good point well put.

No, as much as I like the country, the people and their lifestyle the thought of sharing my place with a huntsman spider puts me off somewhat. And I’d miss my friends and family too much.

I’m in a dilemma about this myself

my fiancee is Australian, here on a 2 year working visa, which means she has to go back april 2012

plan is for me to apply for a proposed spouse visa and go back there with her for a few years, but I really don’t like the place

too hot, everything is trying to kill you which completely ruins any outdoors time for me, definitely too hot for mountain biking, although I probably wouldn’t be going anyway because of all the snakes, spiders etc, a lot of racism over there, and a lot of beer swilling party animal backwards people, which just isn’t my scene. Also no culture and no history, and not much character to the place.

several pople at my place of work have, one with family had never even been to Oz and upped and left! he did lots of research beforehand on expat sites and forums and rented his property in the UK whilst deciding if it really was for them, plus his UK employer would have taken him back – he’s not returned

Moved here 6 years ago…live in freshwater, sydney. We bought a house, at great expense, about 300m from the beach. Now surf most days, a good riding and racing scene, access to trails is good but not as easy as UK but plenty to keep all riding styles entertained. The coffee is excellent, schools are great, our son was born here and is having a fantastic time growing up, beach, bikes, bush walks, holidays to whitsundays, NZ…..so much to do!! Work is not easy, aussies and in particular sydney workers have a strong work ethic….be prepared to put in the hours and dont whinge about it….nobody likes a whinging pom!!
I look back and think we made the smart move, my job in Bristol engineering consultancy would have been at risk and I probably would have lost it…so i’m glad i avoided all that here.

Will we come back, i’m not sure…we miss things but as has been said nothing that you cant replace or do without. Would i miss the adopted lifestyle, i think so…..weather is good, the beach and coastal walks, not to mention the coffee are great.

I moved out with all expenses paid, job lined up etc, it was a no brainer…if you dont like it you can always move back…go for it!!!!

Some folk on here seem to me to have rather odd ideas about both the heat and the wildlife

Australia is a huge place and has several climate zones – some are distinctly temperate. It even snows up in the hills. You soon get used to the heat even in the hot parts in the hot seasons. Little rain is nice.

The wildlife – I spent the best part of a year there – most of it spent sleeping rough in the bush – I didn’t see a single nasty beastie.

Neither of these two things would worry me. Now its a good while since I was there and I am sure things have changed but I would miss the green hills, I would miss the easy access to Europe, I would miss decent beer and nice pubs, I would miss winter. I found the Australians to be very provincial, small minded and racist. Things may be better now but thats is how I found it.

The wildlife – I spent the best part of a year there – most of it spent sleeping rough in the bush – I didn’t see a single nasty beastie.

I’m never sure why people go on about it so much, I have a friend who says she could never go because of the spiders but happily travels to the US. Where I used to live in the US we regularly used to find Brown Recluses all around the house and Black Widows in the toilet.

Coming back to the OP, I wouldn’t choose to live there. It’s not right for me. My sister emigrated with her boyfriend around 3 years ago to Melbourne and loves it there and has since had a child. She is very much a city person though, so I can see why she likes Melbourne much more than than London where she previously lived. I have relatives in Sydney, Darwin and Perth also (my mum’s family were ten pound poms) so it’s not the lack of family. I can’t say it’s the distances as I’d love to move to the US which is equally vast (admittedly not so empty in the middle). I just didn’t see the appeal, and I this is different for different people.

I didn’t really see people living the outdoor lifestyle either, in Sydney it was winter fair enough, but in Darwin people just run from one air conditioned place to another. I spent a day cycling on a wonderfully built cycleway along the coast, complete with saltwater swimming pools for cooling off (can’t swim in the sea so these are filtered for jellyfish) and never saw a soul.

I think some people are mixing up moving to Australia with a change of lifestyle alongside moving to the seaside or a place with good outdoor possibilities.

What is your family history of criminality? C’mon someone had to say it!

Is it still necessary?

Just been (only for three weeks mind), loved it. If you have chance go for a few months before committing, try it out. BIt tricky if commit fully then don’t like it…

TandemJeremy – Member
…The wildlife – I spent the best part of a year there – most of it spent sleeping rough in the bush – I didn’t see a single nasty beastie.

