Anyone else had a shocker?

All our 5 choices are closer than the school we have been given, our first choice is by my calculations (Based on post office data and centre of school as per schools admissions) the closest, albeit council disagrees by a matter if metres.

We have been put in a school with the lowest educational attainment in the area.

AAARRGGHH

Which school is in your catchment area?

We are on the border of two schools catchment area as per last years maps.

We didn’t put our closest in the 5 choices (this is turning out to be a big mistake), but following their admissions policy guidance I work it out their suggested closest isn’t. Not that it matters as we didn’t get either.

We got given a school over 2km away despite their being about 5 schools closer.

Waiting for our youngest’s place at the moment, even though she’s a sibling I’m still nervous. Our eldest got put into our 6th choice which was only down as a list filler, and though a decent school was not in a great location. Make sure you’re on as many waiting lists as possible, we were 6th on our first choice and got an offer by mid May. It went further down the list than that too as we have friends that got in months later (but before term start). Good luck.

We failed to get into a school 200m from our house a couple of years ago

Waiting today to see if Sibling gets awarded same school as big sis is now at – “should” be ok but we moved part way through the registration process and we have to rely that all the correct pieces of paper have been given to the correct people at the council.
Would not be surprised if we get awarded our first choice school next to our old house. 😀

with a little bit of 🙄 😥

It was me who let off the Fire extinguisher…

Oops, sorry wrong thread.

Yeh our nearest 2 are less than 500 metres away. Going to be applying for loads of waiting lists. My understanding is you can ask to be told where you are on them as well?

@Doh1Nut 200m 😯 still didn’t get in OMG what you got to do!!

The 200m one was CofE
So there were 30 siblings who got in first
and 30 sets of parents from further away who suddenly found god in the preceding 6 months and got in on the religion ticket.

I think I showed a greater moral compass by not pretending to find god 🙂
But perhaps he moves in mysterious ways as the church school got “requires improvement” on its next Ofsted 😯

I’ve all this to look forward to. School about 200m away is excellent. Can I not just turn up at the start of term and drop sandwicheaterjnr off? pffft!

we’ve just had our letter recently from the school to confirm acceptance for our daughter…but it was a bit of a fight to get the placement.
her brother is already there so we presumed that she would be given a higher priority as per the schools admissions policy. but the school decided to change the policy without notice. the previous policy stated that children with special needs/in care would get first priority, then those with siblings already at the school, followed by those who lived closest and everyone else. they changed this to the oldest irrespective of the previous criteria.
my daughters birthday is in june so she was pretty low down the list so i cited the old policy which was still on the schools website and the fact that they failed to inform parents of the change and the reasons for it.
after a long battle the school head relented and informed us that little miss gonzy had a place at the school.
sometimes taking them on is worth it

As all schools should be working to a similar sylabus, and employing trained qualified teachers, surely questions should be asked of the mangement of the schools why theyre failing,or perhaps its the mangement of the schools that failed and just awaiting pension time before they stop attending and not doing any real work to increase the skill levels of the staff.

But then im not a teacher, just a joe public on the street living near a poorly performing school, that seems to spend more cash on new mini buses signs and banners than kids education and is soon to make a few teachers redundant.

But then im not a teacher, just a joe public on the street living near a poorly performing school,

Can of worms…..but what do you, as a non teacher, perceive poor performing to mean? Is it the Ofsted report you are referring to, local gossip, the anecdotal stories from past or current parents? You might want to be cautious before just going along with Ofsted’s definition.

OP can you appeal the decision in your area? My niece didn’t get her first choice, so my sister officially appealed and managed to get her in eventually.

We were up at 2am this morning checking on the local admissions website and were very lucky to find out that our daughter got into the village school a short walk from our house. There are only 20 places available, and half of them were already going to siblings. Our daughters best friend who lives a little further from the school than us didn’t get in. Can’t believe how nervous me and Mrs Wilko were in the build-up to finding out. We barely slept a wink last night, daft really.

My daughter got into our first choice, the school which 200 odd metres from our house. All this ratings and choices smacks a bit of capitalism, we had none of this nonsense when we were kids and we all turned out okay, well you know, most of us did.

It was me who let off the Fire extinguisher…

Oops, sorry wrong thread.
Now that *DOES* deserve a thread in itself…

We are on the border of two schools catchment area as per last years maps

This is one of the flaws in the “as the crow flies” + catchment areas system. Near us that can mean that you are “as the crow flies” further away than everyone else in your catchment so last on the list. Then when the places all fill up with closer kids you are then left with schools where you may be close but aren’t in the catchment area so again go to the bottom of the list.

You end up at the closest school that isn’t over subscribed and which is inevitably because it’s crap.

