I’ve always been a Shimano man – looking at getting a new bike and quite a few are loaded with SRAM kit.
I like how Shimano stuff works and it’s longevity….will I really notice any difference with Guide brakes to SLX brakes, and SLX shifters to SRAM GX or X1?

Similarly, and I know this is all subjective…Fox or Rockshox for FS bouncing duties?
(Walks away from can of worms he just opened)…

Haterz will be and all that but gx for me is xt level, my 11sp is 4000km in and going well, been solid and reliable. Brake wise I’m. Happy to see the end of my xt’s but replaced them with hope. Heard a lot of good things about the guides though.

Gears etc are much of a muchness (apart from sram’s front mechs being crap, but literally I am the only person in the world with a front mech), but I would never willingly put any other manufacturer’s crank on a bike other than Shimano.

but I would never willingly put any other manufacturer’s crank on a bike other than Shimano.

To add, having run SRAM and RaceFace cranks for the last 4 years I can’t see a reason to use Shimano. Using Hope BB’s with them easier to fit and remove, no hassle with preloads, no need for a torque wrench just an 8mm.

Personal preference isn’t it. Guide brakes knock spots off xt in RS spec and above, the sram 10t cassette has an advantage, shifting is more solid imo, although some prefer the lighter shimano feel. Shimano always won on price but now the gx and Nx options are available they no longer have that.

I run sram by choice as it all works so well together, reverb, brakes, shifters etc apart from the race HT where shimano wins purely because of the 2 way shifter, hands rest on the brake tops for miles so shifting is much easier. I’m a tart for everything matching so everything else on that bike is xt as well, brakes also come out a bit lighter than guides.

Rockshox on everything for me, but only because I find maintainence much easier sticking to one brand. I’m tempted by a set of fox 36 for one bike but know a service won’t be a 10 minute job. Find the guide brakes a lot easier to bleed than shimano as well.

I had a SRAM X9 rear mech on a bike a couple of years back. I liked the button that locked the mech in a forward position making it easier to get the rear wheel on or off, and splitting the chain.

Suspension wise, I’ve had RS and Fox. I’m not “pro” enough to be able to tell the difference.

I know I have a whinge about SRAM quite a lot on Wednesday nights, but it’s not all bad.

My GX1 rear mech does seem very sturdy, but the jockey wheels are shit and replacements are £££££s. The cable routing is also a ball ache as it goes under a cover that is just not necessary. It also goes around a silly little wheel guide thing when a nice loop of cable would be best.

The shifter seems good (although it doesn’t have two-way upshifting like shimano. Changing the cable is a bit of a pain as the routing in the shifter is not as Cut and dried as shimano.

The brakes are a bit of an arse (the ones I had) as it was a full two syringe job. Shimano are much simpler.

The crankset is the worst bit. There is a stupid ‘you can’t use anyone else’s bottom bracket’ taper on the axle so that there is a step that sits against the bearing as well as going through (if you see what I mean). This is totally unnecessary. The insert that sits on the axle inside the driveside bearing can also work its way out into the intentional gap between the face of the bb bearing and the spider body. This then causes play that makes it seem like the bearing is knackered. This bit of design is utter shite and SRAM need a kicking for trying to build in incompatibility and making a poor design in the process. Who would create something like this?

SRAM cassettes are not a bad design – having the driver means you can get a 10t small sprocket on so the potential gear range is larger. SRAM cassettes and chains have always seemed better in wear terms to me.

So a mixed bag, but the bits where SRAM have over engineered simple things or deliberately built in incompatibility and screwed up outweigh the positives for me.

SRAM’s design strategy a lot of the time seems to be “how many parts does this component really need? Double this and add one to make sure it is different and incompatible with other stuff”.

Shimano purely because you can go into a faster gear by using your index finger.
I really don’t get the push for up , push for down Sram shifting.

I do like the 10 tooth cog though. Could you make it work with a shimano 11 speed shifter and mech?

