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  • Wood burning stoves/open fires – are they such a good idea??
  • robdob
    Free Member

    I love open fires, I really do. I grew up with them and they somehow provide heat in such a great way compared to central heating. One day I’d like a house with some sort of open fire/woodburner, or maybe have one fitted.

    However something struck me as I was cycling through some small villages near Todmorden/Hebden Bridge on Sat (see http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/my-longest-day-off-road-with-pics for the ride I did).

    When I rode out from my house in Huddersfield (HD1 code) the air was fresh and clean despite me being in an urban area with cars around etc. When I was riding through a couple of these villages, no cars around, mixture of smaller cottages and bigger uber-expensive farmhouses, the air was awful. I could smell coal and logs being burnt in equal amounts as I rode through the streets, and it certainly wasn’t somewhere I’d like to live if just for the air quality alone, breathing in all those smoky fumes in when I went out.

    Now I admit this won’t be the case all year round, and the access to the countryside is ace and they are such beautiful places to live. But could there be a Victorian level of air quality in these rural villages, depsite them being in the middle of the countryside?

    bokonon
    Free Member

    I doubt that you are looking at “Victorian Level’s of air quality” due to these fires – at that point all heating and everything else was done with wood – so it’s not going to be that bad, in addition, there are less obvious pollutants which are going to be in the city centre from cars etc. however – this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3541469/ would suggest there is a positive impact on mortality to be had from a decrease in “biomass smoke”.

    jfletch
    Free Member

    It’s a “nice” smell though, evoking thoughs of cozy nights by the fire after a winters day in the cold, so people are more tollerant of it. Therefore they don’t assume it can be harmful.

    globalti
    Free Member

    Have a look at all those chimney pots on top of those old houses and think what it would have been like when coal was cheap and so was the cost of having a servant running around the house all day with buckets keeping all the fires lit. On top of that it would have been regular coal, not smokeless. Just because you get the odd waft of coal or wood smoke doesn’t mean the air is polluted! Don’t forget that your nose is specially attuned to smoke and very sensitive when outdoors.

    robdob
    Free Member

    Yeah I know it was probably a lot worse many years ago – “Victorian” is probably stretching it a bit. But it wasn’t just an odd whiff here and there, it was really quite bad. I have to do odour monitoring as part of my job so I’m pretty good as distinguishing what smells are and assessing how strong they are.

    I just thought it was a bit weird that people might move there because of the fresh country air and half the year get the opposite!

    konagirl
    Free Member

    Although I see Globalti’s point, that we are not talking about the levels of pollution seen prior to the Clean Air Act, smoke is a pollutant. And although the levels of pollution are much lower now than 50 years ago, as a population we are a lot more susceptible to air pollution. For example, there are something like 3-5 times as many people being treated for asthma now than 20 years ago* and the increase is greatest for children.

    I would also agree with the point that our noses are sensitive to sulphurous compounds that are emitted from coal more so than other pollutants like nitrogen dioxide, which are present in your local urban environment.

    Unfortunately, the presence of the smoke at ground level is worst during the kind of weather patterns we are experiencing at the moment and usually get during winter; clear skies at night and light winds leading to an inversion keeping the smoke near to the ground.

    I agree it’s not ideal, and I suspect if the number of active chimneys keeps increasing we might see some more stringent legislation on the types of fuel you can burn. But for us, we don’t have a mains gas supply and hence we don’t have central heating, so it is an economical option for us.

    * I accept that some of this increase might be due to increased awareness and uptake of treatment, but it’s still a huge jump.

    mrmonkfinger
    Free Member

    and I suspect if the number of active chimneys keeps increasing

    I’m not sure we’ll see much of a return to mainstream heating use. Woodburners are essentially an expensive fashion item.

    matt_outandabout
    Full Member

    I would also say there is a big difference (in pollution terms) between a coal open fire, and a modern woodburner working properly.
    Open fires / woodburners do put out more particles, that are harmful.
    However, you need to balance this against the gas heating (noxious stuff emitted) and the electricity (all sorts emitted, just many miles from you enjoying your country air…).
    As will all energy things – it works for some, in some places. Up here in (semi)rural and rural Scotland it is ideal. Living in middle of a city – then no. (despite us doing it for a few years…)

    grum
    Free Member

    It’s not something I’ve ever noticed, living in Hebden. Where in particular are you saying the air quality is awful?

    Mind you I used to live in Lancaster where air quality fails EU minimum standards.

    Rockhopper
    Free Member

    I live in a smokeless zone (as do most of you I would suspect) but go for a walk in the evening and you can smell the housecoal being burnt. I only use smokeless now, you don’t get quite the same “fire” effect that housecoal gives you but it burns for a heck of a lot longer (and easily offsets the extra cost).
    You are not allowed to burn wood in a smokeless zone unless its in a approved appliance (so no open fires then).

    http://smokecontrol.defra.gov.uk/

    mattsccm
    Free Member

    Traditional open fires have been around for tens of thousands of years. They are not the problem and should be considered as a default. Lets have a few less cars instead.

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