^^

similarly, ARD Rock Enduro,

Ard Rock Enduro (40km lap, 5 timed stages) – Sunday 9 August 2015
‘Ard Rock Enduro Sport (35km, 3 timed stages) – Saturday 8 August 2015
‘Ard Rock All-Mountain Challenge (35km single timed lap) – Saturday 8 August 2015

that bottom ones a single lap xc race surely

chakaping – Member
This only happened in your head though, didn’t it?

Well there seems to be a whole industry based on slapping the word Enduro on any product possible and people buy it to “be Enduro”. Racing seems to have little to do with it.

And before that it was all mountain.
Before that it was free ride
Before that it was ….

Well there seems to be a whole industry based on slapping the word Enduro on any product possible and people buy it to “be Enduro”. Racing seems to have little to do with it.

Yeah there’s tons of marketing but these supposed enduro fashion victims don’t actually exist, or I haven’t met any of them. Even at enduro races.

Not done races so can’t comment there, but plenty sport the Enduro look in the Surrey Hills, complete with the goggles and trail lid. Though arguably there’s a practical element to the goggles.

And as I say the local “Enduro” races near me seem to be all XC riders, but then the formats don’t appear to be Enduro anyway despite using Enduro in the race name. I don’t know, this is what confuses me.

Ironically that third option at ‘Ard Rock is the one that appeals to me the most. I’m sure the riding is fun at these Enduro wotsits, but when it comes to sorting out the ‘results’ I don’t really understand why you ignore the uphill bits.

Well I do, it’s DH racing for people that don’t want to do DH racing, for whatever reason.

Nothing wrong with it, but it’s a shame that there’s so many people that aren’t interested in trying on the climbs and we then don’t have a series of xc races where the descents are properly good fun.

If you kept the stage format, but with ups and downs scored and a points system that balances out the value in being fast up and fast down (So that being 20s faster down the descent isn’t negated by someone being a minute quicker on a 30 minute climb) you’d have something pretty cool. And keeping stages means you can set off people on the descents at good intervals so they’re not ruined by mincers.

But I need to sort myself out and get out on my bike a lot more often before I start worrying about what races are out there!

I don’t see whats so hard to understand about it. You’re racing trails that vary from ones that could be ridden on an XC bike to ones a lot of people would ride DH bikes on (the breadth of mountain biking) on the lightest bike you can find because you also have to pedal uphill.

It’s not the same as an XC race because an XC race is a race up the hills, i.e. pretty much always a sufferfest, and is not won by the best bike handler but the fittest person.

It’s appealing because it makes a race out of the kind of trails that you would ride normally. If you want to ride those trails normally on a light titanium singlespeed 29er; that’s great for you, but that isn’t the fastest kind of bike over them. You can call it “a sunday XC ride”, but all that implies is that you are going slowly. Unsurprisingly, if you wanted to race your mates down the kind of singletrack trails you ride in the UK on a regular basis, you’d probably want to be riding a 6 inch 650b bike.

But that’s the sensible answer and most people in this thread are just trolling.

jeez, those^^^ bikes take a beating eh!

Have a look at the ISDE.
That kind of a beating for six days in a row with only rider maintenance on them and very limited spare parts.
And not a bottle cage in sight.

I do find it funny all thelse fat bike riding, lumbersexuals picking on #Enduro for being a ridiculous dayglo fashion fest full of Audi ****… People in glass houses hurling breeze blocks, etc…

Where’s that then?
I’m just seeing a bit of banter and some people trying to adopt a name from a sport that’s been going on for a long long time.

You’re more than welcome to ride whatever bike you ride in whatever fashion you like.
Just remember one thing though.
It’s all fanying about on kids toys in the woods. 8)

Even propper Enduro.

I went to a bike park once and was overwhelmed by all the DH fashion victims. Full face helmets, pads pretty much everywhere, loose fitting clothing and special “Downhill” bikes. As if you need all that to mince down a hill – it’s just mountainbiking right? What a pathetic bunch of marketing victims.

Not to mention all the XC specific gear out there. It’s basically just doing a few laps around the local woods so why would you need lycra or special jerseys or helmets or bikes for that? Just call it mountainbiking and be done with this silliness.

http://troll.me/images/futurama-fry/not-sure-if-ironic-or-just-stupid.jpg%5B/IMG%5D

Should see the DH kids at Swinley 😆

Or “mountain bikers” as we called them when I was young.

Should see the DH kids at Swinley

not sure what your point is
is it fashion victim related?
or is it terrain related?

The issue is that the UK calls marathons (long XC races) enduros. So things like the Brass Monkeys are marathons, but we call them enduros. Thus when enduros came over here we called them gravity enduros, seems now they’ve gained sufficient traction that Enduro now generally means the gravity type, but some long XC events still use the moniker.

The problem is people on STW think that 40k around bridleways is mountain biking or that the “Gnarly” video really is “gnarly” let alone a trail worth riding.

