So the old N+1 itch is rearing its head.

I’m well down the HT steel 29er route and am very happy. It’s great at all the ‘normal’ trails i.e. fast and swoopy, up hill slogs etc. However I think that one of it’s drawbacks is when I’m on ‘very’ technical trials.

Firstly, let me define what ‘I’ mean by technical trails: a)very tightly packed trees b)very slow grinds through fallen trees to duck under c)fallen trees which have to be jumped / manualed over d)awkwardly sized drainage channels / ditches between the rows of trees (slightly wider than a 29er wheel size) e)very twisty often damp / wet trails, f)sever and quick gradient changes with little grip g)baby sized boulders perfectly placed to throw you off. Here’s a representative photo of an unfortunate fail on such trails…

Untitled by Rosscopeco, on Flickr

The 29er definitely rolls and climbs better in all conditions / surfaces but when in the really twisty stuff it takes a noticeable amount of effort to get the front wheel around and over roots / rocks / trees / ditches.

So I get thinking…would it be easier with a different wheel size or frame? I’m not a huge FS fan in that my local trails kill pivots and I need maximum grip all the time. A FS frame would not be fully justified so I’m sticking with the HT. BTW my current HT frame is a Solaris.

Thoughts and blatantly biased opinions welcomed!

i’d suggest the frame is not the limiting factor

What you described there is a short/medium travel DW turner

Your ‘suggestion’ is humbly acknowledged and duly noted 🙂

A 26er?

I’d work on technique and maybe even get some skills training. On the types of trails you mention, the bike won’t really be that much of a limiting factor. If I find a steep, tight switchback I can’t get round and cock up on, it’s not the 29er that’s the issue it’s me.

Alternatively, if you just want a new bike, MTFU and admit it’s just N+1 syndrome and get one… don’t try to rationalise it though 😛

the rider, I find my 456 nimble and agile

I blame the mudguards and bar-ends

i’d suggest the frame is not the limiting factor

I’ve got to agree, if only because that looks like the kinda off-piste trail the guys around here (Tweed Valley) build and I can’t do them either, but the fast lads I ride with can.

We all pretty much run long-fork HT’s.

That trail doesn’t look like it’d be much fun on any bike!
I would vote for a Cotic Soul, cos I have one and really enjoy riding it on techy stuff.
Maybe a Dialled Alpine would suit too?

Good to see natural materials being used 😯

Round here, if I wanted to ride over discarded carrier bags I’d head for the woods behind Sainsburys on a bmx. hth.

Ride different trails? Looks rubbish (and not very technical). 🙂

That trail doesn’t look like it’d be much fun on any bike!

On the contrary…they are the best kind of trail IMHO!

I wholeheartedly agree, the ability of the rider is where it’s at on this type of trail. When I first tried them out, on a Cotic Soul, they were proper hard. But over the piece, you defiantly get more proficient and faster.

We all pretty much run long-fork HT’s.

Impressive…I was just thinking last night that I’d give them a go on full lockout to see if this is any easier or controllable. The front wheel often ‘dives’ into the ditches and if you’re not switched on…the above happens!

Do you drop the saddle for the techy bits?
Do you use skinny XC tyres?
Do you use narrow bars and bar ends?
Have you considered using flat pedals to help gain the appropriate skills?

Edit… and is your bike too big for you?

To answer Messiah:

Yes: KS LEV..the best ‘upgrade’ yet.
No: Just changed from Schwalbe 2.25 Racing Ralphs at circa 20psi to Rocket Rons…the jury is still out. In fairness the tyres slipping is rarely the cause of an off.
No / Yes: 685mm with Ergon GP2
No…Fair point but I like my shins as they are.
99% No: I’m 5′ 11″ and it’s a medium frame size.

One with a ‘proficient technical’ rider on! 😉

If your front wheel is diving into gaps I’d suggest that you may be running too much sag and your rebound damping may be too fast.

If your front wheel is diving into gaps I’d suggest that you may be running too much sag and your rebound damping may be too fast

I do run a lot of sag which I’ll fettle with but as for my rebound damping being too fast…how would this help? On reflection maybe I’ve described this issue incorrectly…

If you look at the photo and consider the direction of travel being 90Deg to what’s in the photo…the front wheel obviously goes from a crest to a ditch…then up onto a crest and then into another ditch. If my weight distribution isn’t spot on then the front wheel pitches into these troughs and pitches me over the bars…pardon the pun!

Solaris certainly looks like the right size for you on flickr 🙂

I don’t think it’s the bike holding you back although it is set up for XC efficiency rather than gnar-core-lite(p).

A friend of mine who used to run a Rohloff struggled with it a bit in low speed tech due to the big chunk of weight being out the back… but it was probably more of a swearing point than an actual problem.

Is that a flexy SID fork? If your overbraking a flexy fork on the front will knock your confidence in that kind of terrain… let go of the brakes and let the bike role through the terrain.

I’m going to say it’s probably not a lot about the bike.

