Need a new sleeping bag for Mrs DD.

Old one was a cheapo Vango which was bloody massive and heavy to trudge around with. We need a replacement. Assumed we’d get a down filled, but I’m seeing lightweight hollow fibre ones advertised – are they as good, lightweight and packable as down-filled?

Anyone got s recommendation for a 4-season (yeah, she feels the cold….surprise surprise 🙂 ) non-budget busting hollow fibre or down-filled bag?

Is it remotely likely to get wet?
If yes then synthetic, if will stay dry go for down.
For down check out alpkit, only issue is they sell out quick

Synthetic bags are heavier and bulkier than a down equivalent. However, down is a very poor insulator if it gets wet. A lot will come down to your budget – good down costs quite a bit more.

It’s highly unlikely to get wet! It’ll only be used for car or festival camping. But as yours truly is the festival mule, I was hoping to get something that would pack into a smaller lighter bag.

The old Vango one was a real struggle to pack down into anything manageable – well – manageable when trying to fit into a barrows wagon on the trudge from car to campsite for festivals. For car camping it was ok.

None of the synthetics have equivalent insulation to down when considering bulk and weight. The Mountain Hardware Lamina series are pretty good though – and a fraction of the cost of down too.

Cheers scotroutes, I’ll have a look into those. I know what you mean about syn vs down – just hoping for a reasonable compromise over what we had.

Synthetic for me. Snugpak with a temperature rating to suit. I like being able to simply bung them in the washing machine when they get a bit manky.

I’ll tell her that’s why she has to have a synthetic km79. 😀

Different answer to what you asked (this is STW after all), but do you generally sleep next to each other when camping?

If so I can highly recommend this Vango double bag:
http://m.gooutdoors.co.uk/vango-ambience-double-sleeping-bag-p367501

Missus is a cold sleeper and she is well toasty sharing body heat with me in this. Best part is that the top layer zips open in the middle so one person can have 3 season warmth while the other just has 2 season.

Car camping only mind, it’s massive.

P1050316 by Colin Cadden – Flickr2BBcode LITE

That’s a Lamina 0 in the blue bag (with a Prism jacket too). Should give you an idea of packed size.

IMO it’s also worth investing in a thin liner. It’ll add a little warmth and will keep the bag cleaner. Dirty insulation is less effective – similarly if it’s washed too often.

Not a chance I’m sharing a double bag with her Gee. She’s like a corpse at night whereas (apparently) I spend the night jiggling around – it might be warm but we’d just end up fighting. 😆

for car camping and festivals I’d go synthetic, because you can just simply stick synthetic in the wash and hang it out, so thus, when using it, you don’t have to care too much about it, inside and out. Down bags should be professionally cleaned OR washed in the bath, specialist down wash, an hour down the launderette in their tumble dryer on low/med, pain in the arse or costly and time consuming (if you have to send it off to a specialist cleaner). I’ve got both, but my expensive down bags are/were only used for special occasions where weight/warmth is premium ie Alpine climbing (in the old days), mid winter backpacking/camping etc and I go to great lengths to try to keep down bags reasonably clean for as long as possible ie wearing clean base layers in bed incl beanie, long johns, socks etc. My synthetic bag just goes in the washing machine when it starts to smell, simple!.

You know when you say down has to stay dry? Exactly how sensitive is it?

Will a bit of condensation/dew be enough to wreck it, or are we talking rain/river immersion?

Just generally, I guess a lot depends on the outer, etc, but just as a rough guideline?

A lot will depend on the quality of materials, design and construction. I have an alpkit down bag that can be used 3 seasons. I have never had a problem with it being cold even though I have had it fairly damp with sweat and condensation before. Not wet through but damp to the touch. If it got wet through then it would be useless but what’s the chance of that happening? Even wet through on one area then the rest will still be good, you will just have a cold spot.

Decathlon.

Will sort you out.

It’s not as simple as “dry conditions use down, damp/wet conditions use synthetic”.

Some down is treated – usually called hydrophobic down – which helps in damp conditions. I’ve not used any hydrophobic down products so can’t comment just how useful/beneficial it is. It’s not just the down though, it’s also the materials used for the inner and outer of the bag and how you use the bag. A bit of damp isn’t going to unduly affect the performance of a down bag, as km79 says, it has to be properly wet to be useless.

Lightweight materials tend not to be completely waterproof, plus there’s all the stitching to create the baffles holding the down in place. Some manufacturers use very lightweight materials for their bags but offer strips of heavier material at top and bottom to deal with condensation from breathing and your feet pushing against the shelter.

If you can keep the bag dry whilst not in use, i.e. inside a drybag, and aren’t using the bag out in the open during a rain storm then down is perfectly usable in UK conditions. You are more likely to get the bag damp/wet from the condensation from your own breath than from precipitation. Worst for this are bivy bags as you’ve a small enclosed space that you are creating damp air inside.

