I have a Yeti ASR-C, the full carbon one, bought new in 2009.
In October 2010 a hairline crack was found in the BB shell. The previous importers, Evolution, sent out a warranty replacement for the whole frame, new swingarm and everything. They didn’t even ask how it had broken (I have no idea how it happened anyway)
I joined a team for 2011 and they provided me with a bike.
This year I am racing for myself again and so built the new Yeti up. It did two 24hr races and one XC race, then I took it to the Classic Weekender. I had an incident about 5 minutes after I got there, I failed to unclip, toppled over and cracked the ‘seatstay’ part of the swingarm.
I showed this to Ride-On, a Yeti dealer who were there and they advised me to contact Silverfish, the new importers. The lovely chaps at Cotic leant me a Rocket for the weekend.
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I rang Silverfish on the Monday and they referred me back to the dealer I had bought it from.
They have been in touch with Silverfish who have refused to send a replacement. They want to sell me one for £500!
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I know it is ‘crash’ damage (does a 2mph topple-over even count?) My argument is that a frame should not break from such a silly incident, had I stuffed it into a tree at 30mph then fair enough. A quick search of the google reveals many, many people with similar problems, including a couple on here. Also, Yeti completely redesigned the swingarm for 2010. The proliferation of problems indicates to me that there is a known weakness with it and that it is therefore unfit for purpose and should therefore be a warranty issue. Even a lightweight XC bike should be able to withstand that.
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Am I being unreasonable in expecting a replacement?
I’m also a bit cross as Evolution took a perfectly good swingarm away with the rest of the frame, I should have kept it for spares. Not Evolution’s fault, just one of those things. No doubt it made it’s way back to Yeti. Do they examine these broken ones to help improve the design?
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I won’t mention the dealer at this stage. I don’t know if they have called Silverfish and when told ‘no’ have just said ‘OK, we’ll sell him a new one’ or whether they have been arguing my case for the last week.
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I have looked at getting it repaired, been quoted £220. This could cause problems with the warranty claim but I need to race it very soon and can’t wait for the argument with Silverfish to drag on. If I end up going down the route of trading standards/Sale of goods act route claiming unfit for purpose I expect that could take a while.
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Contrast Marin: New XC100 in March 2004, frame cracked November 2005, new Mt Vision Pro arrived 6 weeks later. Broke the swingarm (stick through mech, hanger failed to snap and ripped the dropout open) mid-2006 (after original warranty was up) New swingarm, bearing etc within a fortnight. The replacement for my big bike when it finally dies is much more likely to be a Quad XLT than an ARS7!
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Lesson learnt: Always lie about how damage ocurred.
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End of rant.

Don’t most warranties have a clause about not racing?

majority of broken bones happen from ‘topple overs’ amazing the damage you can do at slow speed.

i’m on their side im afraid.

Even a low speed impact can be significant, it’s a light bike too.

Also it’s cracked, not nec broken – keep riding it (and suck it up)…

Given the length of time yo would only be entitled to a partial refund even if you win your case – you have had use of the bike for years. Crash damage as well – I wouldn’t bother fighting

It’s still crash damage regardless of speed. If they had only replaced your main frame and you had an older swingarm that didn’t match would you have been happy? By getting a complete frame, it avoided that problem. You wouldn’t be entitled to keep the swingarm either. It’s not a warranty problem, probably not what you want to hear though

Bad luck but I don’t see why the manufacturer should replace something that was caused by you and not them, despite their product failure rate.

Clearly they’ve turned their back on you, and lots of other Yeti owners so, I think I’d do the same to them and buy from a better manufacturer next time.

Racing and crash damage = no chance on virtually every frame warranty out there. I wouldn’t say it was an inherent flaw either, the carbon will have been laid-up to deal with normal riding stresses not a side impact.

I’d pay the £220 and get it fixed, the warranty claim is going nowhere anyway. 😮

i had a low speed crash in penmachno, riding at walking speed. Snapped the end off my elbow and tore off my tricep tendon. Riding speed doesnt always dictate impact speed (I came off sideways so was “slingshotted” into the ground) or impact force.

It was damaged in a crash, in a race, both of which are probably exempted from warranties anyway. Older carbon Yeti rear ends are infamous for snapping.

