Locally I've now seen diesel at over £1.20 a litre. Can somebody explain why the pump price is so high, when the barrel price of oil is so low?

Thatcher's Britain! 😉

Apparently the barrel price is currently twice that of a year ago.

fuel tax and the weak pound

Too many offshore "inbetweenie" tea breaks 😉

They need to pay me and I have an expensive hobby 😆

+3p accelerator (?) on soon too.

Apparently it's weak pound, and lack of refining capacity.

Someone told me the other day that Chinese petrol consumption is up 28% in a year

It's a limited resource, with a high demand. Expect it to get more expensive in the medium to long term and plan your life accordingly.

It's a limited resource, with a high demand. Expect it to get more expensive in the medium to long term and plan your life accordingly.

Yes, but the crude price is about half what it was two years ago. I understand what the longterm trend will be, but don't understand why the retail and crude prices don't follow each other more closely.

As someone mentioned above, we are even more stuffed if there is another 3p in April.

It already went up in January when VAT returned to 17.5%. When VAT was reduced last year to 15%, it was not reduced on petrol, as fuel duty was increaed by an equivalent amount to compensate. Therefore, when VAT returned to 17.5%, tax on fuel was higher than it was pre-VAT reduction. Bloody stealth taxes!

If we get another 3p in April, that will be two increases in 4 months, and that on top of increase caused by the weak pound since our oh so prudent chancellor emptied the piggy bank in the good times, leaving nothing for the bad times.

the price peaked around the middle of 2008, then fell rapidly. It's now about the same level as it was in 06.

I think petrol and diesel are quite modestly priced when you consider the enormous costs of exploration, extraction, refining and transport, and then they are taxed twice before we get them.

On the other hand, A farmer can buy a cow, stick it in a field, and sell the milk with no taxes at all for 85p per litre. And grumble about it.

It's all to do with the "crack spread".

Probably it isn't, but I just wanted to use that gratuitously stupid slang term for "refining margin". 🙄

BigJohn, it's called scale 😉

the price peaked around the middle of 2008, then fell rapidly. It's now about the same level as it was in 06.

Don't forget inflation, 4 years time 2.5% =10.3%, so it's actualy cheeper.

Yes, but the crude price is about half what it was two years ago. I understand what the longterm trend will be, but don't understand why the retail and crude prices don't follow each other more closely.

This is why fuel tax is actualy good. Look at America, little/no fuel tax, but they spend marginaly more on fuel than we do (c.a. £1500 pa). So when oil prices doubled they ended up paying nearly £3000/$5000 a year to run their big V8's. Where as we were actualy paying less in real(inflationary) terms than 10 years previously.

The fuel tax encourages/forces people into smaller cars, without it we'd spend just as much on fuel, but be both more impacted by oil price fluctuations (tax was really hiked up post the 70's oil crisis) and less environmentaly friendly.

BigJohn – Member
On the other hand, A farmer can buy a cow, stick it in a field, and sell the milk with no taxes at all for 85p per litre. And grumble about it.

But the cow doesn't milk itself, does it? (and nor does it deliver it's own milk to the shops).
If you're buying milk at 85p a litre you don't honestly think that the farmer gets anywhere near that, do you?

@thisisnotaspoon- that's interesting. I hadn't realised that.

The real question is why is petrol still so cheap. Cheaper than bottled water usually, despite the massive tax on it.

Is it? I think the real question is why the fek do people pay for bottled water when they can mostly have tap water for free….

If it's expensive now then you had it mega cheap when the crude price was at it's highest.

Petrol's also cheaper than beer.

I think we're spending £50 a month on petrol at the moment, which makes it about as expensive as our TV/broadband/landline package, and way, way less than we spend on food, mortgage or pretty much anything else.

The fuel tax encourages/forces people into smaller cars

Not much help for those of us who already have a small car, drive as little as possible and still see a big dent in our budget at the end of the month.

I think we're spending £50 a month on petrol at the moment

good effort! My current circumstances mean I'm paying more than that a week. And that's before I consider the wife's car.

Petrol's also cheaper than beer.

I think there's an important financial lesson to be learned from this fact.

Considering £50 can move 1.5 tons around 500 miles at 60mph with no physical effort, it's still pretty cheap.

Petrol's also cheaper than beer.

I think there's an important financial lesson to be learned from this fact.

I don't tend to move as much when running on beer though.

Considering £50 can move 1.5 tons around 500 miles at 60mph with no physical effort, it's still pretty cheap.

Slightly odd comment, at what point does it become "not cheap" in your definition of value? What do you base your values on?

good effort! My current circumstances mean I'm paying more than that a week. And that's before I consider the wife's car.

That is the wife's car. I don't drive, or have a car.

It just cost us £150 to for it's annual service and MOT though, which is annoying when we hardly use it and we just paid the VED last week too.

Price the poor people off the road yeah!

Considering £50 can move 1.5 tons around 500 miles at 60mph with no physical effort, it's still pretty cheap.

£2.50 of that £50 is to move the driver. £47.50 is to move the car.

It might be cheap, but it's not efficient or cost-effective.

Price the poor people off the road yeah!

Genuinely poor people can't afford a car anyway, regardless of how much petrol costs. They're also the ones who feel the worst effects of excessive car use.

This thread contains worrying amounts of common sense.

Move along, STWers, nothing to see here.

Fuel is not expensive – the price of crude oil is only $80 a barrel.

What is expensive is government, specifically the wastrel government that is in power at the moment.

If you want to find who is responsible for your wallet being empty after filling the car, then find someone who voted Labour last time around, and give them a good, hard slap.

Not much help for those of us who already have a small car, drive as little as possible and still see a big dent in our budget at the end of the month.

Yes but if there was no tax (eg you lived in America) you would live further from work and drive a car with a V8. You'd still complain about the price of 'gas'.

I can do the round trip to my parents house (380 ish miles) on a £40 tank of petrol. How is that not good value for money?

That is the wife's car. I don't drive, or have a car.

I didn't used to. I only started driving a couple of years ago.

But to be honest, in my current situation commuting up from Northumberland to Fife and back once a week, the train would cost just as much and is considerably less convenient.

So I've not got a lot of option – other than to change job obviously, which is "in progress".

Genuinely poor people can't afford a car anyway, regardless of how much petrol costs. They're also the ones who feel the worst effects of excessive car use.

OK – we need more poor people?!

Price the poor people off the road yeah!

I used to live in the shittiest area of Reading, averaged at least one drugs bust a week and invariably there'd be a murder every month.

Yet:
Every house had a minimum of 2 cars parked outside.
There were enough bad drivers to make Northumberland Road to be the set for Roadwars (one of those police, camera, action programs).

So in conclusion, poor people are still driving, and doing it very badly.

Isn't it because the value of the £ against the $ is so low so although the price of a barrel is half what it was the last time fuel prices were so high, the buying power of UK suppliers is much reduced.

1. Gordon Brown – Tax and waste policies
2. Save the planet crowd – global warming (lets ignore the fact that the UK is responsible for less than 2% of the world green house gasses)
3. Price the poor on to public transport to free the roads for the wealthy

capitalism

we pay what the market thinks we can afford

if you have a problem you can always move to cuba

😉