Again. Go do an EWS and your hardtail with 130mm forks and you’ll soon realise your bike is shit/your shit and that aside from the marketing BS it’s a really good racing format.

people on STW think that 40k around bridleways is mountain biking

Thank **** I’m on the right forum then

Go do an EWS and your hardtail with 130mm forks and you’ll soon realise your bike is shit/your shit and that aside from the marketing BS it’s a really good racing format.

JCL.
Go and do an ISDE and you’ll soon realise you’re just pissing around in the woods on a kids toy. 😉
Enduro my arse.
Go and nick an identity from another sport. 😛

I’m not trolling in the slightest. But the bit I struggle with about Enduro races is that it’s racing trails you’d normally ride on your normal trail bike. I’m sure I’m not alone in usually riding these trails as fast as I can anyway, so why do I want to pay someone for the privilege of getting a piece of paper that says I was faster than X, but slower than Y. Just seems a bit unnecessary when you bear in mind all the faff that’s then tacked onto what would be a normal ride.

I’d point out that if you want technical timed downhills there’s another option, but appreciate that lots of people want to race without buying another bike.

Is it just Downhill for fat-knackers? Now I’m trolling.

that just brought back memories of the “expert enduro rider (motorbike)” walking his bike down the Ft.Bill WC track 🙂

I have to agree with JCL. For me 40k around bridleways is not mountain biking . And that gnarly trail doesn’t look worth riding.

I’ve just been watching various EWS footage on youtube..

Seems to me like even the enduro discipline attracts it’s share of inept mincers that can’t stay on for toffee

expert enduro rider

Did he give you any credentials with that?
World rounds?
European rounds?
British rounds?
Six Days?

Or just an “expert” at a local H and H event.

Just like any sport anyone can tell you they’re an “expert”

When it comes to Enduros the word you need to hear is “Championship” not Expert.
Or just look for the red numberplate.

paulrockliffe – Member
I’m not trolling in the slightest. But the bit I struggle with about Enduro races is that it’s racing trails you’d normally ride on your normal trail bike. I’m sure I’m not alone in usually riding these trails as fast as I can anyway, so why do I want to pay someone for the privilege of getting a piece of paper that says I was faster than X, but slower than Y. Just seems a bit unnecessary when you bear in mind all the faff that’s then tacked onto what would be a normal ride.

I’d point out that if you want technical timed downhills there’s another option, but appreciate that lots of people want to race without buying another bike.

Is it just Downhill for fat-knackers? Now I’m trolling.

Unfortunately DH races are actually boring as **** for the most part. Saturday is generally ok, depending on the venue, but Sunday….. 2-3 practice runs, sit on your arse (in the cold unless you’ve got a camper) for 3 hours, race run, sit on your arse for 3 hours, race run, home – add in the joys waiting at the start and red flags too. One of the main things that sells Enderpo to me is cutting away all of that crap.

When you’re a DHer, racing is just on trails you normally ride a DH bike on.
When you’re an XCer, racing is just on normally ride an XC bike on.
ENDURO is just the same for trail bikes

Did he give you any credentials with that?

Yes, luckily he was carrying copies of his CV that day 🙄
It was years ago, he talked a very good game, he walked down, it was funny. There endith my interest

he talked a very good game, he walked down, it was funny.

I’d have lOled too. Bet he was good at following a rut and bimbling around like an “expert”.
Is an “expert” like a “legend”? 😛

40k around bridleways is not mountain biking .

perhaps you could clarify something for me; which of the UK Enduros take place on mountains?

That’s not mountain biking, that’s sliding down a hill with style

Is an “expert” like a “legend”?

Sorry, are you having a pop for some reason? If so, don’t be a ****

Are you serious…

You do have jokes in not fast enough for DH, not fit enough for XC land “enduroland” don’t you.

40k around bridleways is not mountain biking .

perhaps you could clarify something for me; which of the UK Enduros take place on mountains?
Don’t know if this is a proper enduro or a proper mountain for that matter

http://www.bluegrasseagle.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=186:glencoe-2015&catid=92:tappe-bet-2015

singlespeedstu – Member
Are you serious…

You do have jokes in “enduroland” don’t you.

Right, so you are just being an arsehole now? Have a word

I’ll leave you to your serious persuit of trail riding against the clock then. 😐

I remember when it actualy was people pissing about on bikes in the woods without thinking they were all of teh gnars…

soobalias – Member
not sure what your point is
is it fashion victim related?
or is it terrain related?

Both 😀

Very little elevation and a couple of tables and jumps, and they’re turning up in full PJs and armour, big rig DH bikes. The pros turn up sometimes for a play and they’re on trail bikes, in baggy shorts or even jeans.

Though to be fair many of the kids can’t manage to get out to Aston, Rotate etc.

Not that I’ve ever understood the practical reason for the PJs in downhill, but then I’m not a downhiller.