Shimano, it just works. They’re often a little slow to bring things to market as they like to make sure things work before they do.

I take the view that you need a bloody good reason not to buy Shimano

I take the view that you need a bloody good reason not to buy Shimano

The brakes that fail
Overweight
HTII
ISPEC A-Z
Less range and Heavier

SRAM have stepped up with the 1x stuff and the new brakes

I really don’t get the push for up , push for down Sram shifting.

I guess it’s what you’re used to, if the shifters are angled correctly, your thumb is generally already in a natural position to shift up or down.

I don’t really mind either way to be honest, biggest thing is to have them set up well for good shifting.

I’m all sram but my front mech is a shimano SIS lol! It’s agricultural but it works and doesn’t bother me to much as I don’t shift front rings that much, I generally live on the middle ring. But it’s nice having the range of a tripple when I want it.
Yes I’m a luddite 🙂

I do like the 10 tooth cog though. Could you make it work with a shimano 11 speed shifter and mech?

Have just done that recently, works well.

Things I think Shimano does better than SRAM:
Brakes (good value and powerful even at the lower price points)
Shifters (shifting multiple gears)
Rear mechs (I’ve seen so many SRAM ones with sloppy pivots)

Things I think SRAM does better than Shimano
Cassettes (I like XD drivers and 10-42 cassettes, weight is better although more expensive)
Cranks – marginally.

I went from full shim to full sram in 2006. After 1 rear trigger shifter with chocolate internals, ridiculously easily rounded off jockey wheel bolts and rear mech adjustment screws, i started to migrate back. Self-loosening non-driveside crank arm damaged axle splies…back to Shimano. Lost hours of my life to juicy 5 brakes. I’m now Shimano through to shoes and lube!

Edit: Original RS Revs about ready to die….and my xGen front mech and x7 trigger just won’t!

I’m a SRAM fanboy if I’m honest.

The 11 speed GX / X01 set up knocked spots off the 11 speed XT drivetrain I rode for two weeks last year. The cassette is wearing really well (it’s 18months old and I’m just running it until it’s shagged). SRAM mechs can get a bit floppy but they still seem to work; I have an old X9 mech from 2005 that is sloppy as a sloppy thing it once on a bike it works fine.

I’m a convert to the Guide brakes too after the disaster sthat were my XTR Trails, Zee and XT785’s all were. I’m running RSC’s on my Stanton and my Demo and not touched either other than pads in 18 months. The integration of shifter, Reverb and brakes dies keep things tidy.

SRAM cranks are grim though other than the carbon jobbies, but I run Turbines.

Shimano aren’t even interested in competing with SRAM on drivetrains right now, they’ve made some second rate kit for the OEM market and then walked away. It’s not that they’re losing, they’re just not in the fight at all. I’m using XT shifting and really wish I’d gone GX. A strange turnoaround from 10 speed where they ruled the roost (my Saint 10 speeds are the best shifters I’ve ever used… And I’m still using M970 XTR)

Brakes, they do different things, Shimano are still good at the “costs nothing, works, not very servicable” market, SRAM set their sights a bit higher. I’ve no idea why anyone buys XTR brakes- high cost, low servicability, terrible combo. I think SRAM are throwing a lot at the brakes to counter years of their stuff being shit, tbh. But they don’t have their near-monopoly in brakes unlike drivetrain so there’s more competition. (nobody else has made a competitor for the 2011 Formula The One yet 😉 )

I haven’t been in the market for forks for ages. As a result I reckon my “Rockshox are crude but rugged like an AK47, Fox are trick and temperamental” motto is probably out of date. I’ve never ridden anything other than rockshox, so no help really.

