I thought it was just a pipe dream. I didn’t realise it was going to happen.
The mrs is a relief cook at school now and again and received a letter saying all wages would now be £7.65/hr.
Must be welcome news for a lot of full time staff.

maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

Yup.

Yeh, but now relief cookery will be offshored to asia.

Ill be honest I’d heard it mentioned in the media etc but thought it was the latest “vote winner” for whoever. According to the letter there will be 3000 people in Derbyshire better off. That’s gotta be a big slice of cash!

I thought it was just a pipe dream. I didn’t realise it was going to happen.
The mrs is a relief cook at school now and again and received a letter saying all wages would now be £7.65/hr.
Must be welcome news for a lot of full time staff.

The only problem here will be the knock-on effect:

– I know someone that is a supervisor in a shop, she gets paid about £7.50ph for her trouble (not great, she knows that) The managers get not much more, £8.50 or something…..

What happens when you put minimum wage staff up to nearly £7.50? Then the supervisor will need to go up to £8.50 and the manager £9.50.

I agree the minimum wage is not enough to live on in the UK – this could cause issues though.

Is this the back end of the Single Status shenanigans? Should all have been sorted a decade ago?

No doubt some businesses will squeal that they can’t afford it or more like they want to exploit people to boost profits

If you can’t afford to pay your workers a fair wage you shouldn’t be in business.

About time these companies paid up rather than the rest of us supplementing their profits via low income tax credits

Is this the back end of the Single Status shenanigans?

It’s been tacked on to that at my former workplace. Despite working there for 6 years, I joined after it started and have left before it was implemented!

maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

Not just you. It is insane.

But the supermarkets employ millions and they like this.
And if anyone dares challenge it then they’ll be fitting a load more self serve tills and whichever government it is get another million on their unemployment stats.

What about state support for the public sector paying low wages? How do you feel about that?

be fitting a load more self serve tills

I seem to recall that they lose more through theft at self serve tills than they gain from saved wages.

mrmo – Member 
maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

Well it’s better than an alternative of the companies either going out of business due to staff costs or the inflationary pressures of them pitting up prices.

Let’s just be glad that action is being taken

double post

mrmo – Member
maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

It’s nuts, tax payers subsidising the likes of tesco and asda etcs profits. That’s all it is.

What happens when you put minimum wage staff up to nearly £7.50? Then the supervisor will need to go up to £8.50 and the manager £9.50.

Perish the thought!

The only problem here will be the knock-on effect:

– I know someone that is a supervisor in a shop, she gets paid about £7.50ph for her trouble (not great, she knows that) The managers get not much more, £8.50 or something…..

What happens when you put minimum wage staff up to nearly £7.50? Then the supervisor will need to go up to £8.50 and the manager £9.50.

I agree the minimum wage is not enough to live on in the UK – this could cause issues though.

I know it’s more complicated. But that sounds like everyone’s a winner apart from the owners. Considering the widening gap between rich and poor, maybe those above minimum wage should be getting more too.

Well it’s better than an alternative of the companies either going out of business due to staff costs or the inflationary pressures of them pitting up prices.

but not as good as the alternative of taking less tax – needed to cover the benefits paid to people not paid enough by their employer.

(ie, pay more in wages + less in tax = costs stay more or less the same = no inflationary pressure)

some effort to reduce the costs of living like housing might be good too

Ok, ahw but, cost push inflation is not the only form of inflation!! (Sorry for the tangent).

Across EU as a whole and possibly here the lingering threat of deflation is more troubling that inflation at the moment.

I’m always very quick to point out should I hear a colleague bleeting about ‘doley scum’ that state subsidy of private companies (tax credits) and private landlords (housing benefit) make the money wasted on ‘benefits scum’ seem trivial.

I’m sure the bosses of most companies would like to see wages increase in real terms for the lowest paid (increasing demand) but few are prepared to do so themselves .

Good article by Jeremy Warner on the torygraph website on this very subject, should you wish to google it

anagallis_arvensis – Member

some effort to reduce the costs of living like housing might be good too

but rising house prices are a *good* thing, everyone knows that…

teamhurtmore – Member

Across EU as a whole and possibly here the lingering threat of deflation is more troubling that inflation at the moment.

tell me about it! – i’ve got a fixed-rate mortgage, i’d maybe even benefit from a few years of %10 inflation

maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

However it is perfectly in tune with Government policy of increasing inequality. The tax paying masses (middle classes) are subsiding the business owners (the very rich) in exploiting the poor (those getting tax credits).

Article in the Independent about the housing problem today.

Basically if you haven’t bought by 29, you’re screwed and so are your kids when it comes to home ownership.

At least that was more or less the headline.

The living wage is only happening in places where people are deciding to implement it – Derby Council is one of the first non-london places to implement it, with a limited number of private sector employers implementing it.

