For us, a family of six, it’s just practical.Yes you can seat seven in Tourans, Zafiras etc but not very comfortably and no luggage room. Although when the time comes to buy a new one I think the new Transit Tourneo will be high on the list. Took one for a test drive last week and wad quite impressed. I liked the rear reversing camera especially.

Handling wise, our SWB T5 drives better than our Focus estate round the twisty stuff. The only downside for me is the multi storey car parks, but other than that, MPG is the same, if not better, storage options and generally its just more fun for the kids to have a van to mess around with than a ford!

I bought a SWB Vivaro crew cab off here last week, and have totally fallen in love with it! I can put six bikes and six people in, it drives well and returns a better fuel economy than my old Scenic. I do have a young family as it stands, so it just makes sense for us – I’m normally racing every week over the summer and the lack of hassle is a massive winner for us.

FFS I’m now trying to talk Mrs Weeksy into me buying this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/08-VAUXHALL-VIVARO-2900-2-0-CDTI-SWB-MINIBUS-CREW-CAMPER-DAY-BAND-COMBI-BUS-VAN-/221792395803?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item33a3db621b

Similarly, I’ve just picked up a 2010 Traffic van which I’m converting, and its ace to drive. Wish I’d known how good a van was as a general everyday driver, I’d have done it years ago.

mine was certainly up there for the comfort crawling round the M60/62 in the mornings….

Handling wise, our SWB T5 drives better than our Focus estate round the twisty stuff

On the other hand my LWB T5 is worse than the Mk1 Focus estate it replaced. It’s good handing for a van, just not as good as my old Focus when pushing on. Lower springs would help as it’s a T32 and sits quite high being lightly loaded most of the time. Having said that I can bowl along most roads as quick as I want/need. Traffic is still usually the limiting factor. Other than a twisty B road blast, I’d prefer the T5 anyway.

Which is one of the main reasons I still have a Mondeo estate, rather than a T5, or maybe a Galaxy/Alhambra. A lot easier to load a big kayak on and off a normal car (and no, it wouldn’t fit inside a T5 – it’s over a metre longer than one!), I can still get into car parks with one on the roof. Meanwhile I disagree with wobbliscott about a big estate being the worst of both worlds – it’s big enough I can just throw a bike in the back without taking off any wheels or folding the seats. Big enough that I’ve managed family holidays with the kids bikes and my bike packed inside the car. Big enough I can sleep lying flat in the back with bike and kit alongside me. If I need to take more, bike rack on the back and I could add a roofbox, though I’ve never yet felt the need. All whilst being pretty much normal car sized for parking etc.

I have to admit though, A T5 is still kind of tempting for lots of the reasons mentioned. I’m sure as a pragmatic motorist, molgrips would acknowledge that the low depreciation makes for low running costs even with the higher fuel cost – though how does servicing compare (has anybody done a full comparison of running costs?) Will probably get one if business venture takes off (and I can offset cost against tax 😉 )

It would take a lot of nights in a b&b to cover the costs of a t5.

I have had my T5 two and a half years and we have done over 60 nights a year in it.
So I can’t be far off covering the cost of staying in a B&B.
Plus its still almost worth what I paid for it if I was to sell it.

Also I hate the whole ‘scene’ Why on earth would you buy a 40k* van to go and sit in a field full of other vans when there is a whole world out there.

*mine cost less than half that

Why all this talk of ‘handling’? It’s a van…..

pedroball – Member

Handling wise, our SWB T5 drives better than our Focus estate round the twisty stuff.

If this is true, there is something wrong with your Focus.

I’ve just bought a Caddy, so not quite the load capacity of a T5 but big enough for my needs. Mine has the VW lowering kit with bigger, slightly wider wheels and it’s still very easy to push the front end. Handling wise it’s on par with the soon to go Laguna estate wifey is driving at the moment. In the near future I’ll swap out the front/rear shocks and change the wheels for bigger, wider items to try and get it handling slightly better. I’ve got a 2 litre Highline, so all the toys including cruise control and satnav. I’m using it every day as a commuter and getting 50ish to the gallon with mixed London,country and motorway.

Van vs Estate. As there is only wifey and I, we don’t need the people carrying capacity of the estate, this is all about luggage. The Laguna estate isn’t a small car, with the seats folded down the load space is longer than the Caddy. It’ll take one 29er with the front wheel off and the bike lying down, plus enough room for some luggage. Take a second bike and it has to go on the back of the car. Load up for a camping trip and it’s both bikes on the back.

The Caddy will take both 29er’s with wheels on and plenty of space for luggage. For fully loaded camping I’ve fitted a couple of Seasucker mounts to load bikes with the wheels off. There is more than enough room for any amount of luggage we want to take. If all it was doind was carrying bikes, using the Seasucker mounts I reckon I could get 5 in the back with enough space to store the wheels plus take kit for a day or so.