I too find those sorts of trails tricky. However, the fact you’re asking the questions you have means you’re thinking about it too much. When you get to this bit of trail do you think “Cr@p, I’m going to fall off”?

Have you tried going and spending a few hours on your own and repeatedly trying short sections until you master them? Sometimes being with other people puts additional pressure on, and if you do make a mistake your struggling to keep up rather than practicing it.

Tomd…fair point but I have to say ‘no’! These bits of trails are the bits I really love and as such I’ll ride them over and over again. If at first you don’t succeed, then try, try, try again!

id blame the sheet of plastic under the rocks, obviously diverted your attention and gaze and THAT was the cause…..

Ragleys are great technical-stuff bikes, very balanced and quick to react but excellent on challenging steep stuff. Occasionally feels a little short on slow switchbacks, is all.

But yeah, what you describe is mostly rider not bike.

wwaswas – Member

Round here, if I wanted to ride over discarded carrier bags I’d head for the woods behind Sainsburys on a bmx. hth.

Looks like permeable membrane- someone’s building a drain/seep course?

Incidentally the ‘sheet of plastic’ causing so much offence is, from memory, a sheet of rather expensive geotextile which theoretically floats on top of the sludge.

We initially tried filling the said trough with a dead sheep but it quickly disappeared into the myre!

But you are all correct it’s basically a sheet of expensive plastic!

Anything fitted with Panaracer Fire Pro’s (Reb Trim)

Messiah: For me the Rohloff is the best part of the rig…always in the best gear regardless of the speed or terrain…no peddling required when a quick change gear is required…no time consuming maintenance…I’d better stop before I offend the ‘bash the rohloff crowd’…anyway…given the colossal weight shift of my arse the Rohloff is a minor thing!

They’re Reba’s on the front but your point on not braking is probably correct.

Surely, with a 29er you have a long wheelbase which really is the best solution to preventing the front of the bike diving into holes etc?

Which leads me to suggest some tuition on using and positioning your mass more effectively. The other point is one of picking a suitable speed. If you have excellent balance and a chunk of trials skillz, you can literally clear a horrific rock garden or other terrain at less than walking pace (often “hopping pace”!) if you don’t then in the vast majority of cases speed can be your friend. If there is no time for the front wheel to drop into a hole, well, it won’t! One of the biggest gains from taking some proper tuition is the confidence it will give to your riding, which is almost enevitably accompanied by a little more speed, which in turn tends to result in a “easier” ride.

Once the balance and use of rider weight becomes second nature, you will have more time to look and assess the trail and pick a suitable line, suddenly you don’t even need to think about “popping the front wheel up and over” something, you just do it without thinking. It’s at this point where i really found the flow in my riding, where action and re-action become automatic, your looking moves off down the trail, much further infront of you, and you find yourself riding fast but in a controlled fashion 😉

Oh and two add, two changes i made have made the most difference:

1) a dropper seat post – as much as for confidence as actually being necessary

2) Before or after every ride, spend 10mins practising things like track stands, bunny hops, manuals, endos, rear wheel stands, and attempt to ride over something you haven’t before (i’m not talking about hucking off a 15foot cliff here, i mean start small, say a kerb, aim to ride up next to it, stop for 3 secs in a trackstand, then hop yourself and the bike up onto it sideways for example. start small, work up!)

Maxtorque: The ditches / troughs I’m taking about can’t be cycled over any faster or in the way you describe. The photo above gives you a flavour of what I’m referring to.

As above…I agree, installing a dropper seat post has revolutionised my riding simply becuase I can alter my weight distribution without having to think about a fat saddle being in the way.

Specific coaching wouldn’t go amiss.

Its not about the bike

A common theme that’s emerging… 🙄

Had a wee chat with TFTuned earlier re my fork set up. I was thinking along the lines of getting it PUSHED and thus hoping that the fork would ‘react’ quicker when it drops into the troughs. In short they didn’t think it would make a justifiable difference but recommended that I mess about with the sag and increase the pressures and slow my rebound down a touch. One thing I’d not thought of before was that a fork with fast rebound could kick the wheel out of line…especially if it’s stuck in the bottom of a deep trough full of sticky slimy pine needles. This actually fits with some of the offs I’d had so I’ll give it a try.

Thanks for all the opinions…it seems that I’m the one who has to change here. Sadly I’ll have to find another way to justify a N+1 solution. 🙂

rosscopeco

Maxtorque: The ditches / troughs I’m taking about can’t be cycled over any faster or in the way you describe

Do you really mean “can’t”, or just “can’t by you”? 😉

Your ditch is very similar to some up at my local forest. While not what i’d consider technical (ours are well worn and maybe a foot or so deeper with pronounced sidewalls), they can be tricky to get down if you don’t pay attention. Speed definitely helps getting over and through the lumps but gives you less time to react when you go off line. Pedals getting caught in the sides can also be a problem when the pace picks up as you’ve maybe got a couple of inches either side to play with. I believe these type of runs have an optimum speed – you just need to experiment to see what that is. It’s a bit faster than you are currently going by the sounds of it.