… I found the Australians to be very provincial, small minded and racist.

Dunno why people worry about the “deadly” animals in Oz. The only one that actively will hunt you is a salt water croc. Anything else is an accident.

As far as provincial, small-minded, and racist, I reckon much less so than over here. They are more likely to speak their minds though. For example, you’ll not find the level of bigotry and hatred that’ll you’ll find in say Glasgow or N.I.

epicyclo – I did spend a lot of time in small settlements in the outback – and it was a while ago but that is how I found them.

spent a year there. lived in melbourne/perth/broome/brisbane for substatial periods and spent a lot of time camping out in the bush.

some of the stuff people are saying on here is a pile of crap.

spider/snakes/bugs that will eat you alive…yeah there are dangerous animals out there but you generally don’t see em and they’re way more scared of you. would not base any decision on whether to move there permanently on the likes of this. wildlife in general out there is simply thriving, be it bats, skinks, kangaroos, sealife, kowalas, birds + all the dangerous insects and reptiles. embrace it rather than be scared of it, they’re just animals. not many people die from bites & stings.

poor public transport infrastructure (hence all the cars) in the uber uber mega suburbs

melbourne & sydney have amongst the best networks in any city i have been to.

like here, there are a lot of people who are into all sorts of different stuff. there are a lot of people who live active, outdoorsy lifestyles but on the flipside there are equally as many who are lazy, binge drink & have never left their own city, nevermind state.

there is a lot of culture. a very strong music scene, lots of art everywhere; from street art to aboriginal cave art stretching back a year or two. massivley diverse in terms of the build of the population in general – huge influences from europe and asia & lots of pacific islanders (inc. NZ). great food. great wine. great beers (lots of microbreweries).

proximity to europe is crap, but equally (if not more) diverse when you look at what is on offer in oz itself and it’s local countries (SE Asia & pacific holidays etc).

i wouldn’t live in queensland if i were to move out there permanently, nor would i live in adelaide. QL is a great holiday destination but very touristy & no surfing etc because of the stingers – wouldn’t be content not being able to use the sea properly on an island as amazing as this. adelaide is a nice city & great food but too quiet for me, although i can imagine the riding with in SA is pretty fine/amongst the best the country has to offer.

melbourne is a great city to live in. very diverse & multicultural – up there with sydney. loads of excellent bars & restaurants & an excellent music scene. victoria has the biggest mountains & ski areas in oz, great surf on the south coast although a bit of a drive from the city itself. more of a temperate climate…i.e. it’s bloody cold in the winter. great location for cheap flights to NZ & east coast for hols. loved every minute i was there.

Perth/SW Oz – far from the busiest city on the planet, it sometimes feels like it’s dead after about 1am on a weekend. still enough to keep you entertained if you were after more of a family lifestyle. margaret river area is really beautiful, must be some great trails inland and surf is top notch. WA in general is an amazing place & people on this side really do tend to live the ‘outdoorsy’ lifestyle. when i was in broome you’d see friends & family driving down to the beaches in the 4×4’s and spend the night there fishing, drinking beers, having bbqs, surfing together. i spent about 4 months there with no tv, living in a tent & spending my time either working on the bar or at the beach. so really good place to holiday.

so would i move there to any of these places? probably if i had the opportunity and it felt right. i’d be pretty choosy about where though. probably back to the melbourne area…you can holiday everywhere else 8)

I lived outback quite some time in mining/pastoral towns and found it as I said. Hard men, but straightforward. The Australian belief in a fair-go usually transcends any latent racism.

(Can’t speak for the city types though)

oh, and unfortunately there is a lot of racism in oz towards the aboriginals. but they don’t really help themselves, very few have intergrated into modern society. not that it is their fault really as they were treated badly since the first european settlers, but then so were the maori. there are very few aboriginal tribes living in traditional ways, the majority live on the outside of both societies that exist on the continent.

The Maori were a lot more organised and cohesive as a society than the Aboriginals were, which is why they got themselves a better deal iirc.

peachos – Member
oh, and unfortunately there is a lot of racism in oz towards the aboriginals. but they don’t really help themselves, very few have intergrated into modern society…

They do help themselves, and there are many integrated into modern society, so they are not noticeable.

