I currently own an orange five (yeah I know!) but want to start saving for a 150/160mm gravity enduro type bike.

I like the spicy 916 but can’t buy frame only.
I also like the idea of a Nicolai, hand made, very tailor-able bike, although not sure on ride ability etc.

Other bikes that made my list were yeti sb66c and mojo hd. Apart from hand made German stuff I think I’d like carbon!

So what do people think? Any experiences of nicolai? Any other 150/160 mm bikes that will descend fast and climb ok?

Thanks in advance.

sounds like a bit of an uber build – I thoroughly approve.

So, from experience, the NP mega climbs OK (very little bob, easy to keep the front down) and descends very well, and I guess you could spec it to the roof.

but it ain’t that fancy. More a dirty parts bin kinda bike.

Nicolai do look truly gopping (to me), but by all accounts are something else.

WOuld you entertain the idea of a all mountain 29er? Blank slate for me would be an Intense T29 with modded talas 180mm forks.

Kev

Own a Nicolai AM. Tha replaced a Nicolai FR I also own a CC

Superb bikes.

I like the way they look (many don’t) but they are just superb to ride. When I first bought the FR I test rode many alternatives but Nicolai was the best IMO.

The AM descends brillaintly and though harder work on the climbs it will get you up most stuff no problem (Mine is built on the heavy side – ie focussed on the downs)

Are they signifciantly better than other bikes? Of course not. Totally customizable, not that common and a 5 year transferrable warranty that also covers racing speaks volumes.

My next bike will be a Nicolai 🙂

Dunno why anyone would spend 1700+ on a Nicolai (unless you were going for their custom geometry option) when you can get just as capable a bike in the form of the Nukeproof Mega for 650.

bwaarp

Dunno why anyone would spend 1700+ on a Nicolai (unless you were going for their custom geometry option) when you can get just as capable a bike in the form of the Nukeproof Mega for 650.

How many reasons would you like? First, and most obviously there is the potential to fully customise the geometry and colour scheme, which for the discerning rider who can afford it, is massive.

Second, it’s a horst link (from one of the guys who originally developed it for mtb application) as opposed to a linkage driven single pivot. Lets avoid the normal, massive generalizations people get into and just say that they feel different and some people prefer one or t’other.

Thirdly, they are comparatively rare, unique, special, different.

Fourth, they are made by german craftsmen who agonise over precision and quality control on every single frame. Believe it or not this translates to the ride quality – it is tangible.

Fifth, as mentioned above, the five year, transferable warranty (which includes racing). Almost unrivaled in the bike industry and massively indicative of the makers confidence in their product. It might also be important to someone intent on putting the bike through some serious use.

Sixth, most of their designs are highly adaptable (never mind the customisation) in terms of travel and geometry – you can have several different iterations of one bike.

Seventh, if you break a part or want some aspect of your bike modified or updated you can have it done.

….I’m sure there are more reasons, many more reasons, but this is a bike we’re talking about here, so we don’t need reasons. If you’re still in doubt you can always pick up the phone and ask the guy who runs the company.

Cheers.

Nukeproof mega wouldn’t come into my list I’m afraid.
Call me a snob or anything else but I don’t see it as a step up from a five in any way shape or form.

I really like the look of nicolai frames, I like the built for purpose looks, but hey looks aren’t everything.

Not sure I know enough to go custom geometry although I’m sure they could help.
Would be thinking of bos deville fork and matching coil rear.

And nope, I’m not a fan of 29ers.

They do ride differently to a single pivot or VPP and I preferr that. Is a very neutral feeling bike. It gets out of the way and let’s you focus on what the ground is doing and has very little discernible character. Its very transparent in that respect.

I’ve owned my AM for three years and am about to take delivery of a fully custom One. I deliberately went stock first so that i would know what to ask for when i went fully custom.

They are very capable down hill especially when the ground is rough. I was easily able to keep the wheel of a prominent industry figure riding a CCDB equipped Orange 224 in Verbier last year, which was a real rush. In some places the guy on the DH bike was holding me up.

Other than that I would second everything that Muddyfunster said above. They offer something very different to all other manufacturers (I’ve talked to the designer and fabricator of my new bike for example) and something better than a lot of other bikes.

Oh and my three year old large (with custom seat tube) will soon be for sale.

Have bos front and rear on mine as well. Where are you? Maybe we can organise a test ride.

Is it my beer goggles? This is an ugly bike?

Surely not?

Oh really? I’m in the midlands, where abouts are you? Any pics?

