The CPS actually manage to convict someone of Death by Dangerous Driving

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  • The CPS actually manage to convict someone of Death by Dangerous Driving
  • rogerthecat
    Member

    Tough story to read.

    Surely there must be technology that can be built into satnavs that prevents them being changed/altered whilst it is recording movement? That would seem an obvious safety feature.

    See them stuck in the centre of windscreens so many times.

    Pity he wasn’t a CPO or Cabinet Minister, then we might have seen some action.

    Premier Icon D0NK
    Subscriber

    WHAT MITIGATION?????

    that it was only a cyclist she killed? FFS the courts actually manage to convict someone of driving dangerously and the judge ignores guidelines and sentences for something approaching careless driving.

    Premier Icon dazh
    Subscriber

    Whilst I recognise the need for sentencing to be used for deterrence, I can’t help but think that an 18 month prison sentence in this case doesn’t really help anyone. Wouldn’t it be much more useful to give her a lifetime driving ban along with a community service sentence, perhaps based around educating drivers about the dangers of not not taking their responsibilities seriously?

    Surely there must be technology that can be built into satnavs that prevents them being changed/altered whilst it is recording movement? That would seem an obvious safety feature.

    Housemate has one in his focus that won’t allow changes whilst the cars moving.

    I think my garmin rather pointlessly let’s you dissable it when you first get it out the box and switch it on.

    Premier Icon GrahamS
    Subscriber

    I do agree with you dazh in that I don’t believe long sentences are a deterrent for bad driving because killing someone by driving badly isn’t a premeditated crime.

    On the other hand, joke sentences send entirely the wrong message about the responsibility and duty of care that drivers (should) face.

    Personally I can’t see any reason to ever let someone drive again if they have been done for Dangerous or Careless Driving. They’ve proven themselves incapable of driving safely so don’t let them drive

    IanW
    Member

    I can relate to the victim which makes ready the article even more difficult.

    Prosecutions, Sentencing, Speed limits, Education, Road design, Technology, Regulation we need to use all levers possible to reduce the dominance of vehicles and put people back in the ascendancy.

    With any luck someone will pull the plug on oil supply or a similar to force the situation.

    duckman
    Member

    18 months,so out in 9. Already being portrayed as a victim, “two families torn apart” She will be out on home leave within 3 months. That is what we are worth,less than 100 days in prison.

    Premier Icon dazh
    Subscriber

    That is what we are worth,less than 100 days in prison.

    This is exactly why I don’t think prison sentences are a good option in cases like these. Just how long would we be ‘worth’? Throwing someone in prison for a significant period doesn’t do much good practically, other than destroying more lives. The focus on cases like these should be on how they can be used for prevention and deterrence. Automatic life bans plus community service would be much better I think as it would send the message that there is zero tolerance towards negligent driving, and would provide less opportunity for the wider public to see the perpetrator as a victim too.

    Premier Icon scotroutes
    Subscriber

    GrahamS wrote:

    I do agree with you dazh in that I don’t believe long sentences are a deterrent for bad driving because killing someone by driving badly isn’t a premeditated crime.

    I understand where you’re coming from. I’m sure no one starts out their drive thinking “I’ll hit a cyclist today” but then I’m equally sure no one starts out thinking “I’ll have an accident (let’s not get hung up on that word) today” either. However if, instead of an airbag, a big metal spike came out of the steering wheel, do you think folk would be more, or less careful? My point is that, at some level, we all weigh up the consequences of our actions. When those consequences are dire enough, they do influence our behaviour.

    Premier Icon GrahamS
    Subscriber

    With you on that dazh – I think many of the general public would see a lifetime driving ban as just as “harsh” as a few months in prison.

    I also think jurys would find it much easier to find someone guilty if they knew they were “permanently taking a dangerous driver off the road”, rather than “breaking up another family by sending a mother to jail”.

    The only trouble is with people who don’t give a crap and will just drive anyway even if they are banned.

    Mrs Toast
    Member

    Absolutely heartbreaking reading about the impact on the cyclist’s family, and absolutely disgusting that she got off so lightly.

    “I think it’s all a bit harsh. I know it should never have happened, but anyone could make that mistake.”

    Anyone who shouldn’t be on the road.

    Premier Icon GrahamS
    Subscriber

    However if, instead of an airbag, a big metal spike came out of the steering wheel, do you think folk would be more, or less careful?

    Yep – but that is an ever present reminder just in front of them that deals immediate obvious consequences.

    Whereas I think the possibility of a stiff sentence, IF they drive badly, IF they then hit someone and IF they are found guilty is just too remote to have any additional deterrent effect beyond the existing “not wanting to kill someone” instinct.

    Especially as most bad drivers won’t consider themselves to be bad drivers in the first place.

    jimster
    Member

    The only trouble is with people who don’t give a crap and will just drive anyway even if they are banned.

    This is the biggest problem, especially when you read this – http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23967547and consider that Police forces are getting more and more cutbacks, and lets face it unless you are stopped who’s going to be aware that you are banned.

    Premier Icon dazh
    Subscriber

    This is the biggest problem, especially when you read this – http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23967547and consider that Police forces are getting more and more cutbacks, and lets face it unless you are stopped who’s going to be aware that you are banned.

    Well I guess this is where the large prison sentences would be used. Also surely this is an area where technology could be used. Maybe some sort of license key-fob which would be required to operate a vehicle?

    Premier Icon GrahamS
    Subscriber

    Yeha, driving while you are banned IS a premeditated crime – so prison sentences would be more effective there. As would seizing the car.

    But the issue is having enough police manpower to enforce it. I’m sure there must be a technological solution to it.

    Premier Icon theotherjonv
    Subscriber

    I’m sure there must be a technological solution to it.

    Looking for a solution that might be years away – but a key card / transponder that has to be swiped before a car starts up? If you get banned, your card gets blocked. No active card, no driving.

    And if you borrow someone’s card to enable you to drive – that person’s card also gets blocked.

    Premier Icon D0NK
    Subscriber

    And if you borrow someone’s card to enable you to drive – that person’s card also gets blocked.

    how do you find out about card lending? good idea btw but I presume it’s still down to getting stopped by a real proper policeman and him spotting that the driver is not the person on the card. And we don’t have a lot of policemen to do that job.

    Premier Icon dazh
    Subscriber

    how do you find out about card lending?

    Bind the license to car electronically? Make it an online thing and you could easily manage who has access to drive your car.

    hammyuk
    Member

    Simple – fingerprint readers.

    Premier Icon theotherjonv
    Subscriber

    i presume it’s still down to getting stopped by a real proper policeman and him spotting that the driver is not the person on the card. And we don’t have a lot of policemen to do that job

    True. That’s the same as we have now. Difference is that it becomes a real deterrent, you might not get caught but if you do, you just got your wife/dad/mate banned for a year as well, and banned in a way that you can’t drive, not ‘aren’t supposed to’

    Driving isn’t a right, it’s a privilege. Rights are hard to take away, privileges shouldn’t be.

    Mrs Toast
    Member

    I’m still furious about the lenient sentence – it looks like they dropped it below the minimum for the lowest category of dangerous driving because she was “of good character” and had kids. You can be the nicest person in the world, it doesn’t mean you should get a pass for killing someone through your completely avoidable actions.

    The fact she was shocked that she got any jail time at all, accompanied by her neighbours saying that she “didn’t deserve it” and that it was “harsh” really emphasises the need for stiffer sentences. 18 months (of which she’ll serve half) and a 2.5 year driving ban seems a poor joke for somebody who wasn’t looking at the road for nearly 20 seconds whilst doing 40-60mph, killing someone pretty much instantly as a result.

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