I think it’s brilliant.

The natural trails round here are not really any busier, certainly by comparison.

I’m trying not too because I doubt you’d be able to grasp any of it, but you were happy to post about it when it suited your narrative.

I will however correct the misinformation you posted and provide you with a reason as too why the trails are no longer removed on sight.

I’m acutely aware that it goes on and where it goes on – I ride it all over the country, and I made a few tweaks myself today (sorry more rocks Del!)

My view is that providing people aren’t building dangerous features in inappropriate places and causing grief with other users whats the issue?

once people start categorizing and labelling people

<London company men on group rides comparing strava times, wearing club shirts like they’re roadies/frat groups >

it says something about you. You might want to think about that.

Do you think you might be labelling folk there and this might say something about you [ or is just everyone else doign it ]?

There was a DH track there for years and I’m told one of the black trails has elements of that original track in it – how true I don’t know.

Yeah, it was called Gethin woods and the main thing it was known for was the gnarly rockgarden towards the bottom. There is still a section of it in there I think just after you go through the tunnel.

We used to go there from the Midlands and push up our dh bikes. Rheola, Mountain Ash etc too.

I was racing a Dragon Downhill race there and in practise I clipped my pedal on the entry boulder to the rock garden, over the bars and broke my leg.

There was a period of about a year where I knocked myself out in that section, a mate broke his arm, and then I broke my leg.

Brutal 😀

It’s mostly a walk in the (bike) park nowadays…. 😆

I’ve heard that Revolution bike park is better than BPW.

Depends…..about 50% of your average BPW rider would s@%? themselves a new bumhole.There is a new line coming over the winter for the the mincecore. 😉

I’m trying not too because I doubt you’d be able to grasp any of it, but you were happy to post about it when it suited your narrative.

I will however correct the misinformation you posted and provide you with a reason as too why the trails are no longer removed on sight

If you’re going to question my intellect, at least try and ensure you know to from too. 😀

However, we do agree on your latter point.

I see a mixed crowd at gt any time I’m down and its ace

Innerleithen however seems to be more the preserve of the 18 – 40 year old male.. Don’t think I’ve ever seen a female there in all my visits.

That’s possibly because the facilities are beyond poor.. I still can’t believe someone hasn’t realised the potential that place has (other than the locals and riders). Decent facilities and a mechanical uplift would make that place a mecca for UK mountain biking..

If you’re going to question my intellect

Resorting to grammatical errors speaks volumes.

😀

As do your shit weasel smiley posts.

It’s the difference between sparking up Spotify and putting some music in the background, and firing up your turntable, getting out a vinyl LP and LISTENING to an album, from the very first note through to the runout groove!

I’ve finally realised that you’re actually playing an ironic parody and not a real person. You had me fooled for years!

I’ve loved riding my bike in many places, particularly BPW, and will continue to do so regardless of the snobbery from others. I’ll also continue to be the posh sounding southerner who chats to everyone on the uplift bus, regardless of their accent, bike or attire – and to the dog walkers and horse riders etc that frequent my usual riding patches.

I’ll also continue loving music despite most listening happening through Sonos even though I run a high-end audio company.

Kayak23 enter the dragon is part of the old dh trail I think? and the rock garden was evil in the old dragon day’s I remember having a rest there fairly often usually upside-down

Chief******?

You’re kin awesome!

There has been a bit of pomposity in this thread.

Just be happy with your own riding, no need to look down on other people.

BPW is great.
Natural rides (as much as any UK riding is natural) are great.
Flow trails are great.
Slow, stuttery, tech trails are great.

It’s all riding bikes, which is great.

Anything that gets people out riding their bikes is great.

If you don’t like riding somewhere, don’t ride there.

A few people in the thread need to get over themselves.

+1 that

Tom_W1987 –
Making a comparison between audiophiles and mountain bikers should be worthy of a stoning.

and this?
It seems to be a softie southern thing, this obsession with blues.
just a left hook to the temple I reckon

Are you a t3@t if you drive a T5? 😕

tl;dr the thread, but 😀 …

BPW definitely has had a negative impact on trail centre riding in south Wales. Speaking with people who run B&Bs and the like round Afan they say the same and find they’re losing business.

