Tragic accident that should never of happened.

Boat accident

Lesson identified – always use a kill cord.

Sounds like a real shame and was only stopped from becoming worse by a local doing something brave and jumping on board the out of control boat.

As far as I’m aware nothing has been said about the kill switch by the lifeguard yet (though the Mail seems to have apportioned blame already….)
While the boat clearly didn’t stop no one has said the kill switch wasn’t attached/ working so it remains to be seen what happened.
Either way it is a shame 🙁 but good that the lifeguard was on hand and knew what to do.

It is very unlikely that the kill switch was attached and failed to stop the engine.
The lifeguard/coastguard will not be saying anything yet as it potentially a scene of crime. Also the MAIB will also be investigating.

Lifeguard deserves a civilian medal for that.

Unlikely but still a possibility, at this moment no one knows. I can’t help feeling that a family is going through hell and people are jumping to conclusions about the competence of the father without any evidence for it. I know this is sacrilege to say on STW, but opinion is not everything 🙁

Sooner they licence speedboats and jetski’s the better.

Lifeguard deserves a civilian medal for that.

Couldn’t agree more. Unfortunately for him it wasn’t a lifeguard that stopped the boat, it was a local business owner who isn’t used to seeing what he did. A very brave bloke and I’m ashamed to admit that I don’t think I could have done what he did.

This happened a few years back in the Solent. Driver not having Kill Cord attached = game over.

I always attach mine and always have a spare should I go overboard with passengers on board.

I do wonder what the initial upset was that threw them all off. Sometimes the hydraulic steering can fail locked over.

So tragic and sad for all concerned particularly when it was avoidable.
Hats off to Mr Toogood.

Good to see the knee jerk “license them” reaction, even the various marine associations disagree, its a pretty rare accident. Don’t spoil it for the masses (been power boating since I was a sprog, worst accidents I’ve seen have been sail boats!).

I suspect he was just cornering too hard over rough stuff and the rear span out, seen it happen a couple of times. Generally doesn’t cause a problem but in a loaded boat with people not expecting it it could end badly.

Generally, investigate, conclude, inform, act. If something comes to light early then raise it. In a situation like this to speculate without being in possession of the facts is harsh on the victims. Wait until they know what happened before getting all preachy.

Indeed. Though human error is almost always the most likely, not suggesting he was acting irresponsibly at all though, its easy to get caught out.

MS, I certainly haven’t made any uniformed speculation or preaching in case you think I did. If a serviceable kill cord was worn correctly this wouldn’t have happened. No debate! No preaching, just facts I’m afraid.

Nothing I say worsens that facts of this tragedy. Merely that, as I’m sure they are aware already, this was avoidable. A kill cord failure would occur if it was so rotten it separated but then a driver would have checked the kit (cord condition and function of the kill switch) before taking the boat away from the shore (wouldn’t he??!); the spare would have been used in that case, making it difficult to get caught out.

If the cord was knackered and no spare was available, or the kill switch was inoperative the boat would have been unfit to take to the water, I’d have thought.

I’d be very happy to see Licencing for both power and sail. As you say sailing can be hazardous too. Having lost a friend through a negligent power boat driver and seen unlit RIBs on the Solent getting their lift to the pub at full whack I think there should be stricter control. As an operator of both, I see many more imbeciles in power boats and jet skis than I do in sailboats.

I wish a speedy recovery to the injured.

Just to add, I’m fully aware you can’t legislate for freak waves, objects in the water etc etc. just like you can’t against trees falling into roads etc. You can, however, ensure people have attended adequate training courses to use the kit. I guess it comes down to admin costs and a powerful (and understandable) notion that the seas are the last area of freedom.

Good to see the knee jerk “license them” reaction,

not really a knee-jerk reaction. I’ve thought it for many years living in the south west and seeing a steadily increasing number of complete **** putting themselves and others in danger.

To even get a sail boat to move in the correct direction needs a bit of skill and understanding of the principles.

A powerboat is much easier to operate when everything is going well.

If a serviceable kill cord was worn correctly this wouldn’t have happened.

Totally agree.

If the person “driving” the boat was using a kill cord then the boat engine would have stopped when they were thrown from the boat. I cannot think of any reasons why it wouldn’t have.

When the investigation is complete this message should be put out by the media to prevent it happening again.

Sadly, winston, this has happened before and will happen again.

“There are no new accidents. Merely old ones waiting to happen again.”

While I understand the viewpoint calling for us to wait for the marine report and inquest, that may not be for months. The safety aspect needs pointing out now, while it’s in the MSM, not in eighteen months’ time, as a paragraph in an inquest reported on page 8.

Tragic as the story is, I’m a bit baffled by the amount of media coverage it’s getting.

vorlich – check the job of the man who died. That plus children being involved, public heroism, and video of the incident.

I suspect he was just cornering too hard over rough stuff and the rear span out

My feeling also and with a 300 on the back that would also make it more likely [especially if it didnt have contra-rotating props]. The only other thisng that I could think of was that the engine mounting had broken – but it certainly didnt look like that on the video.
Terrible tragedy.
edit: just watched the video…. boat looked to be operating fine once the guy had jumped aboard.

vorlich – Member
Tragic as the story is, I’m a bit baffled by the amount of media coverage it’s getting.

He was from the media world… …I suspect that gets you extra column inches. There is video of it unfolding that certainly gets you air time. Its a bank holiday weekend so relatively little domestic news? And actually it is relatively unusual which probably helps too. Another car crash or cyclist getting hit by a truck or soldier getting blown up by an IED isn’t really “news” anymore because its just like last weeks one.

vorlich – how about –

Senior management in a massive media organisation.