I think a better way of looking at down vs. synthetic is the amount of care required in looking after them. Down does require you to be careful whereas synthetic is much more resilient and will tolerate mistakes.

Don’t forget a decent sleeping pad – it can add a season to your sleeping bag’s rating.

It’ll only be used for car or festival camping. But as yours truly is the festival mule, I was hoping to get something that would pack into a smaller lighter bag.

Get synthetic so you can stick it in the washing machine and remove mud / beer / vomit etc!

km79 – Member
If it got wet through then it would be useless but what’s the chance of that happening?

Depends dun it? Yes you can double bag em in drybags (I do) but multi days in the rain will inevitably end up with your kit being wet. Over time, the tent gets soaked (assuming you’re not daft enough to bivvy) and, with no opportunity to dry out, everything in it starts to get wetter and wetter. Plus, unforseen leaks, poor pitches that flood etc add to the risk of getting everything wet.

If you get 3 consecutive days of proper rain, there’s a good chance your kit will be soaked. On bikes, these days wet day 3 equals hotel/motel/b&b/hostel etc for me. Backpacking or cycle camping out in the wilds is a different story mind.

Don’t forget a decent sleeping pad – it can add a season to your sleeping bag’s rating.

Sorry, it’s more like a poor one can reduce a bags rating by a season. It’ll also bugger up your nights sleep as you’ll be tossing and turning all night waiting to get up and get warm.

Unless you carrying/bikepacking it, I can’t see any point in going for the higher-maintenance down option. Just get a synthetic at your price point and you’ll be fine. Also make sure you have some hot food just before bed – always worth it for a nice n’toasty night’s sleep.

As others have said, down will cope with a bit of damp. My mountain marathon sleeping bag is down and I tended to be a bit damp getting in it – also often trying to dry out wet kit by sleeping with it. It was also used in a single skin tent which tended to get quite damp on the inside (and flattened onto you if it was windy!) but has a water resistant outer which copes well with that.

@Yak, food doesn’t need to be hot. If I eat something with a high fat content before going to bed, like cheese, then my guts are like a furnace as it digests it.

For car camping I’d just go with the cheap synthetic. When bikepacking I want light and compact so I’ll go with the (very expensive) down kit.

@boblo – sometimes having a poor mat or no mat at all is what you want. On ITTs where I’m “racing” then having just enough insulation to get some rest before cold wakes you up is ideal. A bit specialised and extreme I’ll grant you.

@Whitestone I’d like to be the fly on the wall when the OP suggests spooning in a Laser Comp or using bubble wrap as a sleeping mat at the next Virgin V festival…

Rearrange:shit-he-in-the-be-will 😀

It’s highly unlikely to get wet! It’ll only be used for car or festival camping. But as yours truly is the festival mule, I was hoping to get something that would pack into a smaller lighter bag.

The old Vango one was a real struggle to pack down into anything manageable – well – manageable when trying to fit into a barrows wagon on the trudge from car to campsite for festivals. For car camping it was ok.
I went from a Vango that was nice and warm but big and heavy to a down bag that is about the same level of insulation, and this combined with bivvy bag, sleeping mat and lightweight tarp is the same weight and packs down a bit smaller.

It wasn’t a particularly expensive down bag either – but I’m not planning on any winter/arctic camping trips!

For car camping though, I probably wouldn’t bother with anything beyond the cheapo vango…

Fair enough – it is pretty roomy though, more like a wrapround double duvet than a sleeping bag. Probably not too bad for some nocturnal jiggling. 😉

@whitestone – very true and good calorie density there in cheese, but the OP is going to be car-camping and at festivals. Might as well go for the hot option in these situations and get a decent dinner.

@Whitestone I’d like to be the fly on the wall when the OP suggests spooning in a Laser Comp or using bubble wrap as a sleeping mat at the next Virgin V festival…

😆 is this the correct point to mention that my mm bag has no fill on the bottom, just a sleeve to put your sleeping mat bubble wrap in.

Surely you have one of the balloon beds? The only MM I did, the overnight camp was enlivened by the regular: “pop”, “Oh, b****r!”

My sleeping mat on that occasion was three pieces of karrimat that fitted in the sleeve in the back of my OMM sack.

Deadly, there’s a couple of Softie Kestrel 6 for sale in Fishponds on GUmtree, £40 each, unused. Definitely worth a look.

If you’re going to go for Down don’t forget the ethical consideration.

Synthetic and buy a decent compression stuff sack – once packed away you can tighten the straps and get it down to a very manageable size. Don’t leave it stored like this…

Surely you have one of the balloon beds?

Nah – they’re not really any lighter than bubble wrap, and whilst they might be a bit more comfy I’m not convinced they’re any warmer. Anyway I was doing MMs (and Polaris) before those were around, and I was happy with what I was used to. Didn’t feel the need for more faff either.