After years of sticking fingers in ears and going “LaLaLa can’t hear you”, I’ve decided to take up my father’s offer of a spare wood burner they’ve had kicking around.

Trouble is, our 20 yo house doesn’t have a chimney breast, so we intend to remove the existing gas fire and supply (using a gas fitter), and install an insulated stainless steel flue using the hole in the wall used by the gas fire vent.

Phoned Building Regs to check out what I needed to comply with, and the guy wouldn’t tell me!

“Use a professional installer” was his response 🙁

The only “helpful” advice was to give the name of a business that could do the work. Not quite sure what to make of his advice TBH

Help required from the STW Hive…!?

So – flue, hearth stone / slab, ventilation?
Any info of references much appreciated

Nope. To see why you should get a professional in, get familiar with building regs relating to solid fuel – approx 100 page document relating to how not to kill yourself or set fire to your home.

Approx 50 deaths a years from carbon monoxide poisoning.

Part J of building regs Here

Have a look at this
http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/stove_help_and_advice.html

I have looked at a few sites but this seems to be the best for advice etc.

So we’re no longer capable of doing what we’ve been doing since living in caves… 🙄

I might well decide that I haven’t got the time or inclination to do it myself, but I’m not over keen on being told I can’t, especially when accompanied with no sources of reference to go away and research

ETA – Ta for the last two posts!

How big is your existing flue for the gas? Chances are it won’t be big enough to take the 8″ diameter o/a twin wall s/s flue. Can you run it outside?

I doubt the existing flue would take a s/s liner either, so your best bet would be to take the new flue outside.

I may as well spout one of the obvious ones but a lot of insurers will invalidate your house insurance if any damage is caused via the fire, unless a hetas certificate is present.
However that said, I fitted my dads and part of the flue goes thro a plastic conservatory roof!
I didn’t fit mine as I couldn’t be arsed to go on the roof to drop the liner in, so i hammered a local fitter down for a cash deal.

You don’t need an 8″ liner!

It will be through the wall an up the outside… Existing gas flue is probably <6″ / 150mm and I think the wood burner is 7″. So existing hole most likely needs to be reamed.

Also expect to have to take out a panel of floor and cast a new hearth / plinth.

Eta

I may as well spout one of the obvious ones but a lot of insurers will invalidate your house insurance if any damage is caused via the fire, unless a hetas certificate is present.

To say nothing of all the old decrepit chimneys that routinely get used…

Very unhelpful Building regs guy, I mentioned the same to my inspector and he emailed me back all the regs. Seems pretty straight forward…

Well I only spout that one as a lad that works for the old man had a chimney fire a few Christmas’ back after just bunging a bit of flue up the existing chimney. Fire brigade couldn’t put it out easily so took a sledge hammer to the chimney breast half way up to get a quick blast from the hose in. Fire out, world of mess, not covered…,

I may as well spout one of the obvious ones but a lot of insurers will invalidate your house insurance if any damage is caused via the fire, unless a hetas certificate is present.

Or it’s been signed off by your local building inspector. Who in this case doesn’t seem particularly helpful…

Found the document I was sent, you can download it from here:

http://www.eastherts.gov.uk/media/pdf/t/0/16_-_Technical_Leaflet_-_Installing_Solid_Fuel_Stoves_Mar_2011.pdf

Jeez wept – number of chimney fires we’ve dealt with in the past at home…

Parents many times, most relatives at least once.. And all with old fashioned chimneys that have been there 100s years – far bigger risk IMO. One relative almost burnt his roof off because the builder had extended a wooden rafter through the chimney breast – that particular builder probably died in the cholera.

Can’t imagine that a modern, external SS flue would present anything like the same risk – especially if installed properly, which I do wang to do

Footflaps, and others, thanks for the ljnk(s)

Wrightson, read my post, please!

I refer to 8″ o/a twin wall, where, in my design/ drawing parlance, o/a = overall.

So a 6″ I/d with 1″ insulation.

Ta

This kind of makes my point – neither of you can offer advice about the flue size without knowing the rated output of the appliance.

Sorry I didn’t spoon feed you a link but I did tell you where to look OP, If you can fully grasp the requirements of the building regs, and are confident in your ability, then crack on and get it fitted.

Having just been through a lot of this and installed a woodburner myself in place of a gas fire, this is what I’ve learnt.

Min flue size for building regs is 125mm for stoves less than 20kw and also check the stove outlet as the flue cant be smaller than this . 150mm is what normally gets used.

If you’re going out through a wall and up the outside this is incredibly straight forward as most of the building regs don’t apply.

You need to look at flue termination in respect to roof and windows.
Hearth size.
Distance to combustibles as you go through the wall.
Ventilation.

To make it all properly official there’s also meant to be a notice plate with the stove details – though I’ve not yet heard of anyone actually having one of these.

I put a notice plate in. I wrote the necessary on a bit of MDF and stuck it in the cupboard under the stairs!

If you can fully grasp the requirements of the building regs, and are confident in your ability, then crack on and get it fitted.

^This

Having said that, a helpful and knowledgeable Building Control department is a definite plus, since they’re going to have to come out and sign off on it, and the OP’s experience suggests that his lot may be a PITA.

Thanks. Some useful stuff there. I was mainly taken aback by the inspector’s attitude. Not sure if it was more “dumbed down UK” approach, CBA to do his job, or mate runs a flue installation Co.

The unit isn’t a current model, but the manual is still available as a PDF on the manufacturers website.

Not sure if it was more “dumbed down UK” approach, CBA to do his job, or mate runs a flue installation Co.

Combination of all three, by the sound of it. Have a read of part J and see if you’re up to it. Building Control in theory need to visit to watch a smoke test to check draw, but I can’t think why they’d need to come twice with it being an external flue. Also make sure you’re not in a smokeless zone, or that if you are, your stove complies (unlikely if it’s an old one).

There’s effectively only two flue sizes and chances are if it’s 5Kw or more it will be a 6″ flue (8″ twinwall).
It’s not rocket science. Look at the regs, buy the best flue you can afford (they are def not all equal) and put it in. Get (miserable) building reg chap or stove fitter to sign it off.
With it being external flue it’s much easier to see if it’s been done right…. which is good.

To make it all properly official there’s also meant to be a notice plate with the stove details – though I’ve not yet heard of anyone actually having one of these.

<waves>Got one with mine </waves>

Also check if your you are in/your prospective stove is smokeless zone rated.

Get a couple of proffessional installers around to price up the work. Get an itemised quote of what they recommend, have a flick through the building regs, get the building inspector around during the works and bobs your uncle.

We did one several years back, but our building control guy was quite helpful.

Ours was an internal chimney – put a liner in – easy job (used a B&Q scaffold tower borrowed from a workmate to get on the roof).
Solid concrete slab floor – no hearth required, but we added one anyway so it looked nice.
Made sure the clearances around the burner in the fireplace openening & the burner’s air supply (wall vent, or not, in our case) kept the inspector happy.

We had 3 or 4 visits at various stages, then received a certificate.

The regulations aren’t that tricky to follow.

In-laws went a different route, but they had an external flue. They made a new hearth and did all the necessary interior changes, and then got a HETA guy to turn up with the burner, sort the chimney/flue and fit the burner to it. I don’t think the fitting cost was that high, plus saved having the home visits from the inspector.