HAHAHAH

Really four bar suspension rides that much different? Do they ****. My SX trail was the worst bike I’ve ever owned.

The Leverage ratio is very very similar to the Megas. You are maybe going to get a little less brake jack. Braking is for pussies anyway.

http://linkagedesign.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Nicolai
Nicolais
The custom geo costs another 500, it’s only useful if you know what you are looking for. You might bollocks the handling up if you don’t know what you are looking for.

As for the Orange Five the geo is a considerable step up.

And as for being handmade, I’d buy Taiwanese over hand made in Germany any day.

Keep kidding yourselves that you are getting something that is “that much better” for three times the cost.

Custom paint job? Oooooh wow, I could get a really really nice custom paint job from a good local garage of mine for 70 quid.

Go away bwarp you’re being an arse.

Matt I’m in the SE but ride in the peak a bit. Can’t link a photo as I can’t grab the picture location on the iPad but look Here

Is there a source for that style of decal set above special order ? Quite fancy something like that on my CC
Cheers

I think the customer had nicolai make them at a huge cost buti could be wrong. The customer is in Singapore and the shop orders a lot of custom specials. You can see them on Facebook. Search for Attitude Bikes.

Thanks for your thoughts on the nicolai bwarp.

Gee, that looks a great build!

Would definately be up for a go at some point even if it means me coming down to the SE! Looks a perfect spec.

What sort of riding do you do with it? Are you just swapping frames by the way?

I think bwarp is probably right, I don’t think I’d go custom geometry, although only being
5ft 10 I’d probably like to talk to them about getting something with a fairly low standover, an 18″ five is perfect for general cycling but feels a bit big reach wise and stand over. (I bought an 18 before they brought out the 17″)

Oh and attitude bikes is a very close partner to nicolai iirc, they often get specials / new releases

That blue thing is gopping, and that’s from a former Nicolai owner.

In the sort of range you are looking at, there are plenty of decent bikes. I think however there are many bikes just as good, if not better.

However, that being said, if you want something fairly unique & custom, then they have their place 🙂

Spend your money on lots of skills courses. Then you’ll be able to descend faster, climb better and not waste money on a new bike.

geetee1972

They do ride differently to a single pivot or VPP and I preferr that. Is a very neutral feeling bike. It gets out of the way and let’s you focus on what the ground is doing and has very little discernible character. Its very transparent in that respect.

This is key. A lot of people are turned off by the way horst link bikes feel, citing remote,dull,robotic,controlled etc

Coming from some other designs this can be off putting at first to uninitiated but when pushed hard….really hard, that neutrality is a massive bonus. The last thing you want is any quirk of handling when you are hammering through the rough stuff. A well set up horst link will quietely soak things up and get on with it without getting in your way, drawing attention to what the bike is doing allowing you to focus on the trail and your riding. Something you only appreciate after many years of riding. IMO.

bwaarp – Member

HAHAHAH

Really four bar suspension rides that much different? Do they ****. My SX trail was the worst bike I’ve ever owned.

The Leverage ratio is very very similar to the Megas. You are maybe going to get a little less brake jack. Braking is for pussies anyway.
……..blah…blah…..bllll

It’s like the argument people who can’t afford Ferrari’s but drive modified subararu’s and nissans etc come out with. My mass produced cheaper thing is so much better than something 4 times the price and only pussies drive that because it’s so expenseive, blah blah blah. Justify whatever you want to yourself how ever you want. If you could afford better you would buy better.

Thanks geetee

I’ve ridden it everywhere and do everything on it including local woods down here on Surrey hills, Verbier and the PDS Wales the peak and lakes and DH uplift days like gawton.

It’s been down most things and it’s been ridden pretty rapidly.

Defo don’t go custom geometry for your first bike. A medium would likely fit better than my large. I’m swapping out just the frame shock and headset on mine. You’re welcome to try mine and I may be able to blag a medium as well. The guy who designs orange bikes thinks very. Highly of nicolai designs as well.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying it has to be a nicolai, they are just on the list and I really like the ideals/look of them.

I have also never heard the word gopping before :s

And don’t worry, skills courses are already underway. I’m just conscious that I will want an upgrade to the five next year.

Mojo HD is one to try first… I didn’t like it much at all if I’m honest, not to say it’s a bad bike, it’s definately not, but I want more of a descending bias from a 160mm bike.

