I’ll admit i dont know a whole lot about frames and bikes but Ive spent the last few days looking at small frames to take a longer adjustable fork such as cotics, charge benders, cove stiffee, Chumba HX1, stantons etc.. Some are aluminium some are steel.
Apart from weight/strength/flex etc why should i choose steel over alu??
Is it just a personal thing like those 29ers that the IT freaks keep being protective of??

Is there a good article i can read on this anywhere??
Thanks

Start with this one…

http://sheldonbrown.com/frame-materials.html

Whilst you’re reading that, I’ll try and find a few more to read…

There’s lots of myths regarding all the different frame materials (Carbon and Ti included too), and only some truths.

Whatever material you go for though, it’s 95% about the geometry, and only 5% the material it is made from that makes it ride the way it does.

Steel is real.
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Allegedly.

This one is full of the myths…

http://www.mtbbritain.co.uk/frame_metal.html

Quite amusing reading.

Oh, and love him or loathe him, find anything written on here (or anywhere on the internet) by Brant Richards of On One about frame materials, as he actually knows what he’s talking about… Same for Cy from Cotic.

If you can get test rides, pick the one that feels the most fun.
If you can’t get a test ride, pick the one that looks the most fun.

I used to be a ‘steel is real’ snob.

Then my Mrs bought a bike identical to mine, but in alloy – it’s great – feels almost as comfy as mine but lighter and feels faster.

In my experience, tyre pressures, grips and seatposts make just as much difference to comfort as frame material.

Yep, a nice lightweight steel frame such as a Rock Lobster 853 or Soul does have a certain ‘zing’ to it, which does feel nice, but they are heavier and alloy frames can be just as comfy.

My steel frame makes *the* nicest ‘ting ting’ noises when you flick the tubes or flick up mud as you ride along.

Just built up my first ever steel hardtail and I kind of believe what is often said, I’m impressed. Pretty sure I wouldn’t bother with alu hardtails ever again.

Just moved from riding an alloy frame for about a year (after riding steel for years) back to steel. Its probably in my head but the steel frame seems to be more sure footed to the trail and holds its line better, where as the lightweight alloy frame felt a bit skittish (if that’s a word).

It is all probably in my head

FTFY 😉

LOL @ mboy

On a serious note Boz, there’s lots of steel frames out there (same as there is Ti) that go out of their way to emphasise the qualities that steel is mythically famous for. Lots of steel bike designers have created frames that feel “whippy” and “forgiving”, but it’s got a lot to do with the geometry and the way they’ve used the material, rather than the material itself.

I’ve got a Ti frame now, an exact copy in Ti of the 853 Steel frame I had before. I’ve ridden lots of Ti frames in the past, and didn’t like most of them, cos they were too flexy. Ti is supposed to be flexy and forgiving, so too many manufacturers make them too flexy on purpose IMO. Anyway, with my Genesis Altitude they got it just right. The 853 steel version was spot on, handled superbly, quite stiff but not too stiff. The Ti version feels pretty much exactly the same, only 1.3lb lighter… It is very possibly ever so slightly more comfortable over a long ride, but we’re talking a fraction here, though that also is probably down to a slightly bigger rear tyre also! I have a feeling if I rode the same frame in alloy (and Genesis make the Core, which is the same geometry in hydroformed alloy), it would feel pretty similar too, maybe marginally stiffer but that would be it.

Try a Niner SIR9 / MCR. Lovely. IMO, obviously. 🙂

Year or two back I stripped my FS down for the Winter, & built up the parts onto a GT Avalanche frame I had knocking around. Also had an Inbred with same wheels, forks, seat/post, bars/stem, even same tyres. By heck was the GT harsh. And noticeably so. Not in a bad way, just different. If I wanted to cover ground, as in race, I’d pick alloy (or carbon), but for my meanderings these days my steel Niner really is nice.

take a ritchey p20 and a cotic be-fe both steel but no comparison, total different purposes and designs.

takisawa, you’re comparing Apples with Ford Mondeo’s there… TOTALLY meaningless comparison.

GT’s have always had large diameter tubes, for stifness, that has always been their goal. The 29er wheels on your Niner will also make a huge difference to ride comfort over 26″ wheels, way more so than frame material will.

To get a meaningful comparison, you need to compare frames of the same purpose and geometry, but built from the different materials.

take a ritchey p20 and a cotic be-fe both steel but no comparison, total different purposes and designs.

What he said…

Thanks mboy.. interesting read.
Peepz go on about steel frames having more spring and give which, as has already been said… is way more about the trigonometry than the reynolds tubing. Oh and maybe steel is more real too.

