While very familiar with tubulars from my dad having always used them when I was a kid I’ve never actually owned and used a set myself. I have a genesis equilibrium and am going to upgrade the wheels and part of me wants to keep it old skool and run it with some really good quality but durable tubs. I use the bike for riding to and from work maybe once a week and for training rides. I’d be running something like Vittoria Paves so they will have a good degree of puncture proofing. Questions are what’s the ride like and how easy is it to change a tub mid commute? I’m less worried about fixing them after as i would just send them off.

Thanks for your thoughts.

It’s pretty easy and quick to change a tub IME, once you’ve got the old one off (tyre levers help), then you just pop the new one on, and pump it up. Away you go.

However, we are talking about £140 for a pair of tubs here. What does it cost to get one fixed? About £20? If it can be fixed that is, otherwise you’re buying a new one for £70. Makes getting a puncture very pricey.

And the day you have two punctures?

Clinchers are the way to go, tubs are for racing.

enjoy doing this at the side of the road 🙂

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYwfMlEGWlA[/video]

Realman the head says you’re right but the heart says that love is tub shaped. 😆

You can get Vittoria Paves for about £50 and cheap tubs are available for a lot less. Compared to good quality clinchers and tubes they aren’t much more expensive unless puncturing rights one off. But I’m not worried abou the cost as much as the practicality. You’re insights on that are helpful as is that video Klunk. Thanks to both of you.

Tubs for racing.
Clinchers for training.

what about going road tubeless ?

I had thought about that but wasn’t sure of the benefit other than weight. Then again I was not sure of the benefit of tubs other than weight either hence the question.

Running carbon deep section rims here. Wouldn’t ride anything other than tubs. Mine breathe and need reinflating every day, but ride quality so great and fast.

I run Tubs most of the time unless I am doing a long ride away from home.
Thats only because i have been stranded once. The can of Victoria pit stop was a waste of time.
Running stans fluid in my tubs now.
They are easy to change, but i have taped mine on not glued them

Love the way tubs ride.

It’s funny but so many people have said that the reason for not running tubs is that they are more of a problem if you puncture and yet this was always cited to me as the reason why people did run them; they were quicker to change in a race/time trial.

The consensus seems to be that they do ride a lot better but the hassle factor is still an issue.

Brant/Moonwrasse – how often do you find yourself puncturing and what do you do with the tubs when that happens? I remember my dad un-stiching his tubs to fix a puncture and after stiching them back up they never ran straight again. I gather now people just send them off to a third party service?

I still prefer the feel of tubs and most wheels are lighter in tub variant?
Biggest benefit for me is that you puncture a lot less than with clinchers. Also if you do puncture, it normally goes down slower rather than suddenly.
Tubs can be a faff but worth it once you get used to them 🙂

Wish I could afford to run tubs all the time, they really are nicer. That said, latex inner tubes in decent road tyres come fairly close

There isn’t much of a reason not to use them. Even cheap tubs ride great.
You do need a few though. Two in use, two folded under the saddle and a few spare ones for the day you do get a puncture. Because when you get a puncture you can’t do it yourself, or maybe you can? Then fixing one costs a few bob. also careful what you put in tubs as I was told by the repair man that some of it dissolves the inner.

I find my tubeless specific set up like tubs

Realman the head says you’re right but the heart says that love is tub shaped.

It sounded like that could be the case 🙂

TBH if you’ve got the money and don’t mind spending it, go for whatever will make you happy. I do see people riding tubs on training rides occasionally. I wouldn’t do it unless I won the lottery (and even then I’d want to carry two tubs – but that’s quite a bit to carry – and I’d always be thinking, what happens if I get a third flat?)

Just remember that if you do change your mind later on you’ll end up having to buy a new set of wheels.

Rolling resistance with tubs is higher than with clinchers.

This is mainly a function of the way tubs are glued to rims, and using easy alternatives like tub tape make the rolling resistance worse.

I suspect the first time you have to try to remove a tub in the rain, with black brake mess all over your hands, then try to mount a tub, in the rain, with more black brake mess all over your hands, and the irritating thought that a wet rim plus a wet tub might not actually make for the best adhesion situation, and spend the rest of your ride cornering gingerly, you may then reconsider the ‘advantages’ of tubs.

In reality, they have one advantage; you can ride for a bit on a flat tub.

The retro and keeping-it-real bragging rights might sway the deal, but for real world application, tubs simply don’t cut it for the unsupported amateur.

I find tubs puncture less. Not sure if its because they are run at much higher psi. Mine are at 170. Only every had one puncture on tubs. Saying that it was a flint that put a slit in the outer. I binned it. not worth fixing. It left me stranded thou as i had no spare with me. Can of pitstop was no good.

Since then i have put stans in and had no trouble since.
Went out on a century last week on my clinchers and could feel the difference in the ride.

Rolling resistance with tubs is higher than with clinchers.

So tubs are slower then clinchers..?

I think the only real advantage of tubs is that you can build slightly lighter wheels. If you do a search you’ll find tests that show that good clinchers have the same, or lower, rolling resistance than tubs.
Given the convenience factor and a performance advantage, it’s clinchers for racing, training and everything else, for me.