The van is smaller all round that the estate, more secure and carries more. The only reason for not having one is if you need space for more than 2 people.

weeksy – coincidentally, from the same seller, I’m currently lusting after THIS

Would make an awesome bike / adventure camper 8)

I have to admit though, A T5 is still kind of tempting for lots of the reasons mentioned. I’m sure as a pragmatic motorist, molgrips would acknowledge that the low depreciation makes for low running costs even with the higher fuel cost – though how does servicing compare (has anybody done a full comparison of running costs?) Will probably get one if business venture takes off (and I can offset cost against tax )

Seems to depend what and when you buy. I had a quick look at a T5 and Traffic (Vivaro/primastar) and the depreciation in £/10,000 miles was much lower on the Renault, simply because you could buy one new for £15,000, compared to £22,000 for the VW. The VW was probably worth £5k-£6k after 10 years, the Renault ££4k-£5k. The VW was only about £10/month more on finance, so if badge snobbery was an issue to you then it’s not an expansive option that way, personally I’d have saved the £7k and put that towards a conversion.

One other thing about vans, the depreciation is always more sensible than cars. Take the new price, the residual price at 100,000miles, and the depreciation is pretty much linear between the two because businesses buying/selling them just want to know what it will cost per year over the long term, irrelevant really whether they buy a van with 50,000 on the clock and keep it for 50,000 miles and repeat it or a new van and keep it for 100,000 miles. Whereas a car drops like a stone initially then levels off after 3 years because people want ‘new’.

The difference between the Vans seemed to be that the VW then stops depreciating, presumably because they get cheaply converted into campervans with a plywood kit and then just get repaired by ‘enthusiasts’ rather than scrapped by sensible people when it becomes un-economic.

To be honest, ‘the scene’ is the only thing thats stopped me buying one. I’m terrified of being stuck in a beach car park with someone who wants to talk modding when the suns out 🙂

As a pragmatic motorist, I’m more than happy to save fuel and purchase cost by buying a regular car and simply remove the wheels from my bike when I put it in the car 🙂 Far too much is being made of the ability to take bikes with wheels on, imo.

I’d love a T5 but I don’t think I could bring myself to illegally tamper with a number plate.

What Brassneck said! yep, the other week me and Mrs Hound were camping in the T5 for the weekend at British super Bikes. We’re bike fans and not into the Dubber scene but the full on dubbers were like flies, hovering around asking about mods and did we want to see the shower unit in their tail gate, blah , blah, blah… I was only a bit flattered by the attention.

“Far too much is being made of the ability to take bikes with wheels on, imo.”

Its the easy clean interior that does it for me on any van.

with the best will in the world if you ride regular your cars interior will get trashed.

now i dont need any will – i open the door and throw it in regardless of how dirty it is.

get to the other end sweep it out and the vans like new again.

mean while i take my dirty riding gear off while hiding under the tail gate out of the rain.

how ever i dont have a VW and although never say never – ill not be buying one (another VW of any kind) of my own free will. They really know how to extort the scene/reputation when it comes to parts.

with the best will in the world if you ride regular your cars interior will get trashed.

Not really. It’s not that hard to look after them, all you need is a tarp. Never bothered cleaning before loading.

Far too much is being made of the ability to take bikes with wheels on, imo.

Good effort molgrips 🙂 a good sustained effort.

To be honest for getting away use I do think the T5’s are just too small, just look at the number with bike racks on. I used to take the front wheels off my bikes to fit them under the bed but having the room and the permanent set up was great, You could also chuck the bikes in the front half if I didn’t want to take the wheels off. For weekend duties cars just weren’t that practical so I lived with the van in the week. The downsides are not that bad. My only rule for vans is being able to stand up in the back, too long moving kit in a low roof work van made that clear for me.

I compromised.

audi with a towbar mounted bike rack for day to day local mtb ferrying.

T5 for longer journeys.

8)

all you need is a tarp.

that for your sunday jaunt to the trail centre ?

It’s just a vehicle you can lob all the family, bikes, other stuff in and go. No faffing with roof boxes, multiple bike racks, etc.

T5 has the best residuals, but if I didn’t have one, I’d have a different combi van from another manufacturer. I’m not into modding the thing, or anything like that. I treat it like a van, although I treated cars before like vans too, and the interiors always looked manky.

I think a LWB would be perfect, but happy with the compromise of being able to get a SWB into parking spaces.

Not really. It’s not that hard to look after them, all you need is a tarp. Never bothered cleaning before loading.

I do that with my C-max.

With the best will in the world, the interior is trashed. One winter so much mud accumulated on the tarp it was nearly 3″ deep by March*! And that’s before you look at the state of the front seats.

