i heard yesterday that train travel is almost as popular now as it’s heyday in the 1920’s, but why it’s ludicrously expensive, just checked the price of a return ticket from B’ham to Bristol on a saturday after 9am, returning before 5pm, cost ? £94 plust £6.50 for a return ticket from my local station to B’ham, so £100.50

is it just me? i could drive there and park all day for a lot less, why are the trains so popular?

why are the trains so popular

No traffic jams and no parking problems, basically. Cars would be great* if driving were actually like the adverts.

* Ignoring eco considerations, of course.

Because sitting in a stationary car for hours on end is soul destroying. I’d much rather commute by train, but the costs are prohibitively expensive.

How do they define popular ?
Total number of train journeys ?
If so, and if the current UK population is about 1.5 times the 1920 population of 40 million, then trains travel is really only 2/3 as popular as it was then.

No traffic, comfy seats and you can actually do something or nothing when on board. They are expensive though unless you’re organised with where and when you want to go, or driving is to too cheap.

Its very subjective isnt it.

I used to get the train in to work in Leeds which would take 15mins. The same car journey would take 1hr 15mins.

I now work in Sheffield. The train journey would probably take me about 2 1/2 hrs. The car takes 1 – 1 1/2 hours. So the car wins.

The train is good because you can relax (of sorts) however with how busy some commuter trains are these days you certainly cant relax.

Have you tried splitting the ticket?

Because for an awful lot of people, they have no choice…

Because of poor planning over the past 40 years, residential and working areas have been largely separated, and people have to get from where they live to where they work, for many the train is the only realistic choice.

RD: Which Saturday? If you looked at the day after tomorrow then I’d bet that it’s only the most pricey ticket type (Open return) but if you searched for. Ticket for, say, May then you’ll probably find a cheaper offer.

Mind you, I haven’t checked this…..

Weird.
I just checked the costs for a journey on 5th – this Saturday- on the National Rail site, & it would only be £36 Bristol – Brum return, leaving at 0845. Some journeys were £47return.
Do you know how to buy train tickets? Where did you look?

The trains are OK-ish (given the level of investment) but the info on ticketing is poor.
It took me a while to work out my local trains but now I get tickets about 1/2 the price I used to pay (off peak traveller, not for commuting btw) mainly by buying two singles rather than a return and/or splitting the journey….

is it just me? i could drive there and park all day for a lot less, why are the trains so popular?

Maybe not if you start to include the cost of a car, insurance and maintenance, you may be shocked how much you are really paying per journey.

The train has become cheaper overall now for my daily commute to work.

However, it isn’t pleasant at times when you are crammed in and it is running late.

Yep – I’ve just checked Birmingham to Bristol TM for 14th May: £11.50 each way. I very much doubt you’d be able to drive and park for cheaper than £23, even if you exclude the fixed costs of owning a car.

Same journey, same day first class = £49.

Because it’s seen as a bit socially unacceptable to drink cans of Stella sitting on the M25.

Moses – Member
Weird.
I just checked the costs for a journey on 5th – this Saturday- on the National Rail site, & it would only be £36 Bristol – Brum return, leaving at 0845. Some journeys were £47return.
Do you know how to buy train tickets? Where did you look?

yes i do, i said after 9am though

BlobOnAStick – Member
Yep – I’ve just checked Birmingham to Bristol TM for 14th May: £11.50 each way. I very much doubt you’d be able to drive and park for cheaper than £23, even if you exclude the fixed costs of owning a car.

Same journey, same day first class = £49

sadly i don’t want to go in May, but thanks

I travel on trains 3 times a week – yesterday it turned up 20 mins late and no heating on. They still come round and charge you full price for the privilege mind.

I might start a train revolution and refuse to pay when the heating isnt on or its running late.

Because for an awful lot of people, they have no choice…

What he said… for most people in the commuter belt around London (which accounts for the highest density of passenger traffic, commuting by rail is the ONLY option.

And yes, people can choose where they live, but prohibitive property prices are pushing people further out to the ‘burbs all the time, meaning the demand is getting higher all the time.

“Paying for roads is investment. Paying for railways is subsidy”. Discuss.

