The SNP have been backing off the independence issue in favour of a “whatever is best for Scotland approach”. They could have held a referendum early last term whilst Wendy Alexander was leader of the Scottish Labour party. The SNP ducked this opportunity, they know they will lose.

oops

glitchy!

HAHAHA! always strikes me as funny that so many individuals that consider themselves intelligent are hypnotized by the smoke and mirrors show, that is politics.

Regardless of the policies, practices and individuals involved, if they cannot manage resources, then they should not be in charge of them!

All of the truly gifted individuals in the world that is to say business types and Entrepreneurs are simply interested in doing their thing, getting some resources and then **** off, away from all the shite that is the ratrace, until we can find a way to get them involved in the running of our country and subsequently the destiny of our species.

We will continue to be a species without competent leadership or any kind of direction.

Politics is that art of convincing fools that you can do what you say! me I don’t want to be told what someone or what some body of people can do, I want to be shown.

So far the entire history of politics hasn’t shown me jack shit, I need to see!

druidh – Member
…The SNP has policies which seem to stretch across the political spectrum. A separate Scotland would see a re-invigorated Socialist Labour party which would take much of that core SNP support…

An independent Scotland wouldn’t need the SNP any longer, so the Labour and Libs would probably regain their voters unless the SNP found a new mission.

IMO many of the SNP voters are doing it on the basis of independence for Scotland first and then sort out the internal politics.

Now i’m not so sure of that. To my outside perspective it does seem as though the Scots Electorate are more concerned with having a real voice for Scotland in the Union than with actual Independence. As the SNP are currently the only real alternative to the traditional parties then people are voting for them. Either the other parties focus on Scottish issues or the SNP attempt to lead Scotland to Independence.

Thing is, what will happen to the SNP if – as currently predicted – Scotland returns a no verdict on Independence?
Will the SNP then lose a no-confidence motion? Will they implode?

muddydwarf – Member
Thing is, what will happen to the SNP if – as currently predicted – Scotland returns a no verdict on Independence?
Will the SNP then lose a no-confidence motion? Will they implode?

Retract, possibly. Remember, it took two attempts to get the limited devolution already in place.

good luck to the SNP and the independent scotch!

I trust we’ll no longer have them sending any more of the likes of Brown, Darling, Kennedy etc down south to opress us southern softies 😆

The Daily Mash take on it

independent scotch

whisky?

A photo and a headline/by-line – is that the best they can come up with? Proof that humour is, indeed, in very short supply at the Daily Mash.

Gonna be an interesting few years ahead then.

Toad-face is far too crafty to risk losing a referendum by having an ‘independence now: yes or no’ vote. He adopts a softly softly approach. The referendum will include an option for more powers for Holyrood which people might go for. He is attempting independence one small step at a time, & so far it is working.

Thing is, how far can he take it?

I can’t see many Scots saying no to the idea of more devolved powers but how far can that go before Westminster says “No, if you want any more you’ll have to go it alone”.

At that point he’ll either have to call a referendum or back down and lose face. His big selling point so far has been standing up to Westminster/The English (yeah, i know…) if he’s seen to bow before Westminster what will it do to the SNP?
Will it re-enforce his pro-Independence position because of ‘perfidious Albion’ or will he be seen as a failure and lose power?

Love him or loathe him, Alex Salmond is, by far, the outstanding politician of his generation. He will have considered all possible courses of action and will have made plans accordingly.

One good thing about the SNP’s victory in the elections is that the lunatic fringe/ quasi-fascist elements like SnG will be even more marginalised than before.
Is the SnG still a proscribed organisation to SNP members?

Does that mean they have to work if they go it alone or are they going to sack the border (spelling correction) towns / cities? 😆

So what major industries do they have?

Whiskey? Porridge? Oil & Gas? Tourists? Casino (Financial centre)? Fish?

druidh – Member

Love him or loathe him, Alex Salmond is, by far, the outstanding politician of his generation.

Outstanding? You mean a politician? What is so outstanding about modern days politicians? Aren’t they all almost the same?

Assuming you meant “border”, I’ll let the people of Coldstream, Jedburgh, Gretna and Dumfries know of your concerns.

We are fed an endless stream of how much the scottish people hate the english, but this thread is a bit of an eye opener on the english viewpoint. I am sensing bitterness that we have a decent set of politicians in charge of our country and they are stuck with a bunch of *****.

Bit confused here SbZ – which direction are you talking about? 😳

SBZ – I was taking it all in the best of spirits. I reckon there’s a lot of piss-taking on both sides and the handful of bitter comments are mostly due to ignorance.

To be fair, if I had the misfortune to be living in england I would be a bit bitter also.

druidh – Member

Assuming you meant “border”, I’ll let the people of Coldstream, Jedburgh, Gretna and Dumfries know of your concerns.

LOL! Need to rebuild Hadrian’s Wall just in case the job centre is sacked.

Put it this way so things have been swimming rather nicely since King James VI & I where everyone gets “free” handouts of some sort then now come the gang of fish that demand independence etc whatever … So if I were a Scot that have been getting free handouts for a while then I guess now I need to enslave myself to the fish ideology like swimming up the river only to die after a short climax.