How well a high-end brand or retailer should deal with it is another matter. Good luck, I’d feel the same as you, but dont think youll have much luck under the warranty or SOG route- better to hope for some post-warranty goodwill. I take it Yeti dont do a crash replacement policy with reduced or at-cost replacements then?

I’m also a bit cross as Evolution took a perfectly good swingarm away with the rest of the frame, I should have kept it for spares. Not Evolution’s fault, just one of those things

Well they were under no obligation to provide you a new swing arm from a broken main triangle, so I’d say you got lucky there, keeping the old swingarm as well would have been taking the pee somewhat!

I’m with them, you crashed, it’s impact damage. Suck it up and repair or replace.

At £500.00 that would be a crash replacement at cost…

500 is cost for a swing arm? Given Evolution were selling £2K rrp old stock ASR7 frames for £800? Really?

P20 – Member
It’s still crash damage regardless of speed

If it got knocked over by accident and hit same rock without a rider on – is that still crash damage? ❓

Yes.
Same as if you left the hand-brake off on a car and it rolled down a hill and into a wall.

No gripes with Evolution taking the old swingarm, they did include a shiney new one with the new frame 🙂 Just included as background info really.
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Looks like no-one is siding with me then? I would have thought the sheer number of these failures and the nature of my ‘crash’ would have indicated a design flaw, which should be a warranty issue.
The racing bit shouldn’t matter, it is sold as a race bike (even a little sticker on the frame which says ‘For Racing Only’!) TBH I’ve never dared ride it other than in a race in case I broke it, I have bigger, stronger bikes for messing around on. This is one reason it was only it’s fourth ride, which is another sore point for me.
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Shame, because when it works it is very fast, but if they accept this kind of failure as normal I certainly won’t have another. I’ll drop Yeti themselves an email and ask very nicely if they can help out, they must have lots of spares lurking somewhere, or see if they can get Silverfish to be a little more helpful.

Same as if you left the hand-brake off on a car and it rolled down a hill and into a wall

If it hit the wall at 2mph and cracked the bumper, fair enough.
If the whole chasis buckled and wrote the car off some would question the strength and suitablity of the chasis?

*sights*

To repeat:

1. they can’t design a lightweight racing frame to withstand every impact.

2. you don’t know the force of the impact in question.

3. it’s cracked but not broken? It might go on riding fine indefinitely.

I know an ASR5 retails at a rather large amount of money, but does a carbon swingarm/triangle really cost £500 at ‘cost’? 😯

(all-alloy asr-sl here, and I got an nos rear triangle in an ebay auction for, ooh, about a tenth of that!)

If it got knocked over by accident and hit same rock without a rider on – is that still crash damage?

Yes.

I have seen the damage done to a Klein attitude that fell over onto a terracotta planter, one hell of a dent in the downtube.

Certainly not a warranty issue, just bad luck.

I know an ASR5 retails at a rather large amount of money, but does a carbon swingarm/triangle really cost £500 at ‘cost’?

Unfortunately, yes.
I know what you are thinking, ‘I could have bought a car for that.’ and I have done, three actually, and the cheapest two were less than that together!

No.
Yes.

“I would have thought the sheer number of these failures and the nature of my ‘crash’ would have indicated a design flaw, which should be a warranty issue.”

Sorry but are you referring to the few that have been mentioned on forums, there is a very small failure rate on the ASR5, so no its not a design, or manufacturing fault therefore not a warranty issue.
Silverfish and Evolution are very good at dealing with warranty claims and deal with genuine claims very quickly.

OP – if the opions on this thread are anything to go by then it seems you don’t have a warranty case.

Your experiences have definitely put me off carbon though.

I would have thought the sheer number of these failures and the nature of my ‘crash’ would have indicated a design flaw, which should be a warranty issue.

Think about the intended use of a bike. Would you consider that use to include crashing?

My mate bought a Ridgeback to go touring on. On the first trip out he dropped the fully loaded bike in the campsite, his crosstube finding the only rock there and put a decent dent in it. Warranty issue?

Sorry dude 🙁

Think about the intended use of a bike. Would you consider that use to include crashing?

Er, yes in the case of a mountain bike. However, I agree that the OP doesn’t have a case here.

Think about the intended use of a bike. Would you consider that use to include crashing?

