be nice…

we made the mistake of thinking we needed a bigger car so last December we bought a 1.8 zetec sport petrol Focus, nice car but the MPG is crap only about 32mpg and the wife now hates it as its too big. she used to use our old faithful 1.4tdci fiesta (which i now use)

anyway due to the car being big, tax £180 (fiesta £60) and crap mpg she want’s shot of it. combined i say we only do about 14k a year milage.

we paid 6k for it and it has FSH and 24,000 on the clock.

i know its a mine field, petrol cheaper than diesel but you get more miles out of a diesel etc, petrol higher tax/emissions…

would you keep it for the long haul?

i doubt (as she thinks) a garage would take a straight swap for something slightly older/more milage in a diesel.

i did think of trying to flog it on autotrader/ebay, then buy something but to be honest i cant be bothered as i had a bad experience years ago selling private.

cheers

They would swap, but it would be to their advantage (of course)…
You would see your car on the forecourt the next week at about 25% markup, but that’s how they make a living!
We got money back after a px, but we did down grade…

DrP

I have made direct swaps with cars before and even got a new car and cash back in exchange for a car. They do it all the time.

go for it, they can only say no – 32MPG sounds pretty good to me!

cheers all, one garage has a 2006 fiesta 1.4tdci, new model of our one for £4750 with 66k on the clock. im sure he would go for that but i guess it would be suicide for us?

i may look for another slighly better mileage one, i guess i can only ask… bloody knew we shouldnt have gone big!

Yes they would, but you’d get the px price for your car (~25% than you probably paid)and pay full price on the ‘new’ one.

Stick it on ebay, completely honest description, loads of photos, get back 90% of what you paid for it, and buy another tdci fiesta (smaller/diesel so should ballance out) with similar miles if thats what she likes? It’ll take you 4 years at least to make any money back on a more economical car swaping at a dealer.

FWIW I just bought a 1.6 petrol C-max, 33000 miles, FSH for £5k, done about 34mpg so far (60/30 motorway/other split).

My dad’s 11 plate focus 1.6 sport does 42mpg, mostly country roads…

monkey_boy – Member

be nice…

we made the mistake of thinking we needed a bigger car so last December we bought a 1.8 zetec sport petrol Focus, nice car but the MPG is crap only about 32mpg and the wife now hates it as its too big.

Lots of stop start traffic? I get a calculated (not from on board computer) 40+ mpg with reasonably careful driving and 35+ even when making progress.
They are a fairly large car, but actually not an awful lot larger than the current shape Fiesta.

At those kind of prices you’ll probably have to be prepared to lose £1k in the deal with the dealer. They will give you a swap but it will definitely not be something equal in value.

The new car is now worth £1k less, the values will get closer the older it gets but there’s always going to be a negative value for the new car.

Guessing there’s about 10-15mpg difference in your two cars. Petrol is still a good bit cheaper than diesel. Presuming you do half your miles each year in each car that’s 7k. My poor maths brings the focus out at £1072pa (@32mpg and £1.30) against £812pa (@45mpg and £1.38) please note my maths aren’t great and this only includes fuel!!

Diesels notoriously don’t like short journies (guessing by the poor mpg of the focus it does a few of them) as they take longer to get up to temperature so more likely to have problems.

If it was me I wouldn’t make that swap although it always seems like it’ll be cheaper when the petrol car is at the fuel pumps more often.

If you’re into biking you can never have a big enough car – must be easier for you to get bikes and gear into the Focus?

32MPG sounds pretty good to me!

Sounds crap to me.

My dad’s 11 plate focus 1.6 sport does 42mpg, mostly country roads…

Not knocking it, but how accurate are his records? The trip computer isn’t accurate. I’ve got 11,000 miles of proper fuel records for our 55 reg 1.6 Focus Estate. Average is 39.10mpg but the last 3 months is:

Untitled by PeterPoddy, on Flickr

(And you can see the best! 🙂 )
That said, I’m VERY good at not using fuel!

I’ve done a quick calculation on the back on an excel spreadsheet and assuming 7k miles per car in a year and the Fiesta averages 50 mpg. All other costs being equal, then it costs £542 per year more to run the Mondeo. (I can email the sheet if you want it)

I estimate you’d lose about 1-1.5k on a swap deal and end up with an older higher mileage car with the potential costs that brings.

You didn’t mention why you wanted a bigger car originally, but I think if I was driving children/mountain bikes around, I’d prefer to be in the Mondeo.