So tubs are slower then clinchers..?

Yes.

The latest clinchers are faster than tubs amd Martin won the worlds on clinchers, but then his new uber thin Specialized tyres punctured in Olympic and TdF TTs… to finish first, first you must finish, etc…

Just got my first set of tubs, I got told I only need use glue, not tape as well, is that right? I have them on per stretching at the mo, any other tips for putting them on?

http://crossjunkie.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/tub-ology-how-to-glue-cross-tubs.html

Applies equally to road tubs.

Rolling resistance with tubs is higher than with clinchers.

This is mainly a function of the way tubs are glued to rims, and using easy alternatives like tub tape make the rolling resistance worse.

I suspect the first time you have to try to remove a tub in the rain, with black brake mess all over your hands, then try to mount a tub, in the rain, with more black brake mess all over your hands, and the irritating thought that a wet rim plus a wet tub might not actually make for the best adhesion situation, and spend the rest of your ride cornering gingerly, you may then reconsider the ‘advantages’ of tubs.

In reality, they have one advantage; you can ride for a bit on a flat tub.

The retro and keeping-it-real bragging rights might sway the deal, but for real world application, tubs simply don’t cut it for the unsupported amateur.

So glue tubs on properly then they roll great
To be fair changing a flat in the rain or cold is a ballache whether clincher or tubs.
Clinchers are now very good and easier to use particularly if you are inexperienced or lack confidence glueing etc .(no shame in this btw)
I use both tubs and clinchers.

So glue tubs on properly then they roll great
Agreed, but if you glue them on to reduce rolling resistance, using Track style glue, they are more difficult to remove.

To be fair changing a flat in the rain or cold is a ballache whether clincher or tubs.
I suspect removing a clincher tyre and sticking a new tube in is a good deal easier than changing a tub.

Plus the fact that a clincher with a new tube, even in the rain, is as secure as it was. A tub, with a wet base tape onto a wet rim?…. How lucky do you feel to corner at high speed?

Clinchers are now very good and easier to use particularly if you are inexperienced or lack confidence glueing etc .(no shame in this btw)

Gee, thanks for taking away my shame. 🙄

And which do you prefer Ed?

You’re right about changing a flat either way being a ball ache. You can get blisters getting a tub off or rolling a tighter than a gnats chuff clincher back onto a rim.

Gee, thanks for taking away my shame.

No problem 🙂
Just feel over egging the negatives a tad.

I’m not really over egging the negatives; I’m trying to be realistic with regards to the supposed positives of tub use; there actually aren’t any unless you are riding fully supported.

I’ve used tubs and clinchers, and I know that my choice has had no impact on whether or not I won races or not. I am pretty sure that along with the ‘Steel is real’ nonsense, and the use of woolen jerseys, the adoration of tubs is much more to do with retro appeal and assumed coolness than with the appliance of science.

Rolling resistance is a function of carcass deformation. A tubular tyre will deform more than an equivalent clincher unless it is stuck like a bastard with Shellac or the equivalent.

Therefore a clincher tyre deforms less and has less rolling resistance. It’s easier to get off, it’s easier to get on. It’s easier to carry two spare tubes than two spare tubs, and is easier to go into a bike shop and buy an emergency tube than it is to go and buy a pre glued tub.

Tubs are ‘cooler’ tho…

I thought a tyre that deforms more had less rolling resistance…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_resistance

Train wheels have low rolling resistance, big soggy tractor tyres have high resistance.

Tubs have higher rolling resistance because the carcass is ‘bigger’; going all the way around the inner tube; more to deform. You can reduce this by using hard glue like Shellac, but it’s a bugger to change a tub…

Surely a tub will deform less? My ones say up to 200 psi on them.

Which brings me to another question, shouldn’t you check tyre pressures when you are sat on the bike? Of you put 200psi in the tyre then plonk a 15 stone fatty on it the pressure will be far higher than a 10 stone whippet, therefore if it says 200 it really mean 220 or more?

Sorry I digress

The problem with super high pressures is that the tyres ‘bounce’ over obstacles rather than accomodate them. This affects grip, comfort, and the effort needed to ride along.

Higher pressures do not equal faster.

My main reason for liking tubs is that they give me that feeling of security when they puncture. I have had wired ons roll off the rim immediately, luckily only on the back. Also rims are peanuts to buy if you hunt down proper old shops. I have a pile of GP4’s in the shed bought purely for the accomapnying tubs. a tenner a pair and the sell the hbs to a retro fan for twice that.
I must admit to puncturing far less with tubs. Dunno why. When they do go I just repair them. Nothing hard there. I loathe tape to fix them as when you do yank one off on the road side half of it stays with the rim and the other half come off. Using cement you have a nice sticky base for the replacement whch is best being a used one as it’s stretched and still has glue on it. Tape is harder to get perfect as well.

I’m not really over egging the negatives; I’m trying to be realistic with regards to the supposed positives of tub use; there actually aren’t any unless you are riding fully supported.

You can get far lighter wheels. That’s a big plus, it’s the reason I’d go back to tubs.