Still, then you have the weekend warriors with big camelbaks full of spares for every eventuality. I’m one of them 😀 . Though I am trying to cut down on what I carry and just be confident I won’t need any of it.

njee20 – Member
The issue is that the UK calls marathons (long XC races) enduros. So things like the Brass Monkeys are marathons, but we call them enduros. Thus when enduros came over here we called them gravity enduros, seems now they’ve gained sufficient traction that Enduro now generally means the gravity type, but some long XC events still use the moniker.

That explains my confusion actually, cheers. Have different groups of people I ride with and talk of Enduro comes up but seems they are referring to different things.

I fancy trying one myself. The ard rock looks good as a weekender. And I tell you something right now!! If I see any of these yellow clad enduro types mincing about on a carbon enduro rigs turning up in their 30k Audis… I’ll be thinking to myself! Nice car, nice bike, he’s probably worked hard for that. On a serious note can anyone reccomend a couple of the more fun enduros please? Pref not trail center ones as I’d rather they were something a bit different.

Part of the problem is that ‘Enduro’ has been used by many different race formats over the years.

There are indeed long cross-country type races where the ‘enduro’ implies ‘endurance’. These are not what people generally mean, but the organisers have been using the name for years in cases, so fair play.

What is normally meant is an event involving several gravity fuelled races down timed stages with non timed transitions between stages but there is usually an overall time limit and if start gates are used you probably have a target time to be at each trailhead or face a penalty. The transitions are largely there to stop people rocking up on downhill bikes as they’ll need to ride up lots of hills. This is where the big 160mm bikes come in – for those with the cash it’s an arms race to get the closestthing to DH suspension while still having a pedal able bike. As with all biking, many fall into the idea that buying a fancier bike will give them an advantage. Plenty of roadie clubbers do this also, so it’s hardly news. The descent stages can get quite fast and some series are now requiring stuff like full Face helmets. Usually there will be stuff in there that you can’t legitimately ride everyday.

It’s a bandwagon, sure. People are milking it, and some people take it way too seriously. It’s also still pretty grassroots though, so in theory, even big stuff like UKGE could be won by your mate if they showed at every race and rode like they stole it. Which is nice.

Hardtails are still in use, but rare. Someone did Ardrock on a tandem with yellow Crossmaxes last year. Speaking of Ardrock, the main two events use the same loop but time differently – thus the emphasis is different. The ‘All Mountain Challenge’ times and places overall for the loop from start to finish so is for racing snakes who can walk the descents if they wish but mostly ride them. The ‘Enduro’ times the descent stages and places based on these, so time between stages is not important.

I’m really not sure what the problem is. It’s all good fun if you want to play that game, and there are plenty of other race formats to play with if you don’t like it. Not racing at all is also a perfectly good option.

I do really like that ‘what is enduro?’ video with the lycra guys falling over lots though – a great send up of the industry fashion obsessions…

Apologies for wall of text… Cup of tea needed I think 🙂

40k around bridleways is not mountain biking .

Depends where the bridleways go surely? Have you not ridden in the Lakes?

scotroutes – Member

perhaps you could clarify something for me; which of the UK Enduros take place on mountains?

The UK is largely mountain-incompatible.

Hmm. OK, just because I fancy a pedantic argument- SES round 1 this year was on aonach mor, but we didn’t actually go very far up it. So is that mountain biking, since we were on a mountain? I’m pretty sure we got higher above sea level at most other rounds and at the EWS but most of those were on hills. So I suppose riding up the first 1% of a mountain must be mountain biking but riding to the top of a 599 metre hill isn’t.

How about kinlochleven? We went about 400 metres up na gruagaichean but then we traversed over onto meall na duibhe which is only a hill for the descending. It’s enduro so the climbing doesn’t count so that must be hillbiking (a scotsmen who went up a mountain but came down a hill).

(hey- I didn’t notice before but the highest point of Glentress, Dunslair Heights, is 602 metres high, and therefore by UK government definition, a mountain. But just under 2000 feet so most people will call it a hill. And I’m not sure if that definition applies in Scotland. So the EWS and King of the Hill may have been a mountain)

You were supposed to read the next line too. Unless of course…..

singlespeedstu – Member – Quote
You do have jokes in not fast enough for DH, not fit enough for XC land “enduroland” don’t you.

Has anyone posited the suggestion that Enduro is to MTB what Sportives are to road?

😉

scotroutes – Member

You were supposed to read the next line too.

Yeah but then I couldn’t have had a pedantic argument. Now I’m having two! What larks

The problem is people on STW think that 40k around bridleways is mountain biking or that the “Gnarly” video really is “gnarly” let alone a trail worth riding.
Again. Go do an EWS and your hardtail with 130mm forks and you’ll soon realise your bike is shit/your shit and that aside from the marketing BS it’s a really good racing format.

Comments like this make me understand why Enduro is seen as so accessible, and filled with people having fun. Whilst XC racing is full of elitist tossers. Oh… Wait.