Viewing 40 posts - 121 through 160 (of 172 total)
  • What IS Enduro – seriously!?
  • deadkenny
    Free Member

    chakaping – Member
    Depends where the bridleways go surely? Have you not ridden in the Lakes?

    Some of the best descents I’ve ridden have been in the Lakes on bridleways, even compared to stuff around Morzine. Hell of a workout for an AM bike and dead arms at the end of it.

    My local bridleways (Surrey) are nothing by comparison though they’re a nightmare to ride as they’re churned up by horses.

    toofarwest
    Full Member

    JCL – Member

    you’ll soon realise your bike is shit/your shit

    My bike is my shit?
    Perfect poo thread?

    jam-bo
    Full Member

    Has anyone posited the suggestion that Enduro is to MTB what Sportives are to road?

    But you can actually win an enduro.

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    deviant
    Free Member

    Paulrockliffe….the appeal of entering an enduro race is not being fiddled out of £50 to ride trails you can ride for free but the racing element obviously. Some people enjoy track days with their car or motorcycle….but it’s not racing, people don’t go balls to the wall on a normal ride even if they think they do….but put a timing tab on them and most people sprout horns and ride harder. That’s racing.

    There is also the appeal of knowing the trails will be closed for the race and that you won’t come across a family out walking the dog or some idiot pushing uphill against riders coming down. That in itself is sometimes worth the entry fee.

    Add in the freshly cut off piste stuff that most organisers build for the race and it becomes a good weekends riding….if you don’t like or want the element of competition don’t enter but plenty do like to test themselves against other riders.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    singlespeedstu – Member
    I’ll leave you to your serious persuit of trail riding against the clock then.

    I remember when it actualy was people pissing about on bikes in the woods without thinking they were all of teh gnars…
    Good for you, it’s still allowed and undertaken by most riders most of the time. Any form of racing is against the clock really, DH, XC and any other variant are they also bad things, is it just wrong to want challenge yourself? I can go and ride DH tracks on a weekend without timing is that more allowed? What about XC tracks when there is no race?

    Or are you just jumping on the haterz band wagon? It’s getting a bit full and I hear it’s first come first served, the WiFi must be good up there though.

    singlespeedstu
    Full Member

    I’ll say it for you again Mike. 🙂

    You’re more than welcome to ride whatever bike you ride in whatever fashion you like.
    Just remember one thing though.
    It’s all fanying about on kids toys in the woods.

    I’m not seeing any hate there.

    cookeaa
    Full Member

    I’m not seeing any hate there.

    Dunno, but you typed it after a selective quote from my post earlier in the thread, where you effortlessly managed to ignore my point, and then make it back to me…

    Whatever, you win the internetz…

    chakaping
    Free Member

    Re. motorbike enduro existing first…

    [video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moSFlvxnbgk[/video]

    singlespeedstu
    Full Member

    chakaping.
    Just saying like…

    I’ll leave you guys to it.

    You seem to take things a bit serious for my liking.

    jimjam
    Free Member

    Some serious trolling here I fear. Four pages and no one appears to have said it’s a multi stage dh race where you need to get to each stage under your own steam.

    tenacious_doug
    Free Member

    Four pages and no one appears to have said it’s a multi stage dh race where you need to get to each stage under your own steam.

    What’s the point, the OP clearly doesn’t actually want to know, just troll.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    It’s not a multi stage dh race though. Can feel like that sometimes though. For one thing, in downhill you have to stay between the tapes

    snorkelsucker
    Free Member

    It’s Strava, but with mandatory payment to take part.

    bigjim
    Full Member

    well I thought my reply was stupid but there are some corkers in here now

    thestabiliser
    Free Member

    They make furniture don’t they..

    or aren’t they people that have bought the student loan book?

    Dunno I just ride my bike the way I want cos its just riding a bike and I can power my huge pile of supersciliousness (sp?) with just one turn of my pedals with my mighty thighs (via my feet, natch) and be all the awesomes without conforming to your conformist confromisms in a ‘race’. In my fluoro pyjamas. And flat cap.

