I’ve decided to buy myself a new Specialized full squidger. My LBS sells Specialized http://www.3peakscycles.com – but with such a big choice I’m not sure which one to go for. I’ve narrowed it down to 3:

Stumpjumper 650b: http://www.3peakscycles.com/p/6945/Specialized-FSR-Stumpjumper-Comp-EVO-650b-2015

Enduro 29er: http://www.3peakscycles.com/p/6650/Specialized-Enduro-Comp-29-2014

Camber: http://www.3peakscycles.com/p/6654/Specialized-Camber-Evo

Any tips would be great. Cheers

Forget the Stumpy. It’s a hack job.

For general trail riding a Camber Evo is very hard to beat IMO.

JCL – Member

Forget the Stumpy. It’s a hack job.

For general trail riding a Camber Evo is very hard to beat IMO.

Praise indeed!

Another vote for the Camber Evo.

Last year’s model on sale in Bike Scene for under £2k.

I have an Enduro Comp and whilst I didn’t ride any of the others on your list, I can tell you it is bloomin’ awesome.

Apart from the brakes. Which are woeful.

But it’s bloomin’ awesome.

It pedals better than its weight would suggest and whilst it’s never going to win you any XC races, it perfectly acceptable heading up, but rewards in spades on the way back down.

It will jump, steer nicely and go ruddy fast when you let it loose. I paid around the same as what your link shows and (brakes aside; they’ll do for now!) all I’ve done is fit a reverb and it’s handled 20+ mile epics as well as an Enduro.

Love it.

Whilst I’m all for supporting your LBS it seems to be a slightly odd way of choosing a bike basing your decision around one manufacturer. The bikes you mention are all aimed at different types of riding so presumably not all of those bikes would be ideally suited to the type of riding you do.

Praise indeed!

Basically the gold seal of approval.

I’ve just been through exactly the same thought process and decided on the Enduro in the end as I’m not too bothered about the extra weight and slower climbing. Incidentally why not the Stumpy 29er? As JCL said, the 650b is a bit of a bodge.

Having test ridden the Stumpy 650b, I found the bottom bracket way too low and the head angle too steep. The suspension was characteristically lovely, but ultimately I thought it a compromise too far.

So I bought a Stumpy 29er and it’s a far, far better bike.

I also own a 26er Camber, which I daresay it bears little resemblance to the 29er Camber you can buy today. I’ve not tried the Enduro in a 29er flavour though.

First thing is an honest appraisal of what you’re actually going to ride. Whilst an Enduro will be amazing on the descents and will have a lot of travel in reserve, I suspect it’s going to be a bit of a drag for the 90% of the time when you’re not descending or hitting rock gardens.

If it were my money down to those three choices, it would be a Camber Evo or failing that a 29er Stumpy Evo.

Just ordered a carbon camber evo for general trail riding, just wish it would turn up sooner

I suspect it’s going to be a bit of a drag for the 90% of the time when you’re not descending or hitting rock gardens.

That was my first thought too, but detailed reviews and most owners say it actually climbs pretty well. I hope they’re right as mine is arriving soon! It’s all a compromise of course, so I guess you have to decide what part of the ride is most important to you. The Camber Evo is almost certainly going to be the fastest and most involving A-B weapon on average UK trails and the Enduro will offer the plushest ride and more capability in the really gnarly stuff. Stumpy somewhere in between the two.

Only personal preference can make this sort of decision. What sort of trails do you ride? Do you like a plush ride or more feedback from the ground? Are you into fast technical climbing or just happy to plod up to the top? Are you aggressive or cautious on the downhills? These are the questions to ask yourself and then the choice should become a bit clearer.

The one with the least Special Specialized only parts required 🙂 Is that a bolt on contraption to mount the shock or is it part of the shaft?

It’s direct mounted to the shock shaft to decrease friction. Not much rotation in the link to begin with (unlike some designs…). Plus no DU to wear out. One of the reasons the suspension is so supple. However, the less friction in the design the more critical spring rate pressure is so a digital pressure gauge is essential IMO.

I’ve always found it funny that people obsess about fork stiction yet they don’t even consider it a factor with rear suspension.

yep so stuck with a spec issue shock then 🙁
Can’t really say rear stiction has ever been an issue

I rode the Enduro 650B and the stump jumper 29er at NWMTB’s demo day last sunday. Both felt great. The 29er felt better on the ups but not as gnarly on the downs. The Stumpy felt a bit more balanced and a bit less laid back. All day trail riding? I’d go for the stumpy 29er.

yep so stuck with a spec issue shock then

No you can get Monarch’s or Monarch+.

Can’t really say rear stiction has ever been an issue

How do you know? The lower the stiction the faster the suspension can react and the more effective and accurate the shocks damping settings will be.