Poddy is the worlds biggest MPG geek, I just knew he would post 😆

As above sell it privately, you’ll definetaly get more back that way.

I dream of getting 32 MPG, maybe a different driving style? Petrols need to be driven very differently from diesels.

PP, is that the newer 115ps Ti-VCT engine or the older 100ps?

And did the computer over or under read?

My C-max just about does 39-40 on the computer if I drive like theres egg shells on the pedals, 34-35 doing a more normal middle lane/outer lane 70-85mph.

PP I dunno how accurate it is. However it’s consistent with your figures I reckon. Engine might be a bit improved, not sure (certainly a different beast to the one in their 53 fiesta) and they almost exclusively drive open country roads fairly gently. Country being actual countryside with correspondingly empty roads not the busy stuff you have in Hampshire 😉

Poddy is the worlds biggest MPG geek, I just knew he would post

Tis true. 🙂

PP, is that the newer 115ps Ti-VCT engine or the older 100ps?

And did the computer over or under read?

It’s the older 100ps, to be honest I’d expect to get a bit more from the newer one. It over reads by around 2mpg.

Molgrips, the recent driving I’ve been doing is 90% motorway. The dip in that graph is our holiday when we had a load of camping gear inside and did a lot of countryside driing around the Peaks and Northumberland 🙂

We have only gone off the onboard computer, last month we drove from Belfast to cork mostly on motorways and it gave us 32.4mpg. I read on a ford forum that you should never trust the computers, ours has the 17” wheels and they reckon the computer calculates off the 16” standard wheels???

it think we just had a big shock coming from the fiesta where you would bang £20 in and it would last over a fortnight!

We really should do the full proper test and fill it right up then empty it and take note of mileage etc then fill it backup.

I might just go to the garages just to see what they will offer, I know were going to loose out a bit but you never know.

cheers

We really should do the full proper test and fill it right up then empty it and take note of mileage etc then fill it backup

One tank is not especially accurate as not all pumps stop at the same point.

Best thing is to do as PP does and log many tankfuls over time. Only needs be three or four though, but you most likely won’t be able to isolate different kinds of driving that way.

Wow, my 2.0 Subaru Legacy has averaged 31.8 since Oct 2009, and that’s driven enthusiastically for the most part! On a motorway trip, it’s nudging 40 mpg… Surely the focus should be doing more than what you’re getting? have Ford seen it and done any diagnostics?

In your cost to change calcs, your effective loss going from the focus to something else is going to buy many years (4-5 years at least) of the price differential in petrol, so be careful of justifying the change on the basis of cost.

(PS. I’m probably similarly mpg geek like to PP, but I only have the ‘Lite’ version of Road Trip, not the paid for app 🙂 )

Petrols need to be driven very differently from diesels.

My D achieves best MPG while pootling at near-zero throttle at 55mph. My petrol achieves best MPG driven briskly, but not quickly, and still achieves half the mpg at 55 😀

Another thought:

Get it up on the STW classifieds and your local Gumtree for a straight swap. A lot of people will want to swap something Fiesta sized to Focus sized when kiddies come along. Better deal than you’d get at a garage.

My D achieves best MPG while pootling at near-zero throttle at 55mph. My petrol achieves best MPG driven briskly, but not quickly, and still achieves half the mpg at 55

See, I think the opposite. Diesels have bugger all low in the rev range and such poor throttle response you need to keep them in the powerband. Whilst a (Normally aspirated) petrol engine will pull from tickover in 5th if you want it to at the merest whiff of throttle. In traffic I don’t need much over 1500rpm a lot of the time in our Focus, I just trickle around on zero throttle, low speed, leaving a BIG gap so I don’t have to stop, and staying off the brakes….

My Mother in Law has a diesel Eos, 140bhp, and I can get well within 5mpg of what that gets in the Focus at legal road speeds

pp – what was that MPG app for the iphone? looks nerdy – i like nerdy 🙂

David, it’s called Road Trip. Does lots more than MPG as well…. Although that’s really all i use it for.

[nerd]
That and tyre wear rates
[/nerd]
🙂

Diesels have bugger all low in the rev range and such poor throttle response you need to keep them in the powerband

Don’t listen to him! Power in my car starts from the point below which you should not be driving anyway due to oil pressure, ie about 1200 rpm. I really ought to give you a lift and demonstrate.

