• This topic has 37 replies, 26 voices, and was last updated 6 years ago by gwurk.
Viewing 38 posts - 1 through 38 (of 38 total)
  • Why don't bikes come specced with a wider front rim?
  • qwerty
    Free Member

    I know some fat / chubby kinds do, but i was thinking bikes like Whyte T130/150, maybe a 30mm internal front, 25mm rear?

    Would it make sense or just gibberish twaddle?

    tdog
    Free Member

    Shhhhhhh, don’t let the industry hear you suggest this.

    😛

    scotroutes
    Full Member

    So that they can sell wider rimmed wheels to the gullible enthusiasts.

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    NormalMan
    Full Member

    That is new ‘double boost’ which is coming in 2019 model year.

    Stevet1
    Free Member

    Makes sense in theory, I used to run an i23 rear rim and an i25 front but when the rear broke I swapped it to an i25 as no real downside. I could go wider on the front again I guess.

    chakaping
    Free Member

    Mavic do some wheelsets like this now I believe.

    If getting a custom wheelset I’d consider something like ex471 rear and xm481 front.

    philjunior
    Free Member

    Mavic do some wheelsets like this now I believe.

    Indeed they do. Deemax, or at least some variants of Deemax.

    rocketman
    Free Member

    No-one uses the same width wheels front and rear

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Mavic did the crossmax enduro, the stupidest wheelset in the world- it was the front rim off an SX wheelset and the back rim off an ST, so it wasn’t just narrower at the back, it was also less strong. HAnds up everyone who wants a weaker back wheel than the front

    I have pretty much the same width tyres on front and back, wouldn’t want to have mismatched rims tbh

    cokie
    Full Member

    No-one uses the same width wheels front and rear

    ..that was also not the OP’s questions.. 🙄

    The question was, why don’t bikes come specced with a wider front rim..

    For what it’s worth, most bikes are certainly coming specd with larger rims now than they did before. I guess the majority wouldn’t even know the difference if you added 2-3mm to the rim at the front.

    Also, there is a practical limit to rim width and it’s effect on Tyre profile in my experience. Some wide rim/tyre combos create horrible profiles that don’t feel right (too square?).

    chakaping
    Free Member

    No-one uses the same width wheels front and rear

    Que?

    I have pretty much the same width tyres on front and back, wouldn’t want to have mismatched rims tbh

    Still a case for a stronger rear rim, if not narrower. However I typically ride with 2.25in rear and 2.35in front (29in).

    bigyinn
    Free Member

    Surely you want a wider rim at the back?
    At the front you want a more rounded tyre profile for cornering grip, so a narrower rim helps with that. At the rear an wider rim will create a flatter tyre profile better suited to traction.
    Plus, traditionally a wider rim tends to be a stronger rim.

    plyphon
    Free Member

    The wider rim is really a trend that has only come around in the last… 2 or so years? Before then an EN521 was considered a normal rim.

    I guess manufactures can’t keep up – we’re only just seeing the big boys really push longer and slacker yet that trend feels like it’s as old as 650b.

    nedrapier
    Full Member

    No-one uses the same width wheels front and rear

    Jones?

    greavo
    Full Member

    HAnds up everyone who wants a weaker back wheel than the front

    Northwind that’s brilliant – my fave comment of the day.

    philjunior
    Free Member

    bigyinn – Member
    Surely you want a wider rim at the back?
    At the front you want a more rounded tyre profile for cornering grip, so a narrower rim helps with that. At the rear an wider rim will create a flatter tyre profile better suited to traction.
    Plus, traditionally a wider rim tends to be a stronger rim.

    Apparently narrower rim is better for rolling resistance, wider for responsiveness.

    midlifecrashes
    Full Member

    What would that do for lateral stiffness and vertical compliance?

    hodgynd
    Free Member

    My Whyte T130RS 2017 ..came with 29mm internal rims as standard ..I think I can live without the extra 1mm..but the missus could disagree ..

    Screenshot_20171115-164306 by Neil HodgsonFlickr2BBcode LITE

    honourablegeorge
    Full Member

    Northwind – Member
    Hands up everyone who wants a weaker back wheel than the front

    I have pretty much the same width tyres on front and back, wouldn’t want to have mismatched rims tbh

    My “DH” wheelset is a Hope DH rear rim and a Hope 35mm front – 2.5 Maxxis DD front, 2.3 DD rear. Mismatched for the exact opposite reason – want a toughrer tum out back

    cokie
    Full Member

    want a toughrer tum out back

    Is that for all your casing? 😛

    kelvin
    Full Member

    maybe a 30mm internal front, 25mm rear?

    That’s what I use.

    At the front you want a more rounded tyre profile for cornering grip, so a narrower rim helps with that.

    Use a tyre designed for a wider rim, to avoid too square a profile.

    Plus, traditionally a wider rim tends to be a stronger rim.

    I’m glad you said traditionally… there are now plenty of lighter wide rims ideal for front use, and plenty of less wide rims with added strength but not added weight… ideal for the rear.

