Who invented the term "27.5" ?

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  • Who invented the term "27.5" ?
  • mtbmatt
    Member

    Who invented the term 29? It doesn’t take a genius to realise its not 29 in the same way that 26 is 26.

    Sam
    Member

    Kirk Pacenti I believe

    26 is not 26″, nor is 29 29″. It’s a more convenient nomenclature than 559 or 622, (or 584 for that matter) that is all. I guess it does go some way to differentiating dirt from road 650b, in the same way 29″ does from 700c.

    Premier Icon richmtb
    Subscriber

    IIRC

    26″ is the diameter of the rim,

    29″ is the diameter of a 700 rim plus an average mtb tyre (the diameter of the rim (27.5″ in inches)

    27.5″ is err em actually 650b which definitely isn’t 29″ but is quite close to 26″ but is different to them both and might work with some 26″ forks and frames but not all of them.

    So that’s nice and clear then

    IanMunro
    Member

    Kirk Pacenti I believe

    I think Kirk always used to refer to them as 650b, I don’t know if he’s now calling them 27.5 though.

    I guess it does go some way to differentiating dirt from road 650b, in the same way 29″ does from 700c.

    Indeed, it just strikes me as interesting that the midway figure of 27.5 was chosen.

    clubber
    Member

    To be fair, if you’re going to have 26 and 29er as accepted terms then 27.5 makes sense really.

    Premier Icon james_turk
    Subscriber

    I’m pretty sure it was Jeff Steber of Intense, when he brought out the “Tracer 27.5”

    IanMunro
    Member

    To be fair, if you’re going to have 26 and 29er as accepted terms then 27.5 makes sense really.

    27 makes sense sure, it’s that extra 0.5 that’s interesting 😀

    IanMunro
    Member

    Sounds like you might be right about Jebb Steber –

    In April at SEA OTTER we gave you a sneak peek into INTENSE CYCLES initial jump into the new wheel size trend. But do not call it 650B according to Jeff Steber owner of Intense Cycles. Always looking to set his creations apart from the industry, Jeff felt that 650b was a term more endeared to the road cycling faction. The moniker 275 was born as a more straight forward moniker for mountain bikers to latch onto. Whatever you decide to call it initial feedback from riders has been that the 275 Tracer and Carbines ride like a dream

    Whatever you decide to call it initial feedback from riders has been that the 275 Tracer and Carbines ride like a dream

    Amen

    mtbmatt
    Member

    IIRC

    26″ is the diameter of the rim,

    29″ is the diameter of a 700 rim plus an average mtb tyre (the diameter of the rim (27.5″ in inches)

    27.5″ is err em actually 650b which definitely isn’t 29″ but is quite close to 26″ but is different to them both and might work with some 26″ forks and frames but not all of them.

    So that’s nice and clear then

    All wrong.

    clubber
    Member

    I’m not really sure that the .5 does make that much difference, same as I’m not really convinced by the point of 27.5 unless you want to do it to remove the need for 26 and 29 – eg consolidate in the middle. IMO, it’s just not different enough.

    So, 27.5 is good 🙂

    Besides, otherwise, someone would have come up with the 27.5 as a new niche over 27er and told everyone that it was perfect and that would then be 4 sizes to deal with!

    IanMunro
    Member

    So in the good old days of as far back as last year, 650b was known as ‘650b’.
    Whereas this year the term 27.5 seems to be far more prevalent.
    Now it doesn’t take a genius to notice that a 650b wheel isn’t halfway in size between a 26 and a 29, but it does take a genius to call em 27.5 rather than 27, with the subtle implication that they do.
    So does anyone know the history of this name marketing?

    Premier Icon mboy
    Subscriber

    559mm is as near as dammit 22 inches, so add a conventional 2 inch tyre on, and it becomes a 26″ outside diameter wheel/tyre combo.

    622mm is as near as dammit 24.5 inches. Add a 2 inch tyre on and it’s only a 28.5er, but the marketing bods (those all important people in pushing the new “27.5” standard) said we should all be running 2.25 inch tyres, and therefore 29er’s were born.

    584mm is as near as dammit 23 inches. An inch bigger than 26 inch wheels. So if measured by the same standards as 26 inch wheels, we should be calling it 27 inch. But if measured by the same (marketing lead tripe) way as 29ers, then you can call it a 27.5 if you like. But it’s only 1 inch bigger than a 26 inch wheel whichever way you look at it, and therefore, IMO, absolutely totally effing pointless!

    But then Scott and various other big companies missed the boat on 29er’s (IMO a 10% larger wheel as on a 29er is big enough to warrant a place in the market), and they couldn’t be seen to be following, so they pushed this completely and utterly pointless standard on us.

    Ask yourself this… How big is a 26 x 2.5″ tyre? Yes folks, that’s right… 27 inches! Give it 2 years and they’ll all be telling us that 26 inch bikes with big fat tyres is the way forward, after all you can run a bigger, fatter tyre at a lower pressure for the same grip, and that is of course more comfortable!

    Someone wanna pay me lots of money to stop being cynical and sell pointless new standards that mean their company sells lots of new bikes per chance? 😉

    slackalice
    Member

    ^^^^^ 🙄

    And once more we enter the realm of size… Mines bigger than yours, and yours isnt actually as big as you say it is…. Boys eh?

    Get over it, go ride your bike 😉

    clubber
    Member

    Not really, mboy, your post is a replica of many many posts already made on this subject

    In fact you should be paying royalties on it… 😉

    Premier Icon jameso
    Subscriber

    slackalice, that’s the best post on wheel sizes so far )

    Premier Icon mboy
    Subscriber

    Clubber, nothing posted above was accurate. Everybody knows an inch is 25.4mm so it’s not entirely difficult to work out properly!