A child killed with (by?) their father on holiday.

Some of the other family members maimed.

Video of the boat.

A hero who is avoiding publicity.

As a story it has it all.

[especially if it didnt have contra-rotating props].

single engined so explain how that makes any difference?

I didn’t realise it was a 300hp outboard. That is a serious piece of kit.

If the person “driving” the boat was using a kill cord then the boat engine would have stopped when they were thrown from the boat. I cannot think of any reasons why it wouldn’t have.

not to tarnish the memory of the deceased, the only reason I can think of is the kill cord wasn’t attached to the driver. I’ve done it myself, the gravity of the consequences becomes less and less and like we do as drivers, riders and pedestrians we get comfortable in our surroundings. Detaching it from the person makes moving around the craft easier and i bet there’s a lot of sailors who’ve done it.

The RIB in question was a serious bit of kit and by all accounts it looked fairly decent spec. My money is very sadly on human error.

Just out of curiosity, and in general, would a big outboard default to hard over or to straight ahead hands off?

As a non-boaty type, do these things not have seat belts or is that just not practical?

I’ve seen the details, I saw the story on the news last night. Guess I’m not actually baffled, I know exactly why it’s getting the coverage it is.

Clearly a newsworthy story, but it’s not headline news. The way 24 hour news ghoulishly latch on to such tragedies to pad out their airtime doesn’t sit right with me.

Why should anyone care if the dad has a high flying job?

Guess I’d make a shitty editor.

AFAIK all outboards will start to circle eventually. However, this would have had quite a serious hydraulic powered steering system which would have held it in a position relative to the wheel position.

Generally speaking the wheel would be pulled over by the operator getting thrown out of the boat. Assuming they were holding the wheel at the time.

single engined so explain how that makes any difference?

You can have twin props on a engine – there are two drives shafts, one within the other, which rotate in opposite directions.
Our last boat had them (Mercury Bravo 3 outdrive).
The benefit of this is that there is much less torque steer as the rotation on one prop counteracts the rotation on the other – resulting in the boat not requiring trim tabs in order to run level [side to side]. With a single prop and enough power many boats will tend to lean slightly to the right as a single prop rotates clockwise.
Another benefit is that two props will grip the water better with less chance of cavitation.
This rib has a properly big engine – there is a reasonable chance that if a driver where to do a sharpish right hand turn on an incoming wave (basically for fun) while giving it plenty of throttle the prop could lose grip on the water and the back of the boat would quickly skip sideways in the same way you can get the back end of a car out.
if this happened chances are the boat would have tilted sharply to the right for a second or two. In a more ‘traditional’ powerboat this may not be such a big deal as you sit ‘in’ them (they have higher sides than the seat level), but you tend to sit more ‘on’ a rib as the seats are more level with the height of the tubes and it’s def easier to be thrown out.
There is also the possibility that the passengers were sitting on the side tubes rather than the seats.

Just out of curiosity, and in general, would a big outboard default to hard over or to straight ahead hands off?

As WD said, the power steering will hold it fairly straight but the action of hitting waves, plus a bit of torque steer, would fairly soon put it off course

Sooner they licence speedboats and jetski’s the better.

been power boating since I was a sprog, worst accidents I’ve seen have been sail boats!

I think the difference is sailing looks difficult, Joe Blogs on holliday is far more likely to pick up a 100hp jet ski and think he can ride it than he is any kind of sailing boat.

Not sure if licencing is relavent to this case, I’ve not seen anything reported as to whether he’d done all the training available (and then ignored it), or just got the biggest boat he could and had the inevitable accident.

Personaly i’d be in favour of licencing on the basisn that most responsible people probably already ahve their RYA certificates, but then that wouldn’t solve the issue of idiots being idiots, that would require policeing.

If its correct that it was 300hp outboard that’s a massive motor for the size of the boat. Lots of potential to get into trouble if you are not a very experienced and well trained power boat handler with that kind of power on tap for a boat that didn;t look much bigger than 17′ long. Is that really correct?

300hp is a bit ridiculous.

“When I was a lad” outboards were 40 or 50hp! A 70hp was considered big!

With that sort of power, depending on the hull, 50kts would probably be achievable.

Yeah when I was a lad we had a similar sized boat with a 90hp motor on the back, perfectly nice for water skiing behind so 300hp seems crazy.

Def 300 engine, single prop but the hull looks pretty big – reports say 26′ but I’m not convinced.
Very nice boat I’ve got to say but it does smack of ‘big rib’ syndrome (rich bloke buys the biggest he can in willy waving contest).
Seating for 6 but whether they were all seated is another matter.

The fact that all the occupants were flipped out is unusual. Kill cord was attached to the key (to the lower right of the wheel) but not the driver I’d bet. And BTW we are guessing that the father was driving – this may not be the case!

How safe does this look? This is an image from a sightseeing business website – very bad practice.

Looks very similar to this Cobra 8.6m

So about 28′. Big boat but 300hp would still seem overkill – very nice though!

Hope he was well insured, bet he wasnt though

The more I think about it the more I think they could have actually been throw out of the left hand side as it’s pretty difficult for the driver to be thrown out of a simple, sharp turn.
Driver turns sharply right in chop, back end spins out and boat goes sideways until hitting the water [sideways] and stopping very quickly. Boat goes from heeling sharply to the right to level/heeling to the left very quickly – occupants catapulted out by the pendulum effect.

Watch how this boat goes from one heel to the other extremely quickly as the hull digs into the water.
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=1UEETjztLqI#t=80s[/video]

Tide and/or water depth could also have been an issue – Padstow has some shallow sand bars and narrow channels – possible that engine bottomed out and caused the boat to pitch suddenly.