Diets fall into one of the following:

Low Carb
Low Fat
Reduced Calories

This is regardless of what they may be called – Slimming World, Atkins, Paleo, 5:2, Cambridge, Keto, Lean in 15, Weight Watchers et al.

Choose which works best for you and combine it with a decent exercise programme. Consistency is the key to sustainable results.

Jamie – Member 
Source = sauce = tomato sauce = full of sugar

I consider tomato sauce an essential food that I cannot survive without. If ever I needed a blood transfusion I think my blood type is Heinz Tomato Ketchup. 😀

Regarding the Protinaholic book. There is a very long and detailed critique on it online that show huge inaccuracies in it content. The critique is a very long read.

Proteinaholic: Is it Time to Sober Up From Animal Foods? (A Review and Critique)

In summary it is not a great piece of work.

Difficulty with diets is after restricting yourself for weeks or months, you tend to go back to your old eating habits after the end of the diet. Which means your current weight.

Mayby look at some permanent changes, eat more natural non processed foods, cut out snacking, slightly reduce plate portion etc.

I dislike the word diet because it implies a temporary change. I changed what I ate because of health issues and have found a balance that I can stick with so far, 10 months in. It’s not cheap either. Nuts are damned expensive and the amount of salad I eat is really expensive. Have to get a green house going I think!

Simple rules for me are no snacks after tea (dinner for our southern friends) till breakfast. Keeps the old blood sugar stable. After dinner if I’m not riding in the evening I go for a walk 45mins with the pog every night hopefully keeps the old metabolism going.

Would be interested to see if you can stick with it for 6 months+

I’ll be giving it 6mths minimum, or 4stone weight loss, whichever comes first. Then gradually switching to a paleo type ‘lifestyle’ (not diet).

Mayby look at some permanent changes, eat more natural non processed foods, cut out snacking, slightly reduce plate portion etc.

Did all that. Lasted a good couple of years. Worked pretty well. Then a massive family crisis, divorce, job change, house change (x3) happened. It crept up gradually, but chocolate and bread did their thing.

Medium to high intensity exercise is fueled 70-100% carbs

Depends on your adaptation. It tends to be the case in the untrained, but in the highly trained fat is used predominantly. There are a load of Keto-athletes showing how this is done. I intend becoming one of them (and I’m now up to 90% of previous FTP).

It’s the sustainability of these diets I find interesting. Would be interested to see if you can stick with it for 6 months+. As in my experience very few can. Partly due to the impracticalities of eating sans carbs on the go, etc.
[/quote]That was my downfall. I did stick with it for about 8-9 months (even allowing for the mandatory weekly carb day) even though I love pasta too much. I found that trying to find food in various ad hoc locations made it extremely difficult to avoid carbs.

Can’t you only store so much carbohydrate for conversion to energy. Where as your body can keep fuelling you from fat for much longer or so I thought?

Can’t you only store so much carbohydrate for conversion to energy.

True which is why portion sizes are important and cutting out all carb is a bit silly, they are a really good source of energy

Where as your body can keep fuelling you from fat for much longer or so I thought?

How much are you burning a day? It’s probably a key point of your racing the TdF but not if your off to the office every day.

There are a load of Keto-athletes showing how this is done. I intend becoming one of them (and I’m now up to 90% of previous FTP).

Simple question? Is it worth it? Seems to be a lot of effort to get nearly back to where you were.

I think portion size is the key as you say Mike but even going carb free as in rice pasta and bread you are still getting carbohydrate from veg. The problem is as you say portion control and the fact that it seems to cause a craving due to a spike and crash in blood sugar. I still eat carbohydrate but I’ve cut it right down to an arbitrary level that I think is about right. Rising obesity levels would suggest that this is really hard to control. I would suggest mixing the carbohydrate with fibre so it takes longer to digest.

Depends on your adaptation. It tends to be the case in the untrained, but in the highly trained fat is used predominantly. There are a load of Keto-athletes showing how this is done. I intend becoming one of them (and I’m now up to 90% of previous FTP).

got any proof for that?

Day 1 – I skipped breakfast, breaking the first Atkins rule of not going longer than 6hrs between meals.
Not sure what im going to do for lunch, probably a couple of eggs and a chicken breast.
I think I have a pre-sugar crash sympathy headache coming on..

There are a load of Keto-athletes showing how this is done

Who are these keto-gods?

My guess is that if it works for anyone then it’s limited to ultra-running and endurance swimming… basically only events where the individual dictates the pace and maintains efforts well below threshold.

Just to be argumentative, I would say it’s similar

well, you could…You’d be wrong (if we just being argumentative), but you could say it. 😆

C’mon, Molgrips. I know you’re reading this and want to weigh in.

😉

Jamie today…

want to weigh in

That’s Weight Watchers.

Japanese PoW diet is pretty effective for fast weight loss.

