Hoping for some advice. Neighbour is running a foul (I believe) drain through our garden. What depth should it be sunk to to meet regs?

Personally i would want it as deep as possible, within reason, obviously they have to be able make the connection downstream.
Foul pipes should be laid at min 1:80 graidient if it has at least 1 toilet connected and min 100mm dia, 1:40 if no toilet connected, 150mm pipe can be laid slacker if more toilets connected, but not really recommended.
Depth shoul be min 600mm cover to soffit (top of pipe) if located in landscaped areas. Min 900mm to soffit in drives, min 1200mm to soffit in highways.
There is a bit of give and take if the pipe is surrounded with concrete but those depths should see you right.

I don’t think there is an official minimum. Just needs to be unlikely to get damaged so can be pretty shallow if in concrete. Electrics and water are usually 600mm to be protected from damage so that’s probably a reasonable figure across a garden. Also as soon as it crosses a boundary it’s technically a public sewer and the water company like to be involved.

Ok so 290mm is probably cutting it a bit fine :/

Just deep enough so you can still hit it whilst digging the borders!!

Is that full depth or cover?

I wouldn’t let them lay that pipe in my garden, especially if it’s any where near where someone may want to put an extension or shed/ out house one day.

We’ve a strange layout but in effect it’s a border running along the side of their house. There is no risk to anything being built, only thing is us gardening. They’ve already ruined our garden doing it as they’ve taken all plants out of the border and just yesterday chopped half the roots from the 35yr old magnolia as they’ve decided to change the route of the pipe. Fingers crossed it survives as it’s the only one we wanted leaving untouched.

290mm is to top of pipe from ground level.

Why have you let them ruin your garden?

Foul pipes should be laid at min 1:80 graidient if it has at least 1 toilet connected and min 100mm dia, 1:40 if no toilet connected, 150mm pipe can be laid slacker if more toilets connected, but not really recommended.
Depth shoul be min 600mm cover to soffit (top of pipe) if located in landscaped areas. Min 900mm to soffit in drives, min 1200mm to soffit in highways.
There is a bit of give and take if the pipe is surrounded with concrete but those depths should see you right.

No offence but quite a bit of that is incorrect and hugely impractical.

Not ideal at all but at that depth i’d want it capping with 75mm min of concrete. That would protect it from being struck from above whilst still allowing it to be backfilled with soil. As for running tight past a tree that is just asking for trouble especially as thyre greatly reduced the trees stability. Do they have some kind of easement to come across your land?

Do they have permission to connect into the public sewer. I used to work in the water industry and the arrangement you describe is fraught with issues. Why are they routing through your property?

wrightyson you’ve reminded me of something that was passed on when we bought the house regarding easement, I’m going to dig out the plans tonight and take a look. The houses were built in 1675 and I remember some strange agreements from the documents we received. What’s the best photo sharing site as I’ll get some pictures up.

As to why we let them ruin our garden, thought we were being good neighbours as they are renovating their house (just like us). The work being done at winter has meant a lot of issues but I’ll share some photos later when I’m in from work.

Is this a new drain or repair of existing? Do they have an existing easement or covenant in their/your deeds? If not how much are you charging them?

building regs

There is no risk to anything being built

but you;re giving up that right in perpetuity and also effectively giving any future owner access to dig the pipe up again.

As above, are they paying and have you had it looked at legally?

Do mortgage companies worry about this sort of thing?

That will become a shared drain as its from his property and is running across someone elses property even though the other person isn’t connecting into it at that point.

The local water authority will be responsible for the future maintenance of it.

There is paperwork to do as you might imagine!

https://www.yorkshirewater.com/sites/default/files/downloads/Private%20Sewer%20Transfer%20Regulations.pdf

No offence but quite a bit of that is incorrect and hugely impractical.

It may be impracticable to domestic builders, but it’s what civil engineers design to, so it’s not incorrect it’s all in building regs and sewers for adoption.

I must let my engineers know the next time we put up a domestic 160000 sq ft shed 😉

If we’re playing construction scheme top trumps, i’m just designing the drainage and highways for a 174 plot housing estate. 😉
Pics are rubbish but it’s all there.

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I must let my engineers know the next time we put up a domestic 160000 sq ft shed

If they don’t know that most of what ads678 is right, then maybe you should…

🙂

If it was a new build, Sewers for Adoption (7th) for a public lateral drain states:

0.35m cover to domestic gardens without vehicular access
0.5m domestic driveways, parking areas (7.5 tonnes GVW limit)
0.9m domestic driveways, parking areas, narrow streets without footways (>7.5 GVW)
1.2m other highways.

I’d be more concerned about legal and liability issues than practicalities though.