*riding 3 nights a week it was rarely worth getting the bike out of the car, let alone removing/refitting the tarp. So the mud froze to the bike, went in the car, defrosted, fell on the tarp, repeat.

The C-max will be replaced by a Van when it dies. Probably a traffic, probably with just a kitchenette and garage inside, with a small double above it for car park camping and storage, and a roof tent for sleeping.

I’m thinking you take too much stuff. I tend to take a lot, and never used a bike rack before kids.

I’ve had a few VW vans, they were great for me, might not have suited others, probably going to sell the current one in August.

What I don’t understand is the vehement hatred some people have for them, do you really care what other people spend their money and time on? If you’re that convinced in their inferiority, surely you’ve won already?

I’d like a Cali Beach if anyone wants to swap theirs for a T4 California Exclusive, not a yellow one though, thanks.

Not much hate but looking at things like this
http://vans.autotrader.co.uk/used-vans/volkswagen/transporter/2003-volkswagen-transporter-2-5td-888-special-panel-van-2461cc-diesel-halesowen-vfpa-8aa245704d9b30fa014d9b5babf10c0e/makemodel/make/volkswagen/model/transporter/radius/100miles/mileage/150000/174999
at 12 years old with 150k miles for £5k isn’t residuals it’s a rip off, you pay a chunk more up front, you get some of it back at the end if the magic residuals come off it’s great but it’s a lot more than equivalent vans.

Not so much hating VW’s just not seeing the point of tieing up £7k in a van (the difference in new cost between a Traffic and a T5). That and some people just want to be different and not fit into a ‘scene’ whereas rightly or wrongly there’s a perception T5’s are driven by people who ride teal and pink Santa Cruz bikes and refer to the van’s appearance as ‘stealth’ or ‘murdered out’, when in reality it makes them stand out like a sore thumb amongst real vans.

pictonroad – Member

What I don’t understand is the vehement hatred…

do calm down.

all you need is a tarp.

that for your sunday jaunt to the trail centre ?

Ooh you tough guy, too hardcore for trail centres?

Sometimes trail centres, sometimes mountains, sometimes races. Not sure what difference it makes where I was going.

What I object to slightly is the idea that you need some kind of big expensive gadget or ‘lifestyle option’ gear to solve a problem so utterly simple. Sure, buying a van instead of a car is convenient but buying one as well as a car just for a pretty bloody tiny bit of convenience is a waste of natural resources to be honest, and the way that biking with a normal car is portrayed as some huge issue doesn’t help.

Campervanning is a different issue.

I’m firmly a T5 fan, on my second one now. Economics wise 40mpg, insurance no more than a nice estate car, tax is a bit more but not horrendous. They’re not like a car to drive but are very nice, lowered suspension gives a better ride than standard, I’ve fitted air suspension for flexibility on campsites and also added bonus of looking nice (IMHO).

There’s a wealth of products/parts for the vw vans. Anyone can turn a van into a camper, finish and final product quality may vary though.

Something nice about the way vw owners respond to each other aswell.

Here’s mine in posing mode

Why’s it parked in a council estate for pics ?

Just out of interest for all you owners – who is good for insurance? Just been quoted £600 for fully comp with 180days european cover & breakdown – not sure if that is good or not.

Why’s it parked in a council estate for pics ?

Sometimes, a picture speaks a thousand words.
But occasionally, a comment about the picture speaks a great deal more about the poster… 😕

Just out of interest for all you owners – who is good for insurance?

Brentacre. Office in Wales. Understand camping and biking etc…

Why’s it parked in a council estate for pics ?

Dick comment.

Just out of interest for all you owners – who is good for insurance?

NFU worked out ok for me. gave me 7 yrs NCB based on background as I couldn’t transfer my 12 yrs car no-claims over.

About a mile away from where I’m currently sitting houses that pretty much look like that are going for about £600,000. So how much does your wonderfully private house cost then?

I compromised.

audi with a towbar mounted bike rack for day to day local mtb ferrying.

T5 for longer journeys.

Honey, you’re sooooooo SingleTrack World 😀

I’ve fitted air suspension for flexibility on campsites and also added bonus of looking nice (IMHO).

Forgive a bit of idiocy – but is this adjustable then? So you can later ride height (simply) to suit where you are? Only asking for future purchase knowledge, as lowered wouldn’t work for me but adjustable at home might.

We like camping, going away etc and out of (genuine) interest what would £10,000 get me? In a couple of years time how much of that back would you see?

The 2003/150k 4.5k T4 linked above – I wouldn’t go anywhere near that. All I could think of is sleeping inside an old knackered car looking at that.

stick in £10 in the search
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/vans
then see what the age/price looks like for 2 year older vans

Then stick in the other modern vans and get an idea