FWIW, Orange Fives descend fast and climb OK. If it’s a reasonably recent one anyway. And the Alpine’s a really effective 160mm tool as well- in fact the only 160mm bike I’ve ridden that comes close to my own (which you can’t buy any more, and wouldn’t be flash enough for you anyway, so I won’t recommend it 😉 )

mbarnes – Member

Is it my beer goggles? This is an ugly bike?

Yes, yes it is. To be fair there’ll never be a bike with a big air shock (Vivid air is it?) that isn’t, they make the prettiest bikes look ridiculous. But that’s not the prettiest bike in the first place.

Actually, get a hardtail and learn how to ride properly. It’ll do you a world of good.

North wind you think the mojo has morecdh bias than the am or you think the mojo isnt DH biased enough (which is actually Dirt also said about the mojo).

Actually, just get a bmx and learn to ride it properly.

Or a unicycle.

Get a penny farthing and take it down Champery. That’ll learn you.

Maybe a cock horse and take it to Banbury cross.

Or a cross cock taken to a horse. In Banbury.

geetee1972 – Member

North wind you think the mojo has morecdh bias than the am or you think the mojo isnt DH biased enough (which is actually Dirt also said about the mojo).

I think it’s not DH-biased enough. Not for my taste anyway. But ymmv and I’d definately recommend a test ride if you can, as it might still suit you.

They look great, and as people who own them rate them that is also good.

It would be on my list.

Cheers,
I’ll demo a mojo and a spicy anyway.

And regarding the learn to ride, good point. Never thought of getting any skills, just thought I’d buy a really expensive bike and hope I could ride it.

Oh and the five is a 2012 model, so yeah it climbs and descends well and id almost be tempted just to put a CCDB and bos deville 160mm on it but have heard bad things about 160mm on a five

I’m a massive orange homo but if I was to be tempted away I think it would be a nicolai. Saw a fellow up cwmcarn on a cow print nicolai once, riding with a guy on a pimped up orange of some kind, they were absolutely flying.

Never thought of getting any skills, just thought I’d buy a really expensive bike and hope I could ride it.

You cant just “get” skills. They arent something tangible (like a gravity enuro bike) that you can buy in the shops.

You have to spend years honing them on a hardtail or bmx.

mbarnes – Member

but have heard bad things about 160mm on a five

TBH I didn’t like it… I reckon the Five has pretty fantastic balance as standard, but the longer fork just seemed to lose that a little. Some folks love it and I can see why but I prefered the composure of the standard one. TBH I don’t like the suspension action of the Five much but if you like it, then you already have a great enduro-type bike.

See if you can borrow a longer fork off someone?

Having done a few Gravity Enduros (sadly not this year though)….the range of bikes involved is massive, from 120mm hardtails through to DH rigs being pushed between stages (seriously!).

There doesnt seem to be any such thing as a Gravity Enduro bike, most of the top finishers tend to be on 140-160mm travel bikes but the variation is massive from cheap-ish Giant Reigns and Saracen Ariels (which by the way the Maddison Saracen junior team clean up with)….through to custom built bikes….not everybody goes for a single ring and chain device, Tracey Mosely uses a double chainring set-up as she has publicly stated her preference for having a granny ring to spin along the uphill connecting stages.

What you’re trying to create is a good all rounder, some parts of Eastridge have been used in proper DH comps whereas some of the Welsh rounds were by some accounts quite pedally.

One aspect of the custom thing with Nicolai that you might know about from your current experience, if you chose to go that way, is TT length and how you like your bar/saddle/stem. I think that the TT is fairly short for the frame size. That’s only my perception because I am an advocate of the current wide bar/short stem philosophy. I ride with a 50mm stem and 760mm bars and a medium frame has the perfect standover but is a little too short in the TT FOR ME, leading me to use a layback post which upset the weight balance a little for climbing. It was fine but not ideal.

They are comparable with almost all other makers, who I also think usually make their TTs too short, Hence when I ordered my Nicolai I specced a longer TT, but shorter ST/Standover.

If you do go Nicolai (And the blue with the GBoxx in the picture is no oil painting) then I suggest contacting Richard at GravitySports for excellent service and prices. I am in the midlands too if you wanted to hook up at some time for a look/ride.

This is my current AC

P1010994

This was my AM at an Italian SuperEnduro Pro race, which are bloody tough both up and down!

IMG_1788

I think that the TT is fairly short for the frame size.

I’d agree with that. I wouldn’t normally ride a large (all relative of course) but the one I am on now was a large with a short seat tube for this reason.

This time round I’ve specced a custom TT so that it will be exactly between a medium and a large but also with a much lower BB.