We got our first choice but only becuase we picked the local school (decentschool with very good academic record but not ofstead outstanding), if we had tried to be clever we would have been left with something crap as all the “best” schools are oversubscribed with in catchment kids. They are even rejecting every out of catchment sibling.

My understanding is you can ask to be told where you are on them as well?

IIRC this is down to the school, I think the 2 we were on were happy to tell us the position we were. There is movement (though it could depend on the area you are in) as people move out, Tarquin gets his place at the private school etc.

The 200m one was CofE
So there were 30 siblings who got in first
and 30 sets of parents from further away who suddenly found god in the preceding 6 months and got in on the religion ticket.

Ours is CofE and even then church attendance did not guarantee a place due to demand, attendance is for at least 12 months twice a year and they monitor it via a register (the only way to control it fairly), others in the area are min 24 months.

In Twickenham, schools are a massive problem here as the local area has become a ‘nappy belt’ over the last few years.

We are on the border of two schools catchment area as per last years maps.

We didn’t put our closest in the 5 choices
But closest doesn’t necessarily mean the automatic catchment school. We have a school within walking distance but our catchment school is almost two miles away – we spoke to the local authority beforehand to really get to grips with the whole can of worms and decided against attempting to get into the closer school (despite it being so much more convenient, especially as my wife works about 500 metres away from it) because of exactly what you have found -– if you apply for a non-catchment school then you end up further down the list and end up being offered a place at a school that really isn’t ideal if your catchment school gets filled by first choicers.

I would certainly try appealing though – it usually works if you put a decent case forward.

the crow flys system also has another catch as you can be closer than others to that school but afaik if others are further away but it is their nearest school then they take priority regardless of the distance.

if we had tried to be clever we would have been left with something crap as all the “best” schools are oversubscribed

yep this i feel 🙁

Anyone else been successful with waiting lists? Is there a lot of movement on them?? I understand mmv

Not sure if waiting lists and appealing are the same thing? My sister appealed when her daughter didn’t get the school 2 minutes from their house. It was a laborious process though and amongst all the paperwork she had to go up in front of an interview panel of 3 officials etc. It worked though.

I’ve not looked at this year’s admission policy, and it may well be different elsewhere, but a few things people are suggesting are certainly different to the rules here when we did apply a couple of years ago:
– it made no difference where on the list you put the school, admissions policy applied to all applications which listed the school (ie you’re no worse off putting the school in 6th place than 1st if you didn’t get into your first 5) – presumably there was some iterative process removing those who’d already got places.
– nearest distance rules paid no attention to whether school was your closest school, if somebody was closer to your nearest school than you they got in first even if they had another school closer.

Of course things are different to most here, as it’s a fairly rural local authority with a lot of kids going to village schools where the next nearest school is several miles away. Catchment area for our school stretches over 2 miles from the school, but there is no closer school for those people. It’s all OK here right now, but looking at the demographics and given all the new houses being built it’s almost certain the school will be oversubscribed within catchment in a few years, which means people living a mile away having to travel to the school 3 miles away or further.

Our house is lost in space between 2 catchments ! It genuinely is not attached to any school and the council have said decide which one we want to go to and they will see what they can do. An interesting position really.
EDIT: Although in Edinburgh is a moot point as some massive %age go to private schools anyway.

Not looking forward to this ‘fun’ next year! Really hope DD gets into the closest one (which is <100m away or <50m depending on which gate they measure to)

DD

A use of mumsnet acronym on STW first? The world might just be about to implode!

DD

Please. No.

IIRC the schools aren’t involved in the allocation of places, but are involved in appeals. Go down there & try & get a word with the head & explain your situation & that you are planning to appeal the council’s descision. Get them onside & you might be in with a chance.

lets just hope the child is called DD??

Don’t know how true this is, but was told by my mum who has worked in primary education for 30+ years to only put down the one school that we wanted mini-g to go to on our list of choices and leave the other lines blank. Apparently if you want one school, but list 2 backups and then they give you the back ups you have limited chances, or are unable to appeal as technically you have been given something you asked for. By only putting down one school, if you don’t get it you can appeal and more often than not you win. I remember years of moaning about class sizes and being forced to take extra kids due to appeals so maybe there is something in it..

Anyway, from that I woudl say that the OP should appeal as the school you got was not listed by you anywhere as something you would be happy with.

EDIT: Mini-g got in to the school we wanted so I have no idea if any of this is true as we didnt have to appeal

I’ve not looked at this year’s admission policy, and it may well be different elsewhere, but a few things people are suggesting are certainly different to the rules here when we did apply a couple of years ago:

– it made no difference where on the list you put the school, admissions policy applied to all applications which listed the school (ie you’re no worse off putting the school in 6th place than 1st if you didn’t get into your first 5) – presumably there was some iterative process removing those who’d already got places.