So in order to “buy” the people I guess SNP will demand more money to be fed into the Scottish economy first before calling for independence. Then they find out the hard way … they can’t compete in the world economy. Then they run to EU for handouts … then the people sell their bodies for food … 😆

p/s: with the exception of the few working in the govt, oil & gas, porridge, casino and whiskey industries …

In the event of Independence i wonder which way Berwick-Upon-Tweed will go? 😆

Serious question though, oil aside (the gas is English) does Scotland actually have a robust enough economy?
England has a recently growing manufacturing sector but it’s not the powerhouse that drove the Empire anymore is it?
England has been reliant on the financial sector for years – great,smashing, lovely etc…

Scotland doesnt need a huge economy though does it. It’s less than a 1/12th the population of england so I dont see where the problem is. Bit of oil, bit of renewables, bit of finance, more than it’s fair share of science and a metric ****load of tourism – dont really see a country that wont be able to support 4 and a bit million folk.

Ach – there goes the thread..

We are fed an endless stream of how much the scottish people hate the english, but this thread is a bit of an eye opener on the english viewpoint. I am sensing bitterness that we have a decent set of politicians in charge of our country and they are stuck with a bunch of *****.

Where are you getting that from? You must feel imbalanced from that enormous (battered) chip on your shoulder. 🙂

Personally I’m happy for the Scots, but quite jealous yup. Not sure why people have to gloat about the fact that we probably have to put up with a Tory government indefinitely now. As I’ve said many times, I just wish the North of England could come and join you when you do get independence.

I wonder if the SNP have thought about putting up candidates up here? 🙂

The GDP per capita is remarkably similar for Scotland and the UK as a whole. The GDP per capita of Scotland is higher than all other parts of the UK except the south East of England and London. The economy has a bit more to it than Whisky and Porridge too!

I’m undecided on “Independence”. Full fiscal autonomy is essential though to make politicians accountable for their actions.

Surely a federal UK makes more sense? Somewhere between independence and the current state…

molgrips – Member
Surely a federal UK makes more sense?

It does to me, so long as each part has independence and the ability to withdraw.

Put a federal parliament somewhere central like Carlisle and it would transform British politics. Westminster could be retained for English government.

Leave the trappings of the colonial/imperial past behind, and build a structure that will carry us through these times.

molgrips – Member
Surely a federal UK makes more sense? Somewhere between independence and the current state…

[img]http://londonschoolofenglish.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/eu_flag.jpg[/img]

druidh,

Does that mean they want to be independent but in exchange to be ruled by EU bureaucrats? 😆 Isn’t the idea of independence equates standing by oneself?

I say let them go if they want to (less mouths to feed) and good luck to them if they want to be a full member of EU using Euro, just don’t cross the border raiding the job centre … 😆

Should we start calling him Mr President Salmond? Sturgeon? Pollock? Haddock? 😆

poly – Member

The GDP per capita is remarkably similar for Scotland and the UK as a whole. The GDP per capita of Scotland is higher than all other parts of the UK except the south East of England and London. The economy has a bit more to it than Whisky and Porridge too!

I’m undecided on “Independence”. Full fiscal autonomy is essential though to make politicians accountable for their actions.

Yes, but do look at the unemployment rate though. Just hope you don’t get a small population working hard feeding the ones that they are entitled to be feed for generations.

Federal Europe is a whole different kettle of weinerschnitzel….

molgrips – I guess the question is where EU integration will end. For instance, if there is a EU-wide armed forces (UK & France already planning to share aircraft carriers) then what advantage would there be in having a federal UK one? Or how about sharing embassies outside of the EU – I believe some countries already do that too. Of course, there’s always the Euro…

Well federal Europe is harder than a federal UK because you’re starting from the opposite end. That is, 20 odd very different sovereign states instead of one very closely integrated one, both economically and socially.

I was a bit more pro federal EU until the credit crunch exposed how economically diverse all the countries are. Very hard to manage all that under one roof no?

Wouldn’t the federal thing mean more MPs?

Sounds crap. Lets release them into the wild. They can take all their MPs with them.

What’s not to like?

molgrips – Member
I was a bit more pro federal EU until the credit crunch exposed how economically diverse all the countries are. Very hard to manage all that under one roof no?

Yep – and the same argument applies, in a slightly smaller scale, to the UK. There are very different demands in Northern Ireland, Scotland, North-East England to those in the South East. The UK government already recognises some of that and so is giving NI the ability to vary Corporation Tax – a measure not included in the Scotland Bill currently going through the legislative process 🙄

druidh – Member

molgrips – I guess the question is where EU integration will end. For instance, if there is a EU-wide armed forces (UK & France already planning to share aircraft carriers) then what advantage would there be in having a federal UK one? Or how about sharing embassies outside of the EU – I believe some countries already do that too. Of course, there’s always the Euro…

It will only increase the power of pen pushers who are totally disengaged with ordinary life because bureaucrats live in a cosmos of their own. They tap into your life force and suck your life away slowly. You can protest and all the freedom associated with it but please fill in the form first before you do so … I want to be a bureaucrat me. 😆

5thElefant – Member
Wouldn’t the federal thing mean more MPs?

Not necessarily. The number of representatives to a UK-wide body could be substantially reduced as there would be a lot less legislation. Of course, one could always get rid of the House of Lords.