Viewing 17 posts - 1 through 17 (of 17 total)
  • Scottish Rate of Income Tax (SRIT) – which way do people think it's going to go?
  • Mat
    Full Member

    Preface: go somewhere else if you want to slog it out about the indy ref/independence/union!

    I’ve not been keeping up to speed with this Scottish Rate Income Tax stuff and the background behind it. My understanding of the SNP is they’ll want a more homogeneous re-distribution of wealth but the way it’s set up it seems they can’t do that unless they reduce taxes:

    SRIT Infographic

    Is this savvy on the part of UK Gov – give Holyrood powers but structure them in a way that stops them doing what they want?

    What are peoples thoughts, which way are they going to go and by how much?

    scotroutes
    Full Member

    Your first sentence and your fourth sentence are mutually exclusive so I’m out.

    whatnobeer
    Free Member

    Is this savvy on the part of UK Gov – give Holyrood powers but structure them in a way that stops them doing what they want?

    It’s this tactic that will eventually lead to another referendum and and yes vote. I’m not sure of the reasoning behind implementing the SRIT in this way, but lacking the ability to vary it with income makes it a much less useful than it ought to be.

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    Mat
    Full Member

    scotroutes – ok, maybe I should have simply said let’s stay focused on the question! I suppose any attempts to second guess the thinking behind either camp is going to breach my first rule!

    WNB – was the SRIT not announced well before the ref?

    scotroutes
    Full Member

    Holyrood had tax varying powers from day 1. Thet were never used as to do so woukd have disadvantaged the lower paid. Very clever tactics, power devolved is power retained and all that.

    PaulGillespie
    Free Member

    Are these the additional income tax raising powers to be given under Devo Max? Seems a little pointless if so.

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    Technical details are very dry (gov website) but main recent news is that HRMC is claiming it will be very difficult to administer.

    Answer – with difficulty

    Mat
    Full Member

    Paul – I can’t remember what we were calling what we ended up with post september… but I thought these additional tax raising powers were granted in 2012? I’m struggling to find a one stop shop for background info tbh.

    tmh – that was the news that prompted me to start looking which way things are going (selfishly I’m thinking how it will influence me!)

    squirrelking
    Free Member

    ^Calman Report?

    EDIT: yup, thats the puppy http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/8100215.stm

    Mat
    Full Member

    Thanks all, I’ll have a read!

    PaulGillespie
    Free Member

    Mat, yeah lots of reference to 2012 but also April 2016. I thought the addition powers post referendum had not been officially approved yet.

    I assume that the info graphic is old and will be amended in due course….I severely hope so anyway!

    AlasdairMc
    Full Member

    Will this be based on those employed in Scotland or resident in Scotland? Could there be a commuter exodus to Carlisle or Berwick?

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Mat – Member

    Is this savvy on the part of UK Gov – give Holyrood powers but structure them in a way that stops them doing what they want?

    Yup. Give the impression of devolving powers, but make sure they’re impractical to use, double win since you can say later “But we gave you powers and you’re not using them!” Horribly cynical but good gameplaying in the short term at least. In the longer term, maybe not too clever.

    br
    Free Member

    Technical details are very dry (gov website) but main recent news is that HRMC is claiming it will be very difficult to administer.

    Presumably due to the impact on ALL UK residents, ie needing to declare what was earned where and where you were (for every day)?

    maccruiskeen
    Full Member

    give Holyrood powers but structure them in a way that stops them doing what they want?

    Holyrood has had tax varying powers since devolution and theres never been a discussion about using them

    SNP ….. want a more homogeneous re-distribution of wealth

    So do labour, at a Scottish and UK level*. The problems is – its not what the party wants it what voters will pay for. Its easy to look at countries with more equitable societies, see how happy they are and say ‘hey, we could be just like them’ but between where we are and where they are is a long process and a lot of taxation that the people being taxed won’t see the benefit of until after they’re dead. It would take at least a generation to make that re-distributed, fairer, happier country but governments can only work in 5 year instalments and they know that an electorate would boot them out before they could even half start the job – and more to the point if they stated the plan they just wouldn’t get elected at all.

    Doing anything sustained or important with tax varying powers in Scotland would require scotland to have an entirely different species of voter, rather than one that is just dissatisfied with the status quo. If a fair society was an ideal that we’d really put our weight behind rather than our voice then we’d have started that generation-long journey 15 years ago. Thats the difference between being ‘Independent’ and just being separate.

    * Frank Fields’ Report under the Blair government where he was briefed to ‘think the unthinkable’ which basically concluded that the change you could bring about by properly progressive taxation would be amazing – a happier society and ultimately a cheaper to run government as there would be less of the costs of unhappiness to be met – but that ultimately the programme to get there would make any party unelectable as you’d asking the electorate to pay now for people’s happiness later.

    thestabiliser
    Free Member

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