No.. I called people who approved of jail sentences for this disturbed.. Probably as a result of repression

If I was that girl I’d want this bloke put away as well. I’d also say that this a male issue. This is guy apparently starting a career in law, doing blatant sexualised power attacks on vulnerable victims. Right there is a repressed person, yunki.

Lets make no apologies, this is a sex crime and should be punished like one

bat winging
When the male’s scrotum is sweaty and it sticks to the sides of the legs, to resemble a bat’s wings.

chip, give up. There may be one troll on here but when posters persist it says to me that they really do believe in what they are typing.

To those- if you ever did this to someone I love, well you’d need jail to keep safe. x

Ok.. So maybe we’re all guilty of looking at this through our personal realm of experience..

We’ve all been to different parties and we’ve all expressed our teenaged repression in different ways, in different peer groups with differing boundaries.. Context is everything

I guess the judge, being in possession of all the facts felt the silly boy in question had clearly overstepped the mark in a bad way, but I still fail to see, unless the kid is an utter wrong ‘un, how a jail sentence for this will benefit society

You’re the lawyer not me, but I’m not seeing how it is high end – it only meets one of the requirements for cat 2, and from what I can see only makes it into cat A by virtue of the filming. Also plenty of the relevant mitigating factors. Seems spot on from my reading of the new guidelines. Of course for me this is different and interesting – if it was my day job I doubt I’d be that keen on doing research for an STW argument.

Anyway as epi says, the judge will have a lot more info than we do, and most of the time they seem to do a good job. What’s more, the publicity for this is because of an appeal where 3 higher judges have looked at all the evidence and agreed with the original judge. I’d suggest that any internet lawyer trying to argue all 4 of them have got it wrong is in shaky ground.

To anybody complaining about the sentence (which includes yunki and the whatabouters) please just go and read the guidelines I’ve linked above. If you think they’re wrong (and I’d suggest that for context you need to read a lot more of them for other offences – available here) then as epi says complain to the politicians – though personally apart from the ones dealing with motoring offences they seem pretty reasonable in general to me.

Cheekyboy, western or at least British judicial systems are built on the idea that prisons are there to rehabilitate and keep those that cant be rehabilitated (eg Charlie Bronson) away from society to protect both themselves and others.

If you don’t agree with that principal then you need to change the whole British justice system. 9 months serves no useful purpose in this context imo.

but I still fail to see, unless the kid is an utter wrong ‘un, how a jail sentence for this will benefit society

Because it puts out the message that this is in no way shape or form acceptable and puts a measure of how not right it is.

how a jail sentence for this will benefit society

Theres a victim in all of this you know. Are you forgetting that- or is it a case of ‘shes a girl, shes bound to have some blokes cock in her face/its part of society/her life so shouldn’t be a big deal to her’?

Forgetting its terrible unconsented for a moment. What if she is gay. Does that magnify, the same or diminish the effects on her then?

Can you see the word victim, or should she ‘man up’?

If, you or I became very drunk on a night out and ended up in a blokes bed with no memory of what happened and you felt utterly appalled. Should you think ‘well I was at a party and I was drinking so no one else to blame’?

Was she was asking for it?

I’ve had the opportunity to take advantage of a girl before. Its seriously off-putting, so naturally thought ‘**** that’.

but I still fail to see, how a jail sentence for this will benefit society

His idea of a “joke” is to hit a girl over the head with his cock and film it.. That’s a person whose morals are seriously skewed, and is clearly a threat to women, and you can’t see that deserves a prison sentence?

I edited your comment btw, he’s a “wrong un” that’s obvious to everyone, isn’t it?

I’d also say that this a male issue.

Specific genitalia notwithstanding, care to elaborate…

What if it was your son that drunkenly cock slapped someone at the age of 19.

I’d think I’d failed him as a father.

Perspective, context, peer group..

I guess if the girl considers herself a victim of sexual assault rather than a victim of a practical joke it alters the context dramatically.. I missed that subtlety and I apologise for causing anyone offence

The sexism thing is a red herring though, cos I’m sat with my other half, and we were struggling to see the problem with it in the context of our own peer group

I guess if the girl considers herself a victim of sexual assault rather than a victim of a practical joke it alters the context dramatically

And that was the point I made earlier – you’re taking one hell of a risk doing it, assuming that the woman was going to take it as a joke. In some situations with someone else, they may well have laughed it off and genuinely been fine with it but that doesn’t make doing it to anyone ok. The physical act itself is defined as a crime, just because many people don’t take it further doesn’t change that.

I don’t think sexism is relevant here – it’s perspective (many blokes will never have felt vulnerable in the same way that many women will have).

As to the sentence itself, we don’t have the facts but it’s not been reversed or reduced which suggests that there’s some reasonable logic to it. On the face of it I agree that 9 month probably feels longer than I’d have suggested without all the facts (I’m thinking 3 or 6 months) but that’s the key point – I don’t have all the facts or a full picture of the impact to the victim’s life.

I’d also say that this a male issue.
Specific genitalia notwithstanding, care to elaborate…

Read the Grayson perry article about default man, there’s a bit in it where he says being a white male in this particular society is like playing a game on the “easy” setting. It’s a power/ dominance/ sexism thing that means some guys genuinely can’t or won’t see the problems with viewing their actions through a “male lens”

Yunki, I get what your saying. What blokes amongst themselves get upto playing soggy biscuit or whatever is one thing ( disgusting and weird) but whatever. Doing the same thing to some random “other person” just a bit **** up, no?