Tend towards Shimano, only because I understand it and I know it’s foibles and quirks, they seem to be losing the innovation war at the minute to SRAM, but I’ve found it’s solid and dependable. In the real world, as long as they’re well maintained, I don’t think there’s really anything it it. Had Fox suspension and RS, and while you lose a bit a absolute performance, against Fox I think you gain in reliability with RS, choose according to those “rules” and I think you’ll get the shocks/forks you want.

I prefer RS and Shimano, but I wouldn’t be unhappy if I had SRAM and Fox either.

I think we’re pretty lucky to get a pretty wide choice of mostly good performing kit TBH.

Like Northwind says 10 speed Shimano probably was the pinnacle for any companies groupset – the whole range was perfectly balanced between cost and performance, its not quite the same now they’ve gone 11, whereas SRAM keep making theirs better with every iteration.

I’ve always been Shimano and having bought a bike several years ago that had Juicy 3s I vowed never to buy anything SRAM ever again. Those brakes never got changed as the bike sat in the garage unused for years and has only recently come back out. I still hate the Juicys and was all set on buying a set of deores bit the new SRAM levels are intriguing. The reviews I find all say they are pretty good for the money (cheap) and I know that Guides have been a bit of a turning point for SRAM so tempted to eat humble pie and give them a go. Have SRAM really moved past the Avid days?

I always found 9s and 10s SRAM a bit fragile, I went through numerous mechs before switching back to Shimano.

Got to agree with the consensus though, if the fragility has been improved upon (looks like there are fewer CNC bits, so probably) and the cost has come down a bit then the Shimano 11s doesn’t have much going for it when SRAM weighs the same and/or has more range.

As for brakes, they seem much the same now. I thnik I prefer Shimano, but actually have SRAM Elixir on my most used bike as there’s little to seperate them.

SRAM drivetrain – haven’t even tried Shimano for probably 4/5 years now, I have an XX1 groupset that refuses to die. The only bit I won’t use is the crankset.

That’s for a few reasons, having tried them, and Raceface, basically anything with a self extracting bolt is crap compared to a Shimano crank. So they are what I use.

SRAM Guide brakes – just great. So much better than the old XTR’s I replaced.

I’m a fan of SRAM at the moment. Not Eagle however, when it works, i’m sure its lovely but 2 friends riding with it are endlessly swearing at it, it needs constant attention.

Got mix of SRAM and Shim on my bikes and the kids’:

2009 XO 9spd still works a dream been through a lot and now on my daughters bike.
2015 GX1 11spd been through lots (strava says 1100mls and I don’t use it all the time) and only one cable change, original cassette and jockey wheels 4 th chain though. Using the thumbs is no issue at all.

However I was very wary of going back to SRAM brakes (GUIDES) after years of issues with Juicy and Elixir I had swapped to Shim SLX and Deore. The Guides are brill and I would happy buy another set just because of their feel and modulation.

Obviously the answer is Sram , Shimano don’t make a high level Grip Shifter .

Does anyone else suffer from the driveside pedal axle adaptor working its way out into ‘the gap’?

It really, really pisses me off as it is so unnecessary.

It really, really pisses me off as it is so unnecessary.

Just add a couple of o-rings. Cost you about a quid and your BB will last for ages.

Tough, but I got to call it Shimano, for the money sram is reassuringly too expensive.

SRAM needs its own special XD hub , mine fell of the wheel with the cassette attached.
1×11 is smoove as is the shifter.
I prefer my Xt 11s cassette and XTr shifter and a raceface aeffect crank, prefer the cinch system and SRAMs over the standard Shimano chainring setup

My Guide R brakes failed last week and the other is on its way out, local shop isn’t a fan of sram brakes, and they say Shimano (or hope) all day long
That said I’m awaiting a warranty replacement on a Xt m8000 brake.

benpinnick – Member
It really, really pisses me off as it is so unnecessary.
Just add a couple of o-rings. Cost you about a quid and your BB will last for ages.