It’s a good thing, but it’s only a start.

What about state support for the public sector paying low wages? How do you feel about that?

The Public Sector should be paying the living wage as an absolute minimum. I’d also like them not to contract out services to any company (Serco et al) that doesn’t pay the living wage to all its staff, not just those employed on Public Sector contracts.

I think the record’s good on the first part, not so much on the second.

Glad the OPs wife will get it, slightly concerned that Derbyshire CC are making half my wife’s team redundant to help balance the budget to fund it.

but not as good as the alternative of taking less tax – needed to cover the benefits paid to people not paid enough by their employer.

(ie, pay more in wages + less in tax = costs stay more or less the same = no inflationary pressure)

Jesus man – think about the political implication of what you’re saying!

Think of all those people employed printing & posting endless ream of tax credit forms & letters – think about the civil servants working to process those forms, think about the people working manning the tax credit hotline six days a week 8-8 (4 on saturdays) and the staff needed to man the endless labarynthine appeals process when they get it wrong

if you foolishly went and cut the tax rates instead, then all those public sector employees will have nothing left to do all day!

Madness!

mrmo – Member
maybe its me, but having a minimum wage that relies on tax credits and benefits to top up, ie state support for companies to pay low wages seems insane.

That’s not the case if your total house hold income is below the threshold.

I had wondered how ddc were going to fund this. 3000 people is a lot of extra quids every hour every day etc etc.
It won’t really affect us as its only relief work she does on days off from her normal job so probably 4/5 hours a week but I’d suggest a lot of that 3000 are on full time contracts.

The Public Sector should be paying the living wage as an absolute minimum. I’d also like them not to contract out services to any company (Serco et al) that doesn’t pay the living wage to all its staff, not just those employed on Public Sector contracts.

Absolutely. There shouldn’t be a knock on of costs in the public sector, because (min wage + benefits) should= (living wage).

I thought the whole point of outsourcing to Serco / G4S was to avoid having to pay a decent wage and just get someone else blamed for exploiting the poor?

The whole point of outsourcing to Serco / G4S is to TUPE low skilled / highly paid roles across, then slowly replace these as they become vacant and pay a sensible amount without facing an equal pay claim or being forced to hire people on packages that were bonkers in the first place.

e.g. Traffic Enforcement Officers (directly employed by Councils for £25K wage plus another 40% of on costs and working 7 hour shifts 220 days a year – working out at £22.72 an hour) slowly complemented by people working for Serco etc. doing exactly the same job on 7.5 hour shifts 230 days a year for £16K + £4.5K on cost – or £11.88 an hour.

As reported in the news today, the “deep” cuts in public spending will still take until the mid 2030s until the long term debt comes down to the level of 2007. Paying a fair rate of pay for jobs in the public sector (i.e. that reflects the complexity of the role and experience required) is part of this re-balancing and also means there is more money to pay more to keep good people in the most specialised / challenging / hard to recruit roles.

is part of this re-balancing

Are you a Tory PR spokesperson?

‘Fair pay’, ‘rebalancing’ generally translates to ‘screwing over’ / ‘exploiting’, if you’re sat on the other side of the table ie being ‘rebalanced’….

or £11.88 an hour.

And then sercos profits on top pushing the total cost past the original cost but distributing the wealth up to the owners rather than the workers.

Also many of us believe that EVERYONE should be entitled to a decent wage, we don’t look down on someone because somewhere the work they do is classified as “low skilled”that work is still essential to the smooth running of society. In fact if those roles weren’t filled we would see the impact much faster and harder than the supposedly highly skilled jobs.

I think the other issue is how do you have a national living wage when cost of living varies so much by geography ? Re Tesco/Asda etc I think there are more issues in the supermarket business model than low wages, supplier payment terms and anti competitive practices for example.

I think the other issue is how do you have a national living wage when cost of living varies so much by geography ?

Make it scale regionally with the median local wage or similar?

The whole point of outsourcing

It’s doing wonders for healthcare – e.g. Virgin using cheaper non-clinical reception staff to ‘triage’ admissions instead of, y’know, nurses. 🙄

MSP – Member
And then sercos profits on top pushing the total cost past the original cost

Not sure how that works?

Also many of us believe that EVERYONE should be entitled to a decent wage,

Very true, therefore we…

don’t look down on someone because somewhere the work they do is classified as “XXX- skilled”that work is still essential to the smooth running of society.

True for a wide variety of skills isn’t it?

Not sure how that works?

You think serco miraculously produces profits from nowhere? There is very rarely any savings from privatising services, just lower wages, redundancies and higher profits for the owners. Plus we all end up subsidising the unemployed.

True for a wide variety of skills isn’t it?

Well most highly skilled posts have financial rewards and career paths that are reward themselves, it seems some seem to think that low skilled workers are just a drain on society, and should be cast aside so the well paid can be paid even better.