It’s also having an impact on general expectations of riding. Everyone wants to be full on Enduro, and when they can’t do BPW they want to make everything like BPW everywhere else. Gnar trails a plenty with drops and gaps wherever possible in the likes of Surrey Hills. Dig and shred, and screw the land owners and anyone who’s not rad enough 😉 . Bikes and kit are all BPW / Enduro ready. Everything is going long, slack and wide.

And I’m not sure it’s a good thing. The industry will follow the market and push it further to sell more, while leaving behind the trail, xc, even all mountain riding.

IMO… with a bit of tongue in cheek here 😉

(and I do like BPW, but it’s also a victim of its own success. Way too busy, somewhat overhyped now too. It’s great, but not worth the cost and three month wait for a ticket, the bus queues and inadequate cafe etc facilities).

Way too busy, somewhat overhyped now too. It’s great, but not worth the cost and three month wait for a ticket, the bus queues and inadequate cafe etc

I’ve never found the trails to be busy at BPW. I’ve always thought they could get away with having more people riding even when it’s fully booked. Also the uplift seemed to dramatically improve a year or so ago. Been a couple of times since and barely had to wait at all, most times just straight in the van.

Agree the cafe seems permanently rammed and so I’ve never bothered queuing for food and just take my own lunch.

just a left hook to the temple I reckon

😆

It’s always been slightly overhyped, ever since they tried to say they weren’t a trail centre at the beginning. Now they’re happy to accept awards for being the ‘Best Trail Centre 2017’.

It really depends upon your speed down the hill as to whether you find the uplift fast, slow or just annoying. The drivers have figured out how quickly (or slowly depending upon your disposition) they need to get up and down to arrive to a full queue ready to get loaded and cut down on waiting times for them. If you’re in a group and have a bi of waiting mid-hill then you probably find it fine but if you’re faster or slower than that you will either end up waiting at the bottom for a bus to arrive or get there just as one leaves or join a large queue. I’ve had to have a chat with the management at one point after the drivers were deliberately hanging about further up the hill to avoid being the last bus of the day. I and a few other riders had to wait for nearly 30 mins for the bus to pull up for last run as the other drivers were basically blocking the uplift road and wouldn’t radio down to out driver to say what was happening. This happened on 2 visits in a row so I had words before I left. Massively different to the drivers at Antur who goad you for not getting on the bus the millisecond you get down the hill or, god forbid, think about missing a run out to have a rest 😆

BPW definitely has had a negative impact on trail centre riding in south Wales. Speaking with people who run B&Bs and the like round Afan they say the same and find they’re losing business.

This is definitely happening and it’s pretty much out of their control. They have no say over trail developments and without decent trails there won’t be any visitors.

Antur is the most efficient uplift I’ve used. Down, bus is loading, no queue, up, go again. That considering I’m no DHer and mince down really. Though maybe the fastest guys have to wait a little 😉

FoD is usually pretty good too.

Can’t see how something that’s hugely successful is a problem. Wales should deliver more. Afan could have developed the same uplift and trails but didn’t. And they could have done it way before BPW. It’s a market economy? Deliver what people want. BPW could improve its food!

or, god forbid, think about missing a run out to have a rest

Haha yep, been there.

Yep, it should be the stepping stone to lift the level at the other venues.
We are about to get a version here, honestly it’s going to be a great lift to the area and the riding options available.

(and I do like BPW, but it’s also a victim of its own success. Way too busy, somewhat overhyped now too. It’s great, but not worth the cost and three month wait for a ticket, the bus queues and inadequate cafe etc facilities).

Confused. Too busy ? I went on a Saturday in July and the trails were quite empty and bus queues very short. They were running a full capacity and I didn’t encounter any issues so for me it’s the opposite, they have conservatively managed the yield so that it doesn’t become a victim of its own success by matching number of uplift sold to capacity. That’s probably what surprised me the most.

Inadequate cafe : you are VERY difficult to please. I found it superb and affordable and I am a fussy bugger.

Antur is the most efficient uplift I’ve used.

I can corroborate this, I got as many runs in the morning at Antur as I did in an entite day at BPW. Partly because its a quicker drive up and partly because they dont hang around till the bus is full.

I found Antur to be a better experience tbh.

Antur has a tarmac road to the top which I believe was paid for by however the zip wire business was funded – unsurprisingly minibuses are a lot quicker up that than BPW’s dirt road.

And they’ve always called it a trail centre – here’s the original press release:

http://www.cognation.co.uk/official-opening-bikepark-wales

You can’t blame people for wanting all their shits and giggles without the physical effort of riding uphill, or the mental effort of having to navigate and find good trails – it’s human nature to avoid the stuff we don’t like or find difficult or plain boring.