    Honestly don’t get what’s so hard about this. It’s abike race where you go as fast as you can for a bit. ride to the next bit then go as fast as you can again. Fatest wins. Is that hard? is it? (never done one like -am far too mincey)

    jimjam
    Free Member

    Northwind

    It’s not a multi stage dh race though

    Go on then, indulge me as to why it’s not. Considering only the dh sections are timed.

    jam-bo
    Full Member

    Go on then, indulge me as to why it’s not. Considering only the dh sections are timed.

    they arent all DH. there can be some significant climbing in a stage to link sections although the stages will have an overall negative gradient.

    jimjam
    Free Member

    jam bo – Member

    Go on then, indulge me as to why it’s not. Considering only the dh sections are timed.

    they arent all DH. there can be some significant climbing in a stage although the stages will have an overall negative gradient.

    You could say the same thing about Pietermaritzburg, or many other DH tracks for that matter.

    tenacious_doug
    Free Member

    You could say the same thing about Pietermaritzburg, or many other DH tracks for that matter.

    Pietermaritzburg is far the exception than the rule, especially in modern day DH course. When you look at some of the climbs in some “Enduro” stages, they are significantly more than you’d get in any DH course.
    Plus from what I understand, the PMB middle section is more a flat sprint than an actual climb.

    chakaping
    Free Member

    I think “predominantly downhill” is the official definition innit?

    Personally I think it’s good that there’s a form of MTB racing that’s growing and relatively accessible.

    I’d also like to see more local XC races, especially in the north of England, but I understand they have dwindled because there was not enough demand. But you never know, more people participating in enduro might feed back into XC too.

    jam-bo
    Full Member

    You could say the same thing about Pietermaritzburg, or many other DH tracks for that matter.

    really? pedally sections are a bit different to uphill sections.

    unless of course you are counting the jump upslopes at Pietermaritzburg.

    tenacious_doug
    Free Member

    I think “predominantly downhill” is the official definition innit?

    If you look at the EWS rule book, yes, but more specifically it states that you can have up to 20% climbing in a stage.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Not all things that go down hill are downhill… Sure, sometimes you get stages that are basically interchangable with a dh race stage (often harder tbh- the average innerleithen enduro stage using the dh trails is harder than the average innerleithen SDA stage, frinstance) but more physical, generally longer. I’ve done few enduros where a dh bike would be the right tool, even if I had an uplift, and I’ve never done a 10 minute dh race, or a dh race with a significant climb or traverse in it. The level of practice makes a big difference too.

    Basically it gives a false impression of what the racing is actually like. It’s not a multi stage dh race any more than it’s an XC race where only the descents count. And I don’t think you’d find many people who’ve done both that would disagree.

    andyrm
    Free Member

    Interesting seeing some of the hate & negativity from some corners. Funny too that it’s from people who haven’t even tried racing Enduro!

    Fact is that to do well in Enduro, you need good strong fitness (both base to stay out on the bike for a long time and high end delivery for sprinting on the stages) and good bike handling skills on a par with a DH racer, coupled with good tactical skills to deal with things like energy management, calculating risk on the fly etc.

    I’ve been riding and racing bikes since 92/93 and can say that based on my experience of racing old style XC (Malverns etc), new style XC (round and round in circles), a couple of marathon type events, then some DH and for the last 4 years Enduro, that it’s the most “complete” race discipline. A good fast/fit XC racer isn’t guaranteed to do well as their skills are likely to fall short, and a good DH rider would likely find the time on bike an impairment to their overall performance. This is frequently borne out in the results.

    But that’s at the competitive end – there’s nothing to stop you doing an Enduro for a laugh and having a great time. I’ve never heard of an incident of arsey overtaking like we frequently see at XC events (even in the lower categories, which I never understood).

    The “it’s all marketing” line is bullshit too. The discipline was thriving long before the marketing departments of bike brands got behind it, but understandably, if a business identifies a “hot spot” in their industry, they are duty bound to act on it to capitalise on a market trend. That’s not lizard rulers of the earth/bike industry, that is Business 101.