Unfortunately there are a few who are spectacular alcoholic ferals and they stick out like dog’s thingies, and many people think they are representative. But their numbers are a very small proportion.

The ferals remind me of Scottish tinkers of about 30-40 years ago.

What is with the wildlife comments? We have redbacks in the backyard, but know where they are likely to be, so are careful in those spots.

I have still yet to see a snake – of any level of poisoning – when riding or walking in over 4 years.

Koalas, Roos, sure. Kookaburas, hear them heaps.

Biggest problem with wildlife is the bloody swooping magpies in spring!

Too hot to ride? Yes, in the middle of summer, in the middle of the day, it can be (dependent on where you are). And dependent on wind etc too, firebans are imposed and forests etc are closed for the day, just in case. But for most of us, 5 days a week that doesn’t matter as you are in work anyway! You just go early or late, no worries.

Peachos – you don’t list Adelaide as a place you spent considerable time; I can tell you now, Adelaide has much more “happening” than Perth and you rate that pretty highly.

Those that comment on the trails stuff; yes, access is currently “restrictive”, but it is also a very big deal over here and one that is swinging in MTBs favour thanks to the likes of IMBA-Aus. I truly don’t find it an issue that would prevent me from riding, and the situation will only get better in the next few years a more and more parks are opened up. Its similar to the footpath/bridleway thing at home – a bit of an outdated, joke of a situation, but one that is best dealt with “properly” so it doesn’t come back to bite us later on.

Someone mentioned beer… this is just the same as UK; big breweries generally put out a fairly bland range. Smaller/microbrews are excellent, however.

The family & friends issue is so individual… however, facebook, skype, email, phone make it easy enough to stay in touch if you want to; visiting? well, it’s more effort, true, but in someways no more so difficult than moving from London to Edinburgh, for example, just a bit more costly. I work it so that I see my folks once every 18-24 months – and we alternate who travels so that it is a break when yo do it, but you don’t use all the holiday time that you have so you can still do NZ/SE Asia/Pacific/etc.

I still maintain there is culture – sure, it isn’t the same as Europe, but then again its not Europe, so go figure!

The Maori were a lot more organised and cohesive as a society than the Aboriginals were, which is why they got themselves a better deal iirc.

A better deal for whom exactly – we seem to be paying for it multiple times over depending on this decades latest whim.

As a long term ex-pat with thoughts of moving back to the UK heres my 2c (which is worth more than it used to be):
1) if you are family oriented with an extended family in the UK you will find it hard, distance is a difficult thing esp. if something happens
2) Better to regret something you have tried than something you haven’t
3) Accept that life is life, you’ll have the same sh1t in a different hemisphere. Don’t fight it.
4) Embrace the change, lots of whingeing poms whinge because they don’t move with an open mind. Do that and you will find the positives.

I’d say give it a whirl, i travel to Oz a lot (am in Melbourne next week) and while I wouldn’t necessarily live there as I like Wellington too much its a great place, very diverse.

Have lived in Fremantle for the past 15 months. (WA, just south of Perth)

Amazing.

“Cold” winter days at 20c. Sun shines 99% of the time. Even when it was 40c on Christmas day it was not actually that hot. It’s a dry heat. Very do-able.

Barbecues, beaches (and stunning beaches at that). Turquoise waters, fresh afternoon breezes.

Lots of road cycling but some pretty decent off road too.

GREAT pay.

Spiders? Yeah, occassionally. Redbacks, huntsmen. Not really a problem. We do get HUGE cockroaches and the bull ants are everywhere. Can deal with that.

The longer we stay away from the UK the harder it is to go back. We miss friends and family but Ozzies are friendly and welcoming.

Do it. What’s the worst that could happen? You either like it and stay, or don’t like it and go home. Simples.

aphex_2k what is your job area?

Great pay?

All the aussies I’ve spoken to here say they are here to get lots of money because the pay is so much better here. They save up a big house deposit and move back.

Depends where you go in Oz.

Best money for an ordinary guy is out west or remote areas in mining. I saved a 50% deposit on a house just off the beach in less than 3 years. Single guys saved even more by living in barracks.

Strange Molgrips – my job pays a lot more over there – all depends on the job/demand situation rather than the geographical factors.

What job is it then?

