portable cheaper altitude chamber for sportsman i think?

IIRC yes, for the hour record? But I think it was done by diluting the air in his spare room with more nitrogen rather than reducing pressure.

Also seem to remember the benefits of altitue training were still disputed. If you train at altitude you stress the cardio system but not the muscles, so one theory was you should train at sea level (to make the legs work hard) and sleep at altitude (to improve cario fitness). But others have trained at altitude then competed at sea level.

n.b. it’s not disputed that you feel better after coming down to sea level, the argument was weather you were actualy fitter than if you’d trained at sea level or just felt better because being at altitude was harder.

I thought barometric chambers were banned in cycling (they were quite poplar for a while, you could buy tent kits in the US)?

Google “Dan Staite Drugs cheat”, although he wasn’t 3rd cat. Used to ride with him in local chain gang and he wasn’t *that* good even on juice…

I did. And found this lovely extract from Cycling Weekly:

Staite’s best result this season was second place in the Jock Wadley road race in March, where he was behind Jonathan Tiernan-Locke of Rapha Condor Sharp.

Another rider who’s subsequently been done for PEDs..!

Also seem to remember the benefits of altitue training were still disputed

These guys think it is entirely placebo:

http://sciencenordic.com/altitude-training-little-more-placebo

Back to the “would you” question:

No, though that decision comes after a split-second mental image of me being adonis-like, strong, fit and fast.

Then I remember my views on right and wrong and my attitudes to my fellow (wo)man.

No way.

Then I remember my views on right and wrong and my attitudes to my fellow (wo)man

How would taking PED’s recreationaly affect anyone else? You’d just be able to keep up with your fit mate without the effort, or rather than go out for a 40mile ‘epic’, go out for an 80mile ‘epic’. No one ever records those rides for posterity, they’re not competative, most people just do them for the sake of going for a ride, seeing the views* etc.

*maybe MDMA is a PED in this context

Personally I’d like to be able to train hard every day (weights) but my 43 year old body isn’t so keen. Hence I’d be interested to try HGH and see if that made a difference…

No but I take an iron supplement for a modest benefit. A trained cyclist can expect a 6% increase in performance when taking EPO. Recovery is also improved, so training can be more intensive. Micro-dosing of EPO was a very clever strategy that makes sound Clinical Pharmacology sense (my day job).

Other performance enhancing drugs will be along soon. Google Prolo-hydroxylase inhibitor – which upregulates endogenous EPO production, among other things.

I’ve been thinking about this, being a non racing mountain biker getting fed up of being out of puff

It’s a no because mtb is expensive enough already and drugs are bad mm’kay

The lower your hematocrit naturally the better epo will work

As a cycling commuter I’m not sure I want to arrive at the office 10 mins earlier..

I think I would be really reluctant trying it due to potential side effects

the feeling of fitness feeling after 3 weeks at altitude.

This ^^ does make a difference. I live at 6300 ft and ride in the 6000-9000 ft elevation range weekly and when I go down and ride at a much lower altitude, my energy level feels like it did 25 years ago.

Answering now, iPad in hand with a beer in front of the telly I would have to say ‘no’. Ask me when I’m gasping and sweating up a climb on a group ride where everyone seems to be having a good day and I’m not, then I might say otherwise.

On a serious note, I don’t think risking having blood so thick that my ticker expires just trying to pump it around is an acceptable price to pay for not suffering a bit on the climbs.