My Mother in Law has a diesel Eos, 140bhp, and I can get well within 5mpg of what that gets in the Focus at legal road speeds

So your MIL can’t drive. I get 52mpg in my larger more powerful automatic Passat, so your 42 looks rubbish from where I am sitting 🙂

So your MIL can’t drive.

So you know her then?

I get 52mpg in my larger more powerful automatic Passat, so your 42 looks rubbish from where I am sitting

It probably does, but I’m still only 8.2mpg off your figure at my best…. 😛

That Eos is HEAVY though. It’s like driving a car made of lead. I had it on the ‘bridge at work once, can’t remember if it went over the 50t capacity or not right now…. 😉

And there’s **** ALL power below 1600-1700rpm, and it tails off rapidly after about 4000rpm. I’ve ridden 2 stoke 125s with wider powerbands!!

EDIT
Sorry. I have a ‘thing’ about that car. I’ve driven it a lot when the MiL is in Australia (She leaves it with us for months at a time) and some of it it BRILLIANT, but some of it is UTTER CRAP

+
The best OEM car stereo I’ve ever heard
Driving with the roof down
Cruise contol
Heated Leather

–
Daft controls (Why have a seperate heated mirror switch? Why no steering wheel radio controls??)
Wrong engine.
Traction control. TURN IT OFF!
Brakes. This is the worst bit. They scare me shitless. No power at all. Nasty.

It probably does, but I’m still only 8.2mpg off your figure at my best.

Or 20%.

And there’s **** ALL power below 1600-1700rpm, and it tails off rapidly after about 4000rpm

Honestly.. that’s not how it is in my car… I guarantee that there’s a wider powerband in my car than any petrol that does 50mpg.

Why have a seperate heated mirror switch?

So you can operate it independently of the rear window. It dries water off your mirrors which is useful even when your rear window is not misted. Saves power not having to use them both.

Why no steering wheel radio controls??)

Ask her, it’s an option!

Traction control. TURN IT OFF!

You can. Although one wonders why you need it off when driving normally….

Molgrips, is it the same engine as the Eos, the 140bhp 2.0TDi?

Maybe it’s retuned for the auto ‘box or maybe the auto masks the turbo lag…..?

Ask her, it’s an option!

Should be standard fit on a, what, £23,000 car. That’s just poor.

You can. Although one wonders why you need it off when driving normally

I do. When I remember to. I don’t drive very fast these days, but nor do I slow down much for roundabouts* (Keep the speed up, less acceleration = more MPG!) and if I’ve left it on, the bloody thing lurches round like it’s pissed or the front tyres have fallen off. Far too intrusive IMO. Turn it of an it goes round at the same (Or greater) speed like it’s on rails. It just griiiiiiips!

*Not with those brakes. God they are shocking. Did I mention that…? 😉

3 quid – thats two litres of fuel or approximately 60 miles!

Depends on how old it is, mine’s pre-2008 so has a PD engine, that’s probably a CR.

There’s no turbo lag above about 1800rpm really. And between that and 1200rpm there’s so little that you only notice it if you are extremely rough with the pedals.

The auto makes things worse actually, because it can get confused and dither about a bit if you aren’t selecting manually – and it’s a disaster when pulling out of junctions because it won’t let the revs go high enough to get going for a second or two.

the bloody thing lurches round like it’s pissed or the front tyres have fallen off

😯

You must be going much faster than me then… Never got the ESP to cut in.

might give the free app a whirl actually.

Depends on how old it is,

Can’t remember. About 2008 I think. She’s had it a while.

There’s no turbo lag above about 1800rpm really

No, it’s not too bad, but there’s a distinct pause when changing gear. If it was a person it would be a mild stutter that you only notice when they are angry!
You really do notice the shortcomings when switching from a petrol engine. Sure, the diesel is faster (as it should be with 40% more power and 400cc more capacity) but it’s like being given a massive sandwich, for free….. that’s got sand in it: Nice, but if I bought one I’d take it back for a refund.
Dynamically, it’s flawed.
Oh, and it rattles too much for me, but that’s mostly the roof

might give the free app a whirl actually.

yeah, that’s probably just as good for fuel.

Dynamically, it’s flawed.

That depends on your expectations, doesn’t it? A sandy sandwich would be inedible, a TDI is still driveable perfectly rapidly.

That depends on your expectations, doesn’t it?

Yep. I expect better than it is.
To be fair, lop 1/4tonne or more off it and stick a 3 litre V6 in it and it’d be nearly perfect, dynamically.

You’d still have to sort the brakes though…..