Cheers for the input people. Food for thought. They’ve a demo day coming up soon with a Stumpy 29er in my size so I’m gonna go along and ride a few. Maybe some Orange bikes too! http://www.3peakscycles.com/pg/11/Demo-Bikes-at-3-Peaks-Cycles

Can’t really say rear stiction has ever been an issue

It’s one of those things that you only tend to notice when it is significantly reduced and the suspension suddenly becomes a lot smoother and more sensitive in a very positive way – I’ve experienced this first hand after replacing all my suspension bearings and just hadn’t realised how sticky the old ones must have been. Low speed sensitivity was night and day better and interestingly braking was much improved too. A much bigger improvement than I had expected to be honest.

The benefits of ultra-low stiction have long been known in high level motorsport (my personal background as an engineer) and it’s good to see mtb manufacturers making an effort too. I’m sure low friction is one of the factors that makes the Spesh design so supple – although people rarely pick up on factors which are not so tangible. Another example would be Cannondale’s Lefty fork, which is buttery smooth on it’s roller bearings and often commented on by riders. I would imagine it has very low stiction compared to conventional forks.

Christ after a week of arguing against the benefits of a suspension design that places 90% of the mass on a link between the frame and rear triangle! I thought I was now going to have to argue that increased suspension friction is a non issue.

It’s nice to read someone talking some sense.

No worries JCL. I know the shock manufacturers and most serious frame designers are well aware of the benefits of reduced friction.

I thought I was now going to have to argue that increased suspension friction is a non issue.

Not at all just the level that exists is in a range that is tolerable. Very different thing, how much benefit will there be for the reduction in friction?

Not at all just the level that exists is in a range that is tolerable. Very different thing, how much benefit will there be for the reduction in friction?

The mass of the bike and rider is very low, the pivot points are laterally very close together, but a good frame design demands high torsional and lateral stiffness. Low mass makes stiction/friction more obvious, narrowness of pivot placement and torsional and lateral stiffness demands makes relatively high stiction/friction likely (bearing/bushing/torque requirements).

KS-link on the modern Banshees is designed to have particularly low friction due to high stiffness in the bearing mounts (thus keeping pivots rotating as designed), good bearings and very little rotation where the shock is driven. Don’t have anything to compare it do but it’s bloody good!

And I find the Fox I have and the good bushes and the bearings on my LTc leave me with no real noticeable friction. It works and does it’s job in a way that I don’t notice it. Having a proprietary shock design to me is a price that is too high to pay for a marginal improvement.

Yes, the lower the vehicles mass the more difference it makes. If you’re a light rider even more so. As I said earlier, how do you know your bike isn’t robbing you of sensitivity? What have you compared it to?

Change your Fox shock for a Monarch Debonair and tell me you can’t feel a difference. Change to a bike with a low rotation shock link, change to a direct mount shock link and loose a DU bushing… Night and day.

Again, SRAM now has shocks available for Camber, Stumpy and Enduro so he proprietary thing is a moot point. I would argue that the dual eyelet shock should not be the ‘standard’ shock design these days anyway. the direct shaft mount Specialized use is simply a much cleaner solution than what Kona and Whyte do.

As moshimonster said, the motorsport guys (who are 50 years ahead of us) are nuts about friction/stiction and they’re dealing with 200kg+ masses.

If you ride lots of Yorkshire Moors then the Camber is probably the best.

If you do all sorts the SJ but in 29er flavour would be my bet.

Or if you are going for bigger Lakeland and Peak biking and want to haul around the extra bounce and mass for maximum fun on the downhills its the Enduro.

I love my Enduro but there are times when the SJ would be quicker.

I have had the Stumpy evo 650b for about 6 weeks now and have loved it from the first ride. For me it’s just such a comfortable fit and climbs really well. It’s really smooth and stable on fast descents and corners great. I did find I was getting pedal strike at 1st but this was sorted with a little more pressure in the rear shock. I’ve given it a pretty good testing with an Italian alps trip, several Surrey hills visits and lots of xc and my Strava is telling me it’s a very quick bike!

Having a proprietary shock design to me is a price that is too high to pay for a marginal improvement.

Personally I thought it was a well engineered feature of the Spesh design. Sometimes it is worth going proprietary to make something inherently better and Spesh had the clout and balls to do it.

You could get all cynical and say they only did it to force consumers to buy replacements from them, but how many sales has it cost them from the many people who do prefer an industry standard? From my engineering background their design makes a lot of sense and is a worthwhile step up from the norm.

Anyway more importantly my new Enduro has arrived 🙂
Haven’t ridden it in anger yet, but it’s a serious piece of engineering. The detailing is pretty impressive, a massive step forward from what they were producing 10 years ago. Same goes for all the big brands to be honest. They really seem to have moved the game on.

I did find I was getting pedal strike at 1st but this was sorted with a little more pressure in the rear shock.

The BB is massively low on the Stumpy 650B. Even lower than the shorter travel Camber at static ride. I read into that as one of the quiet compromises they had to made in getting a 650B to market using the 29er frame plus head spacer.

Sounds like a great ride though in any case!

[hijack]
JCL, moshimonster… don’t suppose that you’re tribologists or coating/surface engineers?
[/hijack]

Not me, not that specialist. I studied Mech Eng to Masters degree level and worked in motorsport as a designer and race engineer all my working life.