    I remember working in a Trek/Gary Fisher dealer back around 2001, when a rep popped by banging on about these new 29ers. Found out the rim dimension, and worked out it wasn’t exactly being measured the same way as a 26″ wheel was, so asked the question… Why 29er? The answer was that they’re pushing that they should be ridden on 2.25″ tyres, nothing skinnier… Seriously! Whether that was just one guys interpretation or not I don’t know…

    Anyway… 10 points to the first person who buys a 650b/27.5er bike and fits 26″ wheels with 2.5″ tyres… In MotoGP they run 16″ rims not 17’s like on road bikes, so they can have a deeper tyre sidewall for the same overall diameter, which makes the carcass a bit more flexible and aids grip. A 29er gives an appreciably longer contact patch over a 26″ wheeled bike, but compare a 26″ bike on big tyres vs a 27.5er on 2″ tyres and there’s no difference, but the 26″ wheeled bike will have more grip and a softer more forgiving ride…

    bigyinn
    Member

    mtbmatt – Member

    IIRC

    26″ is the diameter of the rim,

    29″ is the diameter of a 700 rim plus an average mtb tyre (the diameter of the rim (27.5″ in inches)

    27.5″ is err em actually 650b which definitely isn’t 29″ but is quite close to 26″ but is different to them both and might work with some 26″ forks and frames but not all of them.

    So that’s nice and clear then

    All wrong.
    Perhaps you’d like to correct them then, rather than just scattering shit and disappearing with no actual facts?

    it should be called “Tweener”

    Premier Icon The Pinkster
    Subscriber

    I don’t know about anyone else but I find 27.5 far more of a mouthful than 650b when saying it, especially if you pronounce it “six fifty bee”.

    “Twenty seven point five” just doesn’t roll off the tongue anywhere near as easily.

    brakes
    Member

    normal wheels
    wagon wheels
    greedy corporate shyster wheels

    Premier Icon bedfordrd
    Subscriber

    Whathaveisaidnow – Member

    it should be called “Tweener”

    I’ve referred to my new bike (Range Killer B) as having the ‘Bus W*nker’ sized wheels.

    Inbetweeners…..???? No???

    I’ll get me coat! 🙂

    650b/27.5er bike and fits 26″ wheels with 2.5″ tyres

    Width at the stays would be a problem.

    Makers aren’t greedy, they invest in products they think you might buy. It’s you that wants the products, or not.

    I’ve referred to my new bike (Range Killer B) as having the ‘Bus W*nker’ sized wheels.

    Inbetweeners…..???? No???

    I’ll get me coat!

    call it what you like your way ahead of everyone else . . .

    what’s it like?

    IanMunro
    Member

    I’ve referred to my new bike (Range Killer B) as having the ‘Bus W*nker’ sized wheels.

    😀

    Premier Icon bedfordrd
    Subscriber

    Whathaveisaidnow
    call it what you like your way ahead of everyone else . . .

    what’s it like?

    In a word, and coming from my (old) Gemini 900 – awesome – you can tell it has bigger wheels (2.35 HD tyres, but I had 2.2 Conti RQs on the Gemini, which weren’t small…). Whole machine is much more balanced: lower centre of gravity (BB is SO much lower!), still extremely flickable, suspension that is ‘plush’ (light years away from the Gemini, with 10 years of development and air springs I guess).

    Climbs really well – as long as you remain seated and don’t mush the pedals, no bob to speak of. (There is lockout, but haven’t needed to touch it yet). Then, when you’re at the top – point it downhill and ‘weeee!!!’ 🙂

    To be fair, with my skill level (ie, crap!) ANY new, modern airsprung full sus would be a mile ahead of the Gemini – just fancied trying the 650b option as I believe a 29er would be too big for Enduro (X-Fusion Enduro1 ‘competitor’ – I use the term very loosely!) Was considering a 120mm 29er (like Trance-X 29er, or Whyte T129s), but believed that to be too much to handle quickly downhill with my size (5’9″) and skill (previously mentioned).

    Finishing kit is ‘functional’ – usual Avid (Exilir 1) bleed was awful! Bled the back twice before it behaved itself – still don’t like them, so have some new SLX brakes to fit now.

    SRAM X5 is also functional, and so far is working well, even in our ‘spring’ weather.

    Not all perfect – the bottle cage bolts are too high! You can fit a cage, but only a 500ml bottle would actually fit in, and then you’d have to stop to take it out. Not a problem for me as I use a Camelbak.

    But overall I love riding it – so much more than my previous hard tails and the Gemini. I wouldn’t want to do XC on it, but for all day riding and, hopefully, Enduro, I think it’s perfect (caveat – perfect for me!).

    Have a week in the Alps booked for June – really looking forward to taking it.

    Those new Santa Cruz Bronsons look pretty sharp as well…

    Premier Icon epicyclo
    Subscriber

    So 650B is basically a dwarf 29er?

    Tom B
    Member

    Why aren’t 24 inch wheels more popular?

    Macavity
    Member

    24 one inch wheels? would that work?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHpthhswVdw

    or would fewer wheels work?

    stufive
    Member

    FFS here we go again 😡

    Premier Icon sandal100
    Subscriber

    As above, I thought it was so the Americans could work out what it was without having to explain 650b when the Tracer 27.5 came out

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    I agree that it’s clever marketing- the whole pitch of 650b/27.5 is that it’s the midway option, they’d like you to believe you get the advantages of both. So they chose a name that implies it’s bang in the middle even though it’s not, because if you called it 27, it makes it more obvious how close it is to 26 inch and undermines the pitch.

    Premier Icon stever
    Subscriber

    What bothers me is 27.5″ (Nu) is smaller than 27″ (Old). I have some 27″ wheels in the shed – anyone tired of 650B want to give them a go? They were the future once you know.

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