    So in summary – give it a go. You’ll love it. I don’t know anyone who has tried the format and not had a blast. If you don’t want to try it, that’s all good too. But save the boring moans eh?

    munrobiker
    Free Member

    I don’t like it and have tried it several times. Mostly because I crash a lot, and half the riding doesn’t count to your result. In practice I’m fine but when the clock starts I fall off. My enduro career ended almost 2 years ago at Inners. Back to actual enduros (24 hour races) for me.

    I don’t have any objection to it, other than most of the riding not being timed, and think it’s probably a valid format.

    jimjam
    Free Member

    Northwind
    Basically it gives a false impression of what the racing is actually like. It’s not a multi stage dh race any more than it’s an XC race where only the descents count. And I don’t think you’d find many people who’ve done both that would disagree.

    As false impressions go, it’s not a bad one and far from the worst on this thread. If you want to be a pedant and argue the semantics of what constitutes pedally vs uphill vs downhill go ahead. I can’t be arsed as it’s pointless.

    What constitutes enduro will vary wildly since the race formats and terrain do. I’ve raced various formats and I think it’s an adequate description, especially if you are trying to explain what it is to someone who doesn’t understand, ie the premise of the thread. Admittedly it’s not a perfect definition but then it’s not exactly a set in stone format. If you take the EWS as the flagship name in Enduro then one of the comparisons or analogies used repeatedly over the last few years by racers and commentators to describe the sections was “World Cup DH on trail bikes”. Another was “some of these stages would rival a world cup dh track”.

    Whilst I realise that’s not to be taken totally literally it gives an insight into what some of it is like.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    jimjam – Member

    If you take the EWS as the flagship name in Enduro then one of the comparisons or analogy used repeatedly over the last few years by racers and commentators was “World Cup DH on trail bikes”.

    I rode an EWS, built trails for it too, it was very different to a dh race. Hard enough to make a dh world champion say our local trails are crazy, mind.

    The reason I object to “multi stage dh race” is it puts people off. It’s a less inaccurate description than many in this thread, sure, but that’s because many in this thread are absolute horseflops- it doesn’t make it helpful.

    andyrm
    Free Member

    The reason I object to “multi stage dh race” is it puts people off. It’s a less inaccurate description than many in this thread, sure, but that’s because many in this thread are absolute horseflops- it doesn’t make it helpful.

    Agreed.

    Some of the climbs you’ll find mid-stage are absolute killers and get into “saddle back up” territory, so definitely not DH. I’m thinking PS1 at Tweedlove when we were transitioning up and saw the first men on stage on the fireroad incline, lungs absolutely on fire, or PS2 in Finale in 2013 with a brutal technical climb that left you destroyed before the really steep series of bus stops.

    That for me is what Enduro encapsulates – to be fast and do well, you need to be able to deliver at any moment in time, both physically and technically. The demarcation between the 2 isn’t as pronounced as some would think.

    jimjam
    Free Member

    I see where you are coming from as regards putting people off, but I still think it’s a fair description. Go ahead and give me a better one, or a more succinct one if you want.

    I think it’s a good middle ground discipline for mtb, where you need cardio, skill and tactics. But there is, or at least there should be a minimum standard of riding required. Saying it’s dh on trail bikes or multi stage dh might put people off but it also might stop people from going to hospital. I rode a few of the Fox Hunts and whilst not “Enduro” as such they still fall under that general heading. The last one had 400+ riders at it and a huge number of them were waaaaay out of their depth on what I would describe as a very benign trail. There were some nasty injuries and quite a few riders who perhaps would have given it a miss if they knew what they were getting into.

    cubemeup
    Free Member

    iv raced in 4 GE this year had a disaster in two but still enjoyed it and made more hungry for the next race. your race can be over after one stage where im guessing you can pull it back on an XC race.

    fr0sty125
    Free Member

    My experience of Enduro so far is tough and fun!

    matts
    Free Member

    My 2yo was out on the balance bike yesterday. He kept doing a bit of riding, then getting off for a little walk and a push. Lots of theatrical huffing and puffing. Then back on for a downhill stretch.