^^ this.

lots of blokes will scrap with their mates, pile on, whatever – even to the point where someone gets injured. No hard feelings.

but if you’ve ever had a group of strangers ‘pile on’ to you at midnight in the street, in an area known for gang crime, it’s a very different (and terrifying) kettle of fish. Even when they only leave you with a few cuts and bruises and all run off laughing, that still doesn’t make it #laddish #topbantz, no matter what they might think…

context is all!

Read the Grayson perry article about default man, there’s a bit in it where he says being a white male in this particular society is like playing a game on the “easy” setting.

You say that but there are now far less men entering higher education than women and women seem to dominate in biology research labs in all but the highest positions which are often taken by fusty old professors who will retire at some point. Women have a bit of a harder time in research because of balancing having a child with their work – but again – it can be just as hard for the postdoctoral men having a family as they have to up and move every couple of years as well.

I don’t think it’s “easy” as a man it todays society, maybe for a few privileged Bullingdon types.

Some of the facts are available in the sentencing guidelines I keep banging on about. To me the sentence seems about right (and would require some major mitigating stuff we don’t know about to be any less), crankboy who is a real lawyer seems to think it’s pretty lenient. None of that is really dependent on how traumatised the victim is – if it had resulted in major trauma then the sentence should be longer.

We’ve all been to different parties and we’ve all expressed our teenaged repression in different ways, in different peer groups with differing boundaries.. Context is everything

Wasn’t he 21? That’s getting on a bit for “teenage” high jinks is it not?

Chip, there is IMO a substantial difference between going round and slapping randoms on the head with your member, and a drunken jape gone wrong at a party. Surely you can see this?

I can’t. Care to explain, and care to explain which of the two this was?

I’ve just spotted a colleague of mine having a power nap at her desk. I’ll just go and slap my todger on her forehead and report back.

remember to film it.

Do a whirly bird too and ask which is moar offensive.

If you’re man enough, maybe fluff it up a bit first.

What I don’t ‘get’ is the mate who filmed it. Why would you film your mates cock on a sleeping female?

Before the advent of mobile phones/cam/record- how many people got away with bad behaviour- we’ll never know. Now such people ARE being caught.

The work colleagues who saw the clip- it was bad, otherwise he would have been admonished/people complained to HIM. To complain to the Police when he showed it to (what the mate obviously thought) were ‘likeminded types’- the clip must have involved rubbing it more than her face. Lips at the very least.

Anyway- I’ll leave the plastic-quasi rapists to their defence of such a bloke.

Bigbutslimmerbloke – I’ve yet to meet a person from any walk of life who at the age of 21 isn’t still very much a child emotionally and intellectually

hora – i understand this thread may contain concepts that have caused unresolved issues to surface within you.. Sorry if my thoughts about the sentencing caused you any personal offence

Anyway- I’ll leave the plastic-quasi rapists to their defence of such a bloke.

I call ad hom. No one here is defending him, some of us just don’t see the point of the sentence.

Really, I quite clearly recall when I turned 18 realising that basically I was fully responsible for my actions now – eg there was no ‘but I’m a child’ get out clause.

I’ve been trying to think of anyone I know who could have done what the guy did at the same sort of age and I can’t think of anyone, even people I really didn’t like, who would have done it. Maybe I lead a sheltered existence.

Tom, wanna explain or justify that picture?

Wasn’t he 21? That’s getting on a bit for “teenage” high jinks is it not?

Exactly, this was no young kid!
He’s 21, that’s all grown up.
it will damage his career in law? Well maybe i’d rather my future lawyers didn’t behave like that

No one here is defending him, some of us just don’t see the point of the sentence.

I think it is meant to be a punishment. That might be the point of it

Charlie, I was just trying to keep things light hearted instead of bandying accusations of being closeted rapists.

If you found it offensive then I’d be happy to have it removed and apologise.

yeah, i’m not sure that meme is helpful in keeping things light might lead to bandying of accusations of closeted racists

I think you’re doing a bit of psychological projection there but sure, ill have the mods remove it if thats how you saw it.

No, i’m not I just think that reducing a leading scientists to a stereotype is a bit racist.

but, yes I do find it offensive, please have it removed

Thanks

Fair enough, didn’t recognise him until you mentioned it.

Points of sentences.
Rehabilitation crime is a disease treat and change the criminal.

Deterrence publically punish so others are deterred. We are all talking about this,maybe slowly the message will get out to the lads that sleeping women are not fair game for sexual hi jinks.

Retribution an eye for an eye . really hard to do that in a civilised society and also how do you balance between crimes see the very valid whataboutery on the links above.

Giving society a bit of a break see the Krays sentences .

In this case I guess that there is a lot of judicial concern re sexual offences which are on the rise there are massive issues re filming and humiliating victims and particular worries re lad culture of coerced sex mixed with drink and drugs.
Cock boy is not really in need of custody or probation to rehabilitate, unless reports showed some inner issues one would guess when sober and charged he realised the error of his ways. sentence too short for the available courses any way.
The court can’t really sentence him to a filmed public facial penis slapping to be stored on the internet and randomly released or not for perpetuity.
So you are really looking at deterrence , best achieved by a short 4.5 months to do immediate prison sentence to “send a message”. The public tend not to view community service/community payback/unpaid work as a letting off.

In a case like this good character loss of career is a very double edged sword , they are the factors that probably made the young lady feel safe to drink and go to sleep in that company.

Personally I would have given him a bit longer but suspended it with a high unpaid work order and a curfew for 4 months.

Cheers mods.

Yunki- ? The internet brings out people like you who attempts to post like that?

It’s not rocket science is it.

Keep your cock to yourself unless someone else clearly indicates they wish to have a go with it.

Every boy should know that by the time they reach 13.

I’ve just spotted a colleague of mine having a power nap at her desk. I’ll just go and slap my todger on her forehead and report back.

It’s been a long time. Poorly received?