I suspect everyone that’s rode a MTB has binned it at some point or the other. I’d expect a MTB to be able to wishstand minor spills.

Back to the OP: If your SPD mishap resulted in you toppling over onto soft ground, and you’ve had no other previous spills that may have resulted in hidden damage to the frame, then I sympathise with you being hacked off with the frame cracking. However if the T&Cs of your warranty excludes racing, crash damage etc. then you’re stuffed. On what basis did Silverfish refuse your claim?

“think about the intended use of the bike”
when i go out, i intend to ride my bike, i dont intend to crash it, drop it, fall off it etc.
its shit when you’ve only ridden it 4 times, i reckon that would piss anybody off tbh.
but it was an accident, not a manufacturing fault.
this situation could happen for any rider out there, relatively easily, the bottom line is: if you have a £4k bike, you could do £4k of damage on just about any ride.
im not saying its very likely, or that it would be easy.
OP, youve got my sympathy m8, but i dont think its a warranty claim imo.

“think about the intended use of the bike”
when i go out, i intend to ride my bike, i dont intend to crash it, drop it, fall off it etc.

No but it happens and it’s part and parcel of mtbing. It’s not unreasonable to expect a MTB to withstand minor spills. However, whether the warranty was valid at the time or the manufacturer believes the OPs story, is another matter though.

Just curious why it’s £200 quid for a repair, people in our club have been getting smashed top tubes on road bikes done for c£100 including delivery

I had my yeti 575 swingarm repaired for £40

Yet again another SF UK service failure and charging over tops prices and not admitting responsuobility.
Barstewards even if reasonably friendly over phone, they,ll sure make u pay for it!

😯 /\ where to begin?

I know, quick mistyping Smokey rollie out in garden on moby w0by 😛

Dropping an MTB like that is not an unlikely occurrence – easily done in the carpark if not propped up correctly.

Whilst breaking it in such circumstances may not be a warranty claim (no manufacturing fault as such) if a mountain bike can’t take that kind of impact it’s not really a very good mountain bike is it… I mean, it’s a sport which involves fast riding in the outdoors amongst rocks and trees where unintended dismounts are part of the sport. A rock strike could have the same level of impact for instance…

So I don’t think yr unreasonable for thinking it’s not saying much for the quality (or service) of Yeti but I don’t think it’s a warranty claim.

Personally I wouldn’t buy a Yeti if it can’t take that kind of impact – they’re priced as premium products. And if their customer service is to make you pay full whack for a replacement I’d never ride it outside my lounge in case it ever touched anything solid!!

Warranty or not, all goods sold in the UK must be fit for intended purpose. This is the law, warranties have no impact on this and most definitely does not restrict your rights.

The question is whether it is reasonable for a mountain bike to break under these circumstances – I’d have thought not. In my completely personal view, it seems wholly reasonable to expect them to survive a reasonable amount of rough handling.

The responsibility to you under the law sits with the retailer not the manufacturer, the retailer can the take it up with the manufacturer subsequently.

But to be aware…

I do not have specific experience of consumer protection legislation in relationship to mountain bikes and case law may already have defined what constitutes fit for purpose in such cases. If it is that you have been sold unfit goods don’t feel guilty about getting a replacement or refund.

If bike and rider fall over (not talking unattended bikes in car parks), with seat stay taking the brunt of 70-80kg against what could be a sharp object, I’m not surprised it broke. Doesn’t matter that it’s at 2 mph but if it did, where is the limit and how do you prove it?

Bikes aren’t designed to be crashed. End of.

Some of the crap on here,

No one is going to design a bike to be crashed, end of. Bikes are designed to be ridden from point a to point b. Even DH bikes aren’t designed to be crashed. A bike might be slightly overbuilt to allow for the treatment it is going to receive, but who is going to buy a frame that weighs 20lbs but is made of solid bars and thus crash proof?

If you want a frame that weighs 3-4lbs it is going to be possible to damage it by dropping of rocks,etc.

I had a bike of mine damaged by baggage handlers, surely with so many people flying to the alps with bikes all bikes should be able to withstand the baggage handler treatment?

to the OP **** happens, see what they can offer as a crash replacement, see what it costs to repair and get on with life.

fourbanger – Member
Bikes aren’t designed to be crashed. End of.

But are designed for a sport where crashes are common/likely…