Despite working in the industry, I’m thankful that I have only 20 more train commutes before we head to the wilds of Devon, not that I’m counting down or anything you understand…

Because it’s seen as a bit socially unacceptable to drink cans of Stella sitting on the M25.

Politicical Correctness gawn mad.

For a lot of people, especially those without flexibility and so paying full price, the firm is paying for it and they don’t care, on top of which, you can chill, read, do some work, surf pr0n.

I work away from home during the week and could drive or get the train.

Train wins for me as it’s less stressful, less tiring, I can work while travelling, usually less holdups (and when there are there’s nothing you can do) and I’m not out of pocket*.
People complain about crap service but to be fair I think it’s pretty good on the routes I use – Value for money is a different subject.

Downsides are that it takes longer (on a good day) and is less flexible.

* Work pay a massive 15p a mile for car travel which won’t cover petrol
(You can claim 25p back at the end of the year but I’m still out of pocket)

If I were paying the costs myself it may well be a different matter

I could rant about public transport being run by the private sector when it should be public but it just makes me angry …. and relax.

Maybe not if you start to include the cost of a car, insurance and maintenance, you may be shocked how much you are really paying per journey.

Assuming you only use the car for commuting to work, of course. If it’s the family car that you’d have bought anyway it makes more sense to use it for commuting as you’re actively benefiting from the fixed costs.

Because sitting in a stationary car for hours on end is soul destroying.

At least when you travel by car you know will have a seat. I commuted into London for several years by train; that truly was soul destroying and I now hate travelling by train. I accept that for some people it is the only option they have but whilst I have a choice I’d rather sit in my car away from the sounds of crying babies, irritating ring tones and drunk northerners coming to the South West on holiday.

Its also rather nice to have the option of changing your route when the train inevitably gets held up or breaks down.

RD- in that case, I’ve no idea how you get £100. For this Saturday, Brum to Bris is only £36 or £46. Dunno where or how you found a price for £100.
Tell me exactly when & where you’re going, I’ll look for you!

The real crime is that season tickets aren’t “directional”. Its the same cost travelling in the opposite direction to most people in the rush hour.

paying top whack makes sense on a full train, but not on an empty one travelling in the opposite direction.

i heard yesterday that train travel is almost as popular now as it’s heyday in the 1920’s

Is train travel really popular?

I’d suggest ‘popular’ is the wrong word.

Just because lots of people use the trains doesn’t mean it’s popular.

‘Popular’ implies people like it & deliberately choose it over other ways of getting about.

It’s force of circumstance for a lot of people rather than choice.
And it’s a miserable way to travel for many, what with the cost, overcrowding, delays, cancellations and so on…

I can get a return ticket from Edinburgh to Windermere for less than £40 – would cost me a helluva lot more to drive.

I’m sure I’d go riding more and in more interesting places if had a licence and a car, though I’ve no need or desire to acquire either. Trying to get anywhere by train and bike is actually soul-destroying. Of course you can book it a week or two in advance, but it does rather spoil the spontaneity.

I’ve no idea what train travel was like in the ’20s, though I have a rather romantic image of crowds of ladies and their dandies heading for a spin in the countryside, their velocipedes conveyed by a spacious guard’s van.

Shame really as I’m utterly certain that train + bicycle = the ultimate solution to any transport problem.

I can get a return ticket from Edinburgh to Windermere for less than £40 – would cost me a helluva lot more to drive.

If you’re flexible about when you travel, and if you’re travelling alone, then trains can be much cheaper, but not everyone has that option. In a car, 4 or 5 people can travel for marginally more than 1 person.

Big Dave – Member
Because sitting in a stationary car for hours on end is soul destroying.
At least when you travel by car you know will have a seat. I commuted into London for several years by train; that truly was soul destroying and I now hate travelling by train.

I did a suburban London train commute for 6 month before switching to cycle commuting, it was hell, felt sorry for those heading further out to Kent without the option of cycling. Any form of rush hour travel is pretty bad though. I’d still prefer the same journey on a train then in a car though as long as I could get a seat.

You can get royally pissed in transit. Try that in your car.

As above, how on earth did you get to £100?