Peepz go on about steel frames having more spring and give which, as has already been said… is way more about the trigonometry than the reynolds tubing.

More about the tube profiles to be fair… I’ve ridden steel bikes in the past that do have that pop/zing/spring/X factor/whatever… But that’s more down to using skinny tubes, with thin wall profiles and a good tube like Reynolds 853 (which is massively stronger than normal cromoly, so you can use less of it for the same strength, which then in turn introduces some flex).

It is easier to make a steel frame that is slightly flexy/forgiving that still rides well, than it is to make an Aluminium one the same. Aluminium is naturally a lot weaker and less stiff than Steel, so you just use a whole lot more of it to get the inherent strength properties you want from a frame, in bigger profiles, which in turn ends up with a stiffer structure. A good engineer can still make a “forgiving” aluminium frame though, these days Hydroforming ally tubes to get the profiles you want, where you want them, is a big thing and can result in a much nicer riding frame than straight walled coke can profile tubes.

The science of frame design has come a LONG way since the early days, when it was perceived you had an ally frame if you wanted to race and needed the stifness, a steel frame if you wanted a nicer ride, and a Ti one if you wanted the ultimate in forgiveness and for it to last forever. As we know, that is often not the case, there are Ti frames out there that fail way too often (just search on here!), and there are Ti frames out there that are so stiff the only benefit to making them from Ti over steel is the weight saving. A good frame designer knows when and where to use each material, which is why I applaud people like Cy from Cotic who has not got dogmatic about any one material, and uses each to their advantages when and where appropriate.

I found these an interesting series of videos by Cy at Cotic about material choice etc. Personally I prefer steel, knowing it can be repaired if damaged etc, and prefers to bend rather than snap like alu.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxuT8W9cmPs&feature=relmfu[/video]
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzvLtERlCmA&feature=relmfu[/video]
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF8t3dqHxCM&feature=relmfu[/video]
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlSnh0A3IY4&feature=relmfu[/video]
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fJjHPIKzIE&feature=relmfu[/video]
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lULbzqs90c&feature=relmfu[/video]

much safer with steel as aluminium can give you alzheimers.

I have a feeling if I rode the same frame in alloy (and Genesis make the Core, which is the same geometry in hydroformed alloy), it would feel pretty similar too, maybe marginally stiffer but that would be it.

Correct, aside from the HF tubes – they’re NF (normal forming)tubes.. You can design fairly similar feeling frames from different materials and just vary weight and cost (the ride feel does vary a bit, if you’re sensitive to it), or you could make very different feeling frames. I’d say it’s fair to generalise that steel frames tend to have more flex and Al is stiffer, but how much more is another q.

For a LT HT type of bike the OP refers to, steel’s usually more durable, and a little more flexible (in a good way imo) under pressure than an tough alu frame.

Hi guys and girls, looking at buying a HT myself. Never rode suspension or disc brakes before, but would prefer to compromise on specs for good geometry with 120mm suspension, though cannot decide if steel would give a bit more confidence when riding singletrack?

Personally I prefer steel, knowing it can be repaired if damaged etc

I don’t think you would have much luck getting a crack in an 853 tube welded.

though cannot decide if steel would give a bit more confidence when riding singletrack?

Can you see the words written all the way above your post? Have you actually read them?

Steel is far more comfortable than ali ,but it is heavier.
I really enjoy riding my ali hardtail , but I love riding the steel one.

Hi Crikey, I forgot to post this earlier and they weren’t there before, sorry.

We live in times of well made frames and large volume tyres. Aluminium and steel are both good materials to make a frame out of. I personally like steel hardtails and aluminium bouncers. A good bike is a good bike regardless of the material but you have to take the full build into consideration.

Do you think you’ll notice much difference between materials with 130mm+ of fork up front and 2.3 to 2.5 inch rubber beneath?

I was a steel fan but now I ride alloy for my LTHT.

My rigid ss with 1.8″ tyres is steel and will always be real.

much safer with steel as aluminium can give you alzheimers.

yeah, people on steel bikes need to carry tetanus shots in case of crash though.

every material has a place, but it is the designers task to match purpose to materials, Steel can make a more crash resistant frame because the material is harder than aluminium. Aluminium can make a lighter frame, but the tubes need to be either thick walled and big diameter to get stiffness. thin walls are more prone to dents.

pick a colour pay your money and go ride. most of the rest is irrelevant to 90% of riders in the real world.