Quantity Surveyor, seems like a lot of construction professionals are valued more highly overseas than in the UK, and that’s regardless of the overiding economic situation.

Much as I don’t care for moving to Australia, all this talk is stimulating my urge to head overseas for a while 🙂

Anyone need a Java/Business rules developer?

Great pay?

All the aussies I’ve spoken to here say they are here to get lots of money because the pay is so much better here. They save up a big house deposit and move back.

Well, I doubled my salary, and Claire’s went up more than 2 promotion grades in the NHS. As a relatively junior research scientist, I’m now on more than a prof would be back in the UK, and I don’t even need a beard…

Ask some UK Aussies why they are here then.. Could be interesting.

Not saying you are wrong but it does seem to be heavily industry dependent.

Well, but my wife and I aren’t in exactly high-paying industries (Health and Science Research, respectively), and we seem to be doing quite well here. Certainly better than back home, and Claire works for a charity here!

For sure, some people are probably on crap wages. But with the minimum wage here over $10 I think, it’s not that bad. On the other hand, cost of living is higher than anywhere out of London / Ed / Dublin in the British Isles, but in most cases, the wages seem to make up for it. I’m currently looking at buying Claire a piano. In the UK, this wouldn’t have happened for two reasons: 1) too expensive, 2) house big enough far too expensive. Here on our (by Australian standards) modest salaries, neither appears to be an issue

molgrips – the aussie dollar has shot up in the last year or two (almost on par with US), however the “aussie in London” is generally doing it on the cheap ( 1 bed flat, 5 people as my wife did; the other 4 were blokes, and only one bed ! 😯 ) so what they do save is more than it may be living a “regular” life in Aus.

There is also the travel etc that is attractive too.

Lets put it this way; My wife works, I’m stay at home parent; there is no way in hell we could do this in London. Over here we do it and over-pay our mortgage payment by 100% each month, still have ‘treats’ most times we want them.

langy – don’t push the barrow too hard.

I don’t want the place full of whingeing Poms by the time I get back 🙂

I don’t want the place full of whingeing Poms by the time I get back

Give it a couple of months and it’ll be full of whingers alright, just not poms. The natives have been sulking for months now that there may be one or two South African born players in the England squad that may just give them a thrashing shortly…

If you think English football fans are bad, this lot take poor losing and poorer winning to new heights!

Do they riot in historic European towns, singing vile racist songs?

worked in qld for a year 1999-00, loved it . Plan was come back finish medical training then go back. within a week of returning met my wife to be and everything changed!! no regrets mind.

Loads of pluses for aus, weather, lifestyle slower pace of life etc. However if you are a homebird or are really close to your family (or your wife’s)then it may not work. Remember work is work wherever you may be!

zokes – Member
…there may be one or two South African born players in the England squad that may just give them a thrashing shortly…

Good to see the English squad getting some real men in….

Might give them a chance 🙂

Conqueror – Member
aphex_2k what is your job area?

I work in a psychiatric unit. I’m on about 60k AUD here, plus something called Salary Sactifice. Basically I get a credit card and $350 a fortnight goes onto this card, before tax. So I get taxed on a smaller amount and $350 a fortnight tax free. In the UK I’d be on 25k, but I’m earning the equivalent of about 40k here.

Having said that, I’m coming home for a couple of years as my wife’s pregnant, then we’ll emigrate fully. I really like it here.

Lived there for 2 years and wouldnt go back, just find Australians pretty objectionable, I was lucky enough to visit most parts and work in some incredible places.

Amusing sporting comments from before ‘the event’:

Good to see the English squad getting some real men in….

Might give them a chance

Looks like it did 😆 😆 😆

just find Australians pretty objectionable

Apart from when they’re loosing or winning a sport, why?

Been back in the UK nearly 4 months now. We’re arranging to go back to Perth. We will miss family but we’ll be able to come back every 12 months for a “holiday”.

I miss so much about Oz. Friend’s telling me it’s been the hottest October since ever..35.6c the other day. After 2 years in Oz getting down to 3c at the end of a night shift in Shropshire the other day was a shock to the system. Ice on windscreens? Yuck!

“bring me suuuun-shiiiiine”

Oz? No chance, people are always getting shanked, savagely bummed, or beaten to death in the gym.