And yes, you could eat a sandy sandwich, but would you enjoy it?

It’d be a TT then wouldn’t it? 🙂

Yep. I expect better than it is.

Based on what though? Other better TDIs? Other 50mpg cars? Comparing it to most petrols is apples and oranges really.

It’d be a TT then wouldn’t it?

You need to get out of this VAG group thinking!

I was sort of alluding to one of these

With one of these in it

Based on what though? Other better TDIs? Other 50mpg cars? Comparing it to most petrols is apples and oranges really

[Clarkson mode]

It’s a convertible ‘sports’ car. Therefore it’s primary functions are to make you feel special, to look good, and be exciting to drive.

It’s not a bad looking car, and it improves with the roof down. Putting the roof down at the traffic lights is COOOOOL! The leather is lovely, the stereo fantastic. TC off it handles well.
But then you hear the engine, like a skeleton having a w**k in a biscuit tin, and once you’ve lurched your way round a roundabout, and floored it down the road (Pausing at every gear change) you get to the next roundabout and find yourself screaming STOOOOOP YOU BAAASSSTARRRD!! as you heave with all your might on the ineffective brakes before lurching round the next roundabout having been to preoccupied with turbo lag and your impending visit to the pearly gates to remember to turn it off!

[Clarkson mode]

Ok.. it’s not exactly a convertible sports car, it’s a convertible sporty-ish coupe for starters.

The thing is, it is available with nice petrol engines. The diesel is simply an option for those who want something slightly sporty with an open top but still some semblance of fuel economy (like me). You can’t blame the whole car just because ONE of the engines is not what you would spec….

Comparing it with a 3l V6 equipped car isn’t really like for like.

Oh and if every gear changes results in a pause you’re definitely doing it wrong. Turbo should never even spool down.

To the OP… What was your bad experience selling private? Honestly, man up, sell the car private, stick at least £1k more in your back pocket than you’d get offered from a dealer for it, then go buy something more suitable. If you try to do a straight swap, accept you’re going to be offered about £2k less than what you paid for your Focus (so about £4k probably), then the car they’ll be trying to sell you for £4k will be at least £500-1000 more expensive than if you bought it elsewhere. In other words, the salesman that dealt with you that day would be getting a BIG bonus that month!!! Sell it private, buy something else more suitable, move on and forget the matter…

To the others talking about MPG… Road Trip (I’ve got the full paid for app too, but lite works just fine) is excellent, I’ve been a geeky nerd like PP and been using it now for, pretty much since it came out. I’ve done over 20k miles in the last year at least, every penny of fuel logged onto it. Well worth using.

As far as the OP’s current car MPG is concerned, it’s perhaps a little late for him now, but it’s weird how 2 different engines in the same car can be so different. Despite being only a longer stroke version of the same engine, the 1.8 petrol in the Focus is known to be a LOT worse on fuel than the 1.6, quite incredible really as there’s not a huge amount of power difference. I remember borrowing a 52 plate original Focus pool car with the 1.6 petrol for a few days in an old job, put 600 miles on it with my foot mostly hard to the floor. Did 40.9mpg over those 600 miles!!!

Oh, and why oh why are some (mainly VW/Audi group cars, BMW’s seem to be a lot better) in car MPG trip meters so wildly inaccurate? The meter in my Audi A4 tells me I’m averaging 42.5mpg at the moment, but Road Trip on my iPhone tells me it’s under 37mpg!!! WTF is that about? That’s like 15% or so inaccurate! Wish it was more like 42.5 to be fair, though given it’s a 2.5 V6 TDi with Quattro, and the book quotes 35.8mpg on the combined cycle, I suppose I should be happy that I’m at least beating the book figures…

it’s not exactly a convertible sports car, it’s a convertible sporty-ish coupe for starters.

Same thing. Same purpose. I did put ‘sports’ in commas too, Mr Pedantic. To me a true Sports (no commas) car is rear wheel drive.

Comparing it with a 3l V6 equipped car isn’t really like for like.

I never said it was. I said it would be better dynamically like that. And it would. I’m right and you know it. 😛

Oh and if every gear changes results in a pause you’re definitely doing it wrong. Turbo should never even spool down.

Bullpoo.
Tell me, pretty please, what am I doing wrong? I can’t physically swap cogs any faster. That’s as fast as I can move the lever, loosing as few revs as possible, with the slightest dip of the clutch. I never said the turbo spooled down, you said that…..

If that’s wrong, you tell me sunshine! 🙂