As for in the highway spec, yup all for that, however I’d wager not all connections in to housing are done at those depths. 900mm is not required in domestic driveways, and if we’re really nit picking the soffit is not the top of a pipe. 😉
However….. i did think min fall on 100mm was 1/100 on foul and I’m sure that weve put pipes in to that, am I right in thinking 1/150 on 150mm with 4 toilets +

5 toilets for 150 @ 1:150. Building regs will generally allow pipes of 150mm dia and above to be laid at a gradient of no less than the dia. I will always try to design to the hydraulic tables in order to achieve self cleansing velocity though. But we all know that 100mm @ 1:100 will usually work though. just don’t eat too much steak!

Obviously I know as a civil engineer everything we do is generally over designed but if we don’t we get problems, cos stuff gets pushed too far the other way.

and if we’re really nit picking the soffit is not the top of a pipe.

I know this, but this is a bike forum so I doubt the OP cares!! 🙂

That 4mm on a plastic pipe could make all the difference to his planting options 😆

Interesting thread. The plans for our house show a sewer running at the border at the back, as there is a row of 30-40m tall ash trees very close to this I assumed that the drain was unused but then the neighbour found a drain cover to it under his patio (makes a changes from find wives under them) and then last week I uncovered a drain cover for a drain from our house going presumably to the sewer. This also has trees growing directly above it.
I hope the drain / sewer is deep enough!

Edit
from Severn Trent website:

The following trees and those of similar size, be they deciduous or evergreen, should
not be planted within 6 metres of a sewer, water main or other STW apparatus. E.g.
Ash, Beech, Birch, most Conifers, Elm, Horse Chestnut, Lime, Oak, Sycamore, Apple
and Pear.

Oh dear, there is also leylandii, apple and pear trees above the sewer as well as the Ash trees.

You need to put a sketch on the thread, I’d be concerned that it’s being bodged with a possible illegal connection to the sewer as well as all the liability issues arising

Thank you everyone, pictures and drawings been prepared tonight.

I always thought the soffit was the underside of the eaves or underside of a lintol maybe whereas the top of a drain is the crown and most measuring is from the invert level but then everyday is a learning day
Easement must be an English law term new to me where in Scots law its a dominant tenement

The soffit of a pipe is the top inside the pipe, the top outside the pipe is the crown as you say.

Depth stuff always just gets referred to as cover to soffit, ignoring the different thicknesses of pipe material and junction sockets. Gradients are measured to invert level.

It’s a fun old world I live in…..

So… the plot thickens.

I’ve dug out all the plans and old documents that came with the house including the land registry. Straight from it reads:
Note: From the Southern boundary of the land contracted to be sold along the line A B C is situated two feet from the outer walls of the cottage and house respectively.

Seems he owns the two foot of land he’s bunging the pipe in, and we simply have a bit of extra garden, if he lets us! The risk, now that he’s dug up all our plants, is he simply puts gravel back and tells us to foxtrot oscar.

I’ve also just found out from his tradesmen that the bricked up windows facing our house are being put back in. I’d thought I’d do a bit of digging on the local planning portal as we’ve (just before Christmas) had to submit listed building consent to change some windows (both houses are listed).

So found the consent submission and he’s been told that:
– all gutters/pipes have to be cast iron. Had a look tonight, the ones on the front of his house are, the ones we look over…all black plastic
– English Heritage have been requested by the council to do a report due to the amount of works done to date without consent. One key stipulation is to leave all windows as is but he’s installing new!
– He’s submitted a plan leaving currently bricked up windows bricked up. Tonight the windows aren’t bricked up anymore and his tradesmen tell me windows are going in over looking us

So do I;
– chill and have a beer, it is what it is
– get in touch with him to talk it all through
– contact the council to let them know what’s happening, bearing in mind they will be round to see our own house in the next few weeks
– another suggestion from the Hive mind

Stick a big ass fence up in front of his window.
Or start sunbathing naked.

We live in Yorkshire so naked sunbathing for the two days of the year it’s warm and a fence for the rest.

I’d certainly report to the council and possible to whoever the conservation body is? English heritage?

You have to live with Mr dickhead very close by so choose your moves carefully. If its going to be really obvious that you grassed him up then think long and hard about it.

wrightyson, didn’t realise you knew him 😀

That’s been half the battle for some time, the neighbour on his other side gives me stick as he’s at home all the time (retired), ultimately I don’t want the hassle and animosity but also don’t like being screwed/lied to when you’ve tried to help and support where you can.

Does anyone know, when someone has listed building consent on a grand scale, if the listings office should/would make trips to see the property

Your local planning authority aka the council will have a conservation team that will be very familiar with this sort of thing. Pick up the phone and suggest popping over to see how the works are coming on

Meanwhile give him a sh!teating grin and tell him to crack on with the drains.