    Why don’t bikes come specced with a wider front rim?

    The market for new bikes is already insanely confused by all the wheel/rim/tyre sizes… mismatched ones would confuse things even more.

    If you know exactly what you want, build your bike up from a frame.

    shermer75
    Free Member

    Hodgynd- your bluetooth is on. HTH.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    Been very interesting reading the tech talks from the EWS over the last couple of years. Seems like super wide rims and all that twaddle is the preserve of the weekend warriors 😉 Most seem to be on fairly regular 25-30mm rims same front and back. If that is the type of riding your aspiring to then maybe it’s the right kit for the job or you can aim for a ((0.58^3/WW)*P)/TW increase in grip…

    kayak23
    Full Member

    Back in the mists of time, I used to run a Doublewide rim on my dh bike.

    Doesn’t actually seem that wide now by modern standards.

    Anyway, it was rubbish. Wrapped it around a tree at Hopton.

    True story.

    sprocker
    Free Member

    I have the deemax enduros which are 28 internal front and 25 rear, not sure I notice any benefit but the back is not silly flex like the yellow ones they did.

    chakaping
    Free Member

    The market for new bikes is already insanely confused by all the wheel/rim/tyre sizes… mismatched ones would confuse things even more.

    Without any insider industry info, I’d assume it’s also because many bike brands buy their wheels in ready-made, selecting from a suppliers’ list of products. Which is unlikely to offer different front/rear rims.

    Anyway, I still think it’s s smart idea and could see it becoming more of a “thing” in future.

    honourablegeorge
    Full Member

    cokie – Member

    Is that for all your casing?

    100% 🙂

    matt_outandabout
    Full Member

    How about wheel diameter as well as width?
    #nothingnew
    #thatbrowntrek

    qwerty
    Free Member

    Good idea MOAA – we could call it a 69er = 29mm internal front & 26mm internal rear 💡

    Northwind
    Full Member

    mikewsmith – Member

    Been very interesting reading the tech talks from the EWS over the last couple of years. Seems like super wide rims and all that twaddle is the preserve of the weekend warriors Most seem to be on fairly regular 25-30mm rims same front and back

    TBH I like a big ****-off tyre with a big footprint and a lot of volume and I figure the manufacturers mostly know what shape the tyre should be better than I do… other’n thatI couldn’t really give a rat’s ass what Sam Hill likes… it’s like worrying about what tyre pressures Lewis Hamilton uses

    blastit
    Free Member

    reading maxxis blurb on their new “wide” tyres they say there for a more rounded profile when running wide rims . Are they trying to sort out the problems when running wide rims .
    Just run narrower ones !!!

    gwurk
    Free Member

    Bikes come spec’d for Mr Average. finding ANY bike that’s spec’d exactly how you’d want it is nigh on impossible unless you go custom build.

    it’s like worrying about what tyre pressures Lewis Hamilton uses

    No it isn’t Northwind. you probably wouldn’t have ever ridden a DHF if it wasn’t for the likes of Sam Hill.
    Talking of Sam. he’s pretty much singlwhandedly proven all the new new shit (wheel/tyre sizes, new geometry, XXL bikes for shortarses etc. etc). most #enduro wannabe mtbers crave to make them faster really isn’t.

    and as for tyre pressures. Hill will be most likely be running higher pressures than you. As going fast requires it.

    greyspoke
    Free Member

    Given the things the guy can do on a bike, what makes Sam Hill faster down a trail is likely to have bugger all relation to what will make me faster. If I was minded to go any faster, that is.

    gwurk
    Free Member

    never used a soft compound tyre Greyspoke?
    in here. That surprises me.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    gwurk – Member

    No it isn’t Northwind. you probably wouldn’t have ever ridden a DHF if it wasn’t for the likes of Sam Hill.

    No doubt, but so what? There’s a difference between doing things because racers do it, and racers’ input influencing the kit that’s out there.

    And as for the rest, he’s on a 650b modern geometry Mega C isn’t he?

    chakaping
    Free Member

    he’s on a 650b modern geometry Mega C isn’t he?

    That’s what they want you to think.

    It’s really a 2007 Iron Horse Sunday with Nukeproof stickers.

    greyspoke
    Free Member

    gwurk>>>

    never used a soft compound tyre Greyspoke?
    in here. That surprises me.

    I was using super-tackys (and indeed, I think, Minion DHFs) before I ever heard of Sam Hill. Once I heard of him and saw the video, I started trying to ride my bike round corners like him. This was not an unalloyed success.

    I haven’t seen him ride one of these new-fangled enduro races. Does he do it differently now?

    I suppose it does depend on where you put your baseline for performance improvements though.

    gwurk
    Free Member

    No doubt, but so what?

    So it isn’t like worrying about Hamilton’s tyre pressures in your Mondeo.
    It’s like choosing a RACE tyre to help you mince about on in slightly more control. Because that’s exactly what you are doing.

    And as for the rest, he’s on a 650b modern geometry Mega C isn’t he?

    Not as “modern geometry” as his 2005 bike was.

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