My midget, including 28mpg, breakdowns*, insurance, serviceing, tax (in roughly decreacing cost order) is just about the same cost as the trains when spread over 6000 miles. I’m not counting capital cost as hopefully its an investment!

*modern car depreciation is probably higher.

My problem with trains is the bit at the end, outside the London commuter belt there aren’t any village stations, so the train stops 20 miles form my parents house, so yes the bulk of i is in a straight lines at 100mph, it still quicker to pootle up the motorway at 56.

£36 return this saturday. I don’t get it.

It’s not popular…it’s just a necessity for some people.

I have to get on the damned things every day to get into London. And don’t get me started on the Jubilee line.

I’m contemplating riding into Canary Wharf from New Malden…it’s a 52k round trip. It’s all flat so it wouldn’t be too much bother…but whenever I’ve cycled in London before I don’t like the road chaos and the feeling that I’m about to be crushed. Perhaps that’s something you get used to.

I’ll probably convince myself to get some expensive road bike with fancy shiny bits…probably made out of carbon and suitable for an athlete. Then I’ll get fed up of commuting by bike and it’ll go into storage to collect dust.

Perhaps it’s best I stick to the trains with all the miserable rude people (like the chap this morning who practically shoved me out of the way to get a seat before me).

And yes, people can choose where they live, but prohibitive property prices are pushing people further out to the ‘burbs all the time, meaning the demand is getting higher all the time.

“Paying for roads is investment. Paying for railways is subsidy”. Discuss.

Despite working in the industry, I’m thankful that I have only 20 more train commutes before we head to the wilds of Devon, not that I’m counting down or anything you understand…

ah yes. move to the countryside, spend all your time driving around in it, because you ‘haven’t got a choice’…

hmm. london is certainly a different kettle of halibut, and is definitely in the extremes. however my work colleagues spend between 60 and 20quid a week on fuel commuting, in reasonable cars ( so depreciation applies too ), when they could move to the suburbs of the city we work on the edge of, in the SW, and ride or walk in, and put the money saved in fuel onto their mortgage. makes that house ‘in town’ that bit more affordable now, eh?

After leaving university I worked in High Wycombe and lived in Oxford…I used to enjoy driving to and from work down the M40. You cna listen to the radio, fart, sing…do what you like.

Now I have to sit on the train (or stand usually), with someone sat/stood next to me who seems determined to occupy the same space as me, who seems to have an issue with my ribs so elbows me as he/she flicks through the paper. And before you even get on the train you have to deal with people who have no sense of manners or patience and who seem to think that the people who have been waiting for a train for the past 10 minutes were doing it for their own entertainment and were just waiting for them to come along and stand at the front of the queue.

The trains themselves aren’t the biggest problem…it’s all the other people who use it too.

45.70 for the most expensive Saturday return ticket (off peak return) lets you go on any train that day.

Bad thing is less the price of tickets, but as you’ve found out, the complicated ticket pricing system meaning that for people who don’t understand it, they can often end up buying way too expensive tickets. Like you didn’t know Saturday is all off peak time, you’d have spent fifty quid too much.

Because sitting in a stationary car for hours on end is soul destroying. I’d much rather commute by train, but the costs are prohibitively expensive.

+1

i love the theorey behind trains.

but its ass.
its FAR too expensive, its either over crowded, or empty, neither of which are clever.

i dont do economics, which probably shows, but if they put more trains on, and made them AS cheap as driving, people would use them surely?
the motorways would eb full of audis and range rovers, and people who dont want to be associated with the great unwashed, and the great unwashed could go by train

if i knew i could get to work for the same price as driving, i would do it every time. even with reliance on timetables.
just for not having to drive!

7 quid to work for me, about 8 or 9 return.
15 miles (1.50 each way in fuel)

cant justify the extra EVERY day.

and DONT tell me it cant be done/doesnt work
Look at ANY european country.
Holland being my personal case in point.

cross the country for a few euros, on time, every time, clean and loverly.

the state needs to claim the railways back, and NOT put a muppet in charge.

like so many things, EG: post office:
why does it have to be run for profit?
if at the end of the year, the system breaks even over all, then its a job well done IMO.