POSTED 50 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

Already found a plumbing seal in an Aldi selection of seals and o-rings that fits perfectly, so no, not difficult or expensive to remedy, but should a prestigious manufacturer of bike components have designed something in the first place that needs a bodge like this?

I think not.

prefer the cinch system

I disagree on this one after finishing a high speed descent with a shimano pedal and axle hanging off of my shoe when it flew off. The ‘safety’ retaining pin is as much use a chocolate fireguard.

The self extracting bolt on SRAM is better.

I’m SRAM-ed up too. I’m a bit conflicted about it though. The guide brakes are the best I have had and that includes hope tech M and X4, XT and the fabled formula the ones 😉
They work very well, hardly ever need a bleed and if they do they are very easy to get right.
The XX1 drivetrain works and works well. I like how the shifter and reverb bolt to the brakes without a million variants but I do miss the trigger shift of XT. No isdies with the carbon cranks, i think theyre great. My biggest worry is replacing mechs and cassettes. It is frankly extortionate and I’ll have a long old look at XT at that point. The guides are here to stay though, they’re league’s ahead go Shimano in every metric I can think of.

Have we done subaru V’s mitsi yet?

I’ll probably go SRAM when I next get a new bike as so many designs don’t work with a front mech and the 10t sprocket makes a big difference to range.
But in my experience Shimano stuff just works, and the spares availability on SRAM brakes is because you need it. SRAM shifters and mechs (and BBS) just aren’t well put together and I expect to convert to Shimano mech and shifter if this works with the SRAM cassette after about 6 months when the pivots go wobbly.

dannyh – Member

The ‘safety’ retaining pin is as much use a chocolate fireguard.

Well yeah, it’s the 2 bolts which actually keep the crank on. Any crank’s bad if you don’t tighten it properly.

mattyfez – Member

Have we done subaru V’s mitsi yet?

AUDI!

I’m a huge fan of SRAM for Guide RS and 11sp and above. Not wildly struck by their cranks though, tend to prefer RF.

As for ‘level’ of groups, I’d agree that by and large GX is XT apart from the shifter, with X01 and XX1 being approximately XTR Trail and XTR Race. GX is let down by the shifter IMO, I tend to use an X1 shifter with it which feels better. X1 kind of sits uneasily in the range, and it’s telling that for Eagle they’ve skipped it (although the GX Eagle cassette seems to be closer to X1 than GX 11 with it’s pinned but including alloy larger cogs build).

In my mind Shimano haven’t really made the effort in 11sp – the end of the 10sp stuff was great but it’s almost like they expect electronic shifting and e-bikes to be the big markets to come and are avoiding the arms race for now.

The ‘safety’ retaining pin is as much use a chocolate fireguard.

the only crank arm I’ve had that’s fallen off while riding was sram.

So the best all-round performance/value 11 speed groupset is Shimano XT cranks, XTR shifter, XT rear mech with a SRAM GX cassette, SRAM Guide brakes and Problem Solvers MisMatch to mount shifter to brake levers?

For value certainly, I don’t think I could argue with that. Get the Guide RSC’s though.

SRAM are good at concepts, but awful at making them a reality (top end cassettes being an exception).

10T sprocket adds range on paper but loses so much efficiency that it’s pointless.

Shimano brakes had a blip with early M8000 and M9000/9020 but thankfully have that sorted.

Construction of all parts is head and shoulders above from Shimano apart from Sram’s cassettes which are beautifully made, but ludicrously expensive and fundamentally flawed with the phoney hook of the pointless 10T sprocket.

For me Shimano win on 11 spd. SRAM win with their entry 12 spd stuff. For now…

Well yeah, it’s the 2 bolts which actually keep the crank on. Any crank’s bad if you don’t tighten it properly.

Wow, thanks for that. It was the speed and suddenness that the crank loosened with that caught me out and I doubt that would happen with a conventional bolt. I may be wrong.

Meanwhile a picture of a bear shitting in the woods to further interest you 🙄

You’re wrong. 😉