I think effort and difficult are the key words here. It goes some way to explaining why the UK as whole are fat buffers, the popularity of ready to eat microwave meals, peoples’ reliance on cars, personal debt and sodding ebikes. We live in an instant gratification age. Everyone wants the destination without the journey, be that looking trim for your Instafacegram, eating a jacket potato (I saw microwavable jacket potatoes the other day! I was shocked…), having money for your holiday, getting to the top of a hill or getting a buzz without actually having to put much effort in.

I love day at a park but you cant beat natural terrain. its just harder

I agree. Up until last year when I visited Afan and Nant-yr-Arien (sp?) I had never ridden at a trail centre. During that trip to sales I also ride down Snowdon. Snowdon sticks out the most in my memory.
This year I visited with my GF and we rode Afan, Bewts-y-Coed, and Coed y Brenin. All great fun but the ride through the Elan Valley and over to Rhayader was, despite the larger amount of track and tarmac, the most fun and hardest. We’re not some kind of masochists, but there was certainly a greater sense of having done something than any of those days at a trail centre despite having not ridden as far.

I ride in a fair few other locations in Europe with purpose built trails and I must say that the Welsh centres offer a great day out. The facilities are usually good. There are showers for a start! For families they are fantastic. But, they are generally built so that just about anyone can ride them and they are devoted of any proper features.

Ride at La Thuile and you’ll find lots of tight switchbacks.

Lots of rock gardens where line choice is key at Reschen.

Plenty of places in Finale where it’s do-or-die.

I think effort and difficult are the key words here. It goes some way to explaining why the UK as whole are fat buffers, the popularity of ready to eat microwave meals, peoples’ reliance on cars, personal debt and sodding ebikes. We live in an instant gratification age. Everyone wants the destination without the journey, be that looking trim for your Instafacegram, eating a jacket potato (I saw microwavable jacket potatoes the other day! I was shocked…), having money for your holiday, getting to the top of a hill or getting a buzz without actually having to put much effort in.

Cheer up, it’s not that bad.

We are about to get a version here, honestly it’s going to be a great lift to the area and the riding options available

Maydena? If that’s what you’re referring to, then yes it looks incredible!! Definitely on the bucket list for a big trip with the family in a few years 🙂

As for the tracks Sam Hill’s helping them develop – I’ll make no promises as to getting down quick…..

I find it laughable that people are judging a MTB venue on the quality of the cafe…speaks volumes for the state of the nation.

Missing a bus and having a rest, drivers set their speed based on the apprent skill of their passengers at BPW?! Really, I must have misread that due to the beer. Most of the drivers have never ridden a bike in anger.

At the weekend there’s about 8 buses on, you’re not supposed to catch the same one every time, they come in 2s and 3s. Also they’re told to drive at a set speed of 15mph (it think) it’s means they have to close less to fix the road and it allows them to squeeze the max number of buses in, it’s like a ballet, sort of.

So we now have a country covered in trail centres but still have all the natural trails, and lots of folks crafting and creating new ones or titivating old ones. Only STW could find the negative in this..

For the record though I agree that natural trails are more memorable, especially if they involve pushing and carrying to the top. Although the outright speed of the Blues at BPW feels really good.

And locally I will carry on building slow and techy or steep and thrutchy depending on which area of riding I feel I am weakest at (all areas sadly!)

I’d better add Trailforks to the list of positives too, awesome.

P-jay – I was talking to one of the drivers who had just started and he said they were asked to try and get a minimum amount of uplifts in per day. He was taking that as a minimum so wanted to get a few more in whereas some of the others were deliberately pacing themselves to only get in that minimum amount. It was a direct split between those who rode and those who don’t according to him. He was visibly peeved off with it. As long as they arrived, loaded a full load and got in the requisite number of uplifts they have done their job.

I like BPW, it’s a great facility, but it too often leaves me feeling like it’s treating me as a number to balance the books. The dig crew are great to talk to and do a great job but the enthusiasm that was there at the beginning has waned somewhat and has been replaced with a bit of a corporate culture. Inevitable as the place has grown I suppose but it does grate with me.

I think effort and difficult are the key words here. It goes some way to explaining why the UK as whole are fat buffers

no, that will be the huge amounts of sugar and extra calories in every-ones food.