    I’m fairly certain he thought he was in an enduro event.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    jimjam – Member
    I see where you are coming from as regards putting people off, but I still think it’s a fair description. Go ahead and give me a better one, or a more succinct one if you want.

    The range of the events is huge so one description does not cover it all.

    Simply put it’s a Stage race where transitions are not part of the overall race time (but may be limited) The Race/Special stages will be mostly descending.

    scottfitz
    Free Member

    Enduro Races 2014 44
    Enduro Races 2013 24
    Enduro Races 2012 16
    Enduro Races 2011 7

    Knock it all you want its the fastest growing cycling race discipline in the UK.
    10,000 plus racers in 2014.

    My take on format:
    Multiple stages race with transitions between stages. Stages go downhill using a mix of trail and terrain. Short climbs and flat sections can be added to increase the endurance factor of a stage.

    njee20
    Free Member

    But there is, or at least there should be a minimum standard of riding required

    Why should there be? Is that not the case for all events? What about road racing? More people die doing that than in any MTB racing, and the potential to injure lots of other people is far higher, and yet I suspect many on here will sneer at the notion that skill is required for road racing.

    Where do you start if you don’t have the skill? How do you know you’re adequately skilled for an event? What if you think you are but it turns out you’re not? Can only non-skilled riders get hurt? Are people not adults, and able to make a decision for themselves?

    I find it odd that you have people saying how inclusive enduro is and what not, and others – Jimjam – trying desperately hard to make it as elitest as possible.

    jimjam
    Free Member

    Why should there be?

    Minimum standard of riding is perhaps the wrong way to phrase it, but people should know what they are getting into before they sign up, is that fair?. I have no problems with anyone having a go, but on track during open practice is probably not the best place to practice your first 2ft drop or wet root section.

    What about road racing? More people die doing that than in any MTB racing, and the potential to injure lots of other people is far higher, and yet I suspect many on here will sneer at the notion that skill is required for road racing.

    Far more people partaking in road racing would skew those figures so it’s a pointless comparison. Also most clubs I know of conduct reliability trials to establish whether a rider is at the required standard to race, so unlike mtb it’s not always just show up and race.

    njee20

    I find it odd that you have people saying how inclusive enduro is and what not, and others – Jimjam – trying desperately hard to make it as elitest as possible.

    One post and I’m trying desperately hard to make it as elitist as possible? Jesus. I should really proof read my posts for elitist content. I’ve been at enduros where it was nigh on impossible to get a clean run through a section because so many people were walking the trail, I wouldn’t like to repeat that experience. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with saying that.

    Whilst it seems my description of “multiple stage dh” is seemingly inaccurate and off putting I don’t think it’s as damaging as having a large percentage of the competitors showing up and complaining that the course is too hard or too technical. You don’t want to end up with a situation where you have commisaires going round checking everything for health and safety in case anyone might suffer a scratch as seems to be the case with xc in a lot of places.

    mindmap3
    Free Member

    andyrm – I don’t think sensible posts have any place in this thread!

    STW at it’s best – I’ve missed it. Thank goodness for a quiet day at work.

    Ecky-Thump
    Free Member

    I’ve not done an enduro yet but I’m waivering. Might have to give it a go in 2015.

    I understand the format, I’m just not sure if the 30 minutes or so of individually timed riding on trails that you can ride anytime you like is enough to tip the balance.

    I’ve done a couple of Megavalanches and really love that mass start format but I just can’t see a few 5-10 minute descents recreating the same buzz.

    That said, having ridden a few of the “Dudes” trails around Kinlochleven, I can see that they’d be fun to race, so I might have a go at that one.

    What we really need is an uplift assisted enduro format, something styled on Trans Savoie maybe…

    scottfitz
    Free Member

    What we really need is an uplift assisted enduro format, something styled on Trans Savoie maybe…

    9th may 2015 Glencoe, Scotland. Bluegrass enduro tour 😉

    Edit: mass start too 😉

    Ecky-Thump
    Free Member

    ….where’s the “like” button…?

Viewing 40 posts - 121 through 160 (of 172 total)

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