Restricted portions and hard work. Effective on all participants.

Amazed no-one has commercialised it.

Day 2: Minging headache last night. Sat on my sofa fantacising about a large glass of Vimto, or a nice fizzy Coka Zero. Substituted these for a diet water.
Hooray.

Fat burning diets need a high water intake. I reckon you are dehydrated.

Consistency is the key to sustainable results.

Indeed. Make the change and make it permanent.

I believe the Scottish Enduro Series masters champion follows a ketogenic diet

So we have one then?

Day 2: Minging headache last night.

This is very common when becoming fat adapted.

https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/side-effects

🙄

THe simplest of internet searches reveals lots more but the statement was

My guess is that if it works for anyone then it’s limited to ultra-running and endurance swimming…

and I only needed to mention 1 to prove TSY wrong 8)

*mutters under breath about niche athletes*

Fair play sir, and in a sport that requires some explosive power too.

The stuff I’ve read (and is what comes up with a simple search) shows if anything a decline in performance for highly trained athletes by following a keto diet.

Maybe he could be British Champ with carbs?

I’ll put my hand up and say I’m not clued up, but I listen to a lot of podcasts where it’s being talked about. There’s something there but the jury will still be out on the suitability across all sport and the long term impact

The Southern Yeti

Maybe he could be British Champ with carbs?

People on low carb diets can and some do take carbs strategically when they might need them. Apparently those on low carb diets will respond better to carbs when they are introduced to them they would on a “normal” diet.

Anyway, for examples of high level athletes on low carb and ketogenic diets you can look at mixed martial artists, probably the most complex set of demands you could ever put on the body. Due to weight categories and weight cutting being prevalent in mma ketogenic/low carb diets are now very common to allow athletes to lose as much body fat as possible prior to the fight.

But really, unless you’re an elite athlete don’t worry about elite athletes.

There’s something there but the jury will still be out on the suitability across all sport and the long term impact

The point really being is it delivering a boost to performance or are people just managing to get along with it.

Sounds like carb-cycling / periodisation of nutrition for the MMA fellas. Bit like training in a sauna to lose weight for boxing weigh ins.

But you’re right,

unless you’re an elite athlete don’t worry about elite athletes

this is a total digression.

The Southern Yeti

Sounds like carb-cycling / periodisation of nutrition for the MMA fellas.

Somewhat, but a lot are sticking to low carb diets year round to remain relatively lean, then going ketogenic during the 8-10 week prep for a fight to get super lean (and of course they lose water weight too). So they certainly train incredibly hard on low carb diets.

this is a total digression.

Is the thread which diet is best for elite world class athletes?

Is the thread which diet is best for elite world class athletes?

Hence why I agreed it was a digression. Maybe it should be about that now…

You got any links to the MMA stuff? Sounds more interesting than talking about Atkins any more.

The Southern Yeti

You got any links to the MMA stuff? Sounds more interesting than talking about Atkins any more.

Nope, sorry. But if you google there are dozens of rabbit holes you can go down. Through social media and promo vlogs etc you can see what an awful lot of these guys are eating and low carb / ketogenic staples seem to constitute the vast majority of their meals. A number of trainers and dieticians have spoken about it at length too but most stop short of labeling it low carb/ketogenic probably because they don’t want to be perceived as just copy and paste merchants.

Weighed myself at the GP clinic this morning. Yup. Currently heaviest ever. Im genuinely too embarrassed to even fess up.

On a positive note, hunger pangs have been flat for last 24hrs – I already feel like I can sustain this for the forseeable.

Breath is currently only as stinky as usual too.

Through social media and promo vlogs etc you can see what an awful lot of these guys are eating and low carb / ketogenic

Just Rogan, innit? (onnit?)

If I remember right, Miesha Tate went on the keto diet, then got steamrolled by Nunes at UFC 200.

Which obviously proves nothing, but only fighter I remember to adopt LCHF during training camp.

Yep, I’ve read a couple of things about how badly many fighters fare on LCHF type diets, particularly around the time when they’re trying to cut for a fight.

Perhaps adopting an LCHF diet doesn’t really change their bodies requirement for carbohydrate as a fuel for explosive movement?

I imagine those that generally claim something akin to LCHF are fueling around exercise like on the iDiet.

Jamie

If I remember right, Miesha Tate went on the keto diet, then got steamrolled by Nunes at UFC 200.

There’s no diet in the world that’ll prevent you going unconscious when a Brazilian Jiu-jitsu black belt is choking you 😉

Plenty of others appear to be on lchf diets but don’t call it that as they’re obviously just eating what they are told. I woudn’t put much credit in in fight performance, the day to day training will actually be as hard if not significantly harder.

I personally had no problems 1-2hrs of grappling while on a ketogenic diet.

I don’t mind digression, but I draw the line at UFC.

KFC, maybe.

Just take the batter off.