Correct, but the way in which you explain this may be slightly misleading. The order of choice is important – IF you meet the acceptance criteria and there IS availability in more than one school on your list you will be offered a place at the highest available school on your list. Other than that the place which a school sits on your list is not factored into the decision making process.

– nearest distance rules paid no attention to whether school was your closest school, if somebody was closer to your nearest school than you they got in first even if they had another school closer.

Again correct. This would be assuming that the person who was closer to the school you wanted had positioned the place at the school you wanted higher than the school closest to them.

It’s enough to make your head explode.

In terms of the appeals process, I did look into it a couple of years ago and you have to have a VERY solid reason for appeal (ie mistake made in processing). If a school is full it cannot just take more pupils (strict classroom size limits).

EDIT

steve-g – Member

Don’t know how true this is, but was told by my mum who has worked in primary education for 30+ years to only put down the one school that we wanted mini-g to go to on our list of choices and leave the other lines blank. Apparently if you want one school, but list 2 backups and then they give you the back ups you have limited chances, or are unable to appeal as technically you have been given something you asked for. By only putting down one school, if you don’t get it you can appeal and more often than not you win. I remember years of moaning about class sizes and being forced to take extra kids due to appeals so maybe there is something in it.

Afraid this is most likely a load of bolx.

My brother in law put only one school down for his second daughter, just down the road, her sister already went there (but crucially did not cross over to count as a sibling). They did not get a place and as had not put down any other choices got offered a place in a school miles away in the middle of a nasty estate (ie the one noone wanted and did not list as a choice) – no chance to appeal. They were forced to put her in private school, which they could fortunately just afford.

Yep. We got given 4th ‘choice’ which is actually the third away by distance but last choice based on the school itself.

It was a high birth year in 03/04 in our area (may have been more widespread) but the result is/was that the local infant school put on an extra class to accomodate – 3 classes instead of 2 – then when they moved to junior school they too added a class for that year. Now they are moving up to secondary the LA has seen fit to add no extra spaces and instead ship the ‘excess’ over the other side of town. Last 2 years the admission radius for our local school has been approx 1.4 miles; this year it’s less than 1/2 mile.

The issue is exacerbated here by the fact that it’s a CofE school and as above, the number of LIARS persuading the vicar to give them a note is a disgrace.

All points I shall be making at our forthcoming appeal.

In terms of the appeals process, I did look into it a couple of years ago and you have to have a VERY solid reason for appeal (ie mistake made in processing). If a school is full it cannot just take more pupils (strict classroom size limits).

Not absolutely – there are 2 concurrent appeals processes. First is as you say, a technicality one, if they’ve messed up they then have to show that allowing you will materially harm the school by making class sizes too big, etc. otherwise its a box ticking exercise.

Second is a ‘Puurrrlease!!’ appeal. If the school is an academy, etc. type the school can accept pupils above its ‘limit’ at it’s discretion, as long as …. above. That’s our hope, at open evenings the school wanted to add another class but the LA beaureacrats wanted instead to fill the other school. Hope is that if enough parents appeal the situation and the school offers another class to accomodate, they might not be able to refuse.

convert – Member

But then im not a teacher, just a joe public on the street living near a poorly performing school,

Can of worms…..but what do you, as a non teacher, perceive poor performing to mean? Is it the Ofsted report you are referring to, local gossip, the anecdotal stories from past or current parents? You might want to be cautious before just going along with Ofsted’s definition

Ofsted gave them a very poor report, lots of banners outside every few weeks,police on the gates, yet the kids are polite and seem to be happy no trouble with them even at night.But then its an academy outside council control.So theyre keeping the kids happy but not achieveing tick box reports.oh and did i mention the head and deputy left suddenly.

Other schools are available

A use of mumsnet acronym on STW first? The world might just be about to implode!

Please. No.

Can’t take it back now. The balance of normality has shifted.

I’m sure I’ve seen those acronyms on here before though!

lets just hope the child is called DD??

Demon Daughter 😈 was refused by the registrar unfortunately.

As all schools should be working to a similar sylabus, and employing trained qualified teachers, surely questions should be asked of the mangement of the schools why theyre failing,or perhaps its the mangement of the schools that failed and just awaiting pension time before they stop attending and not doing any real work to increase the skill levels of the staff.

Firstly not all kids are the same. Some schools have very different intakes to others. Secondly attracting good teachers to schools with difficult intakes is difficult.

We were offered our 3rd choice school, which also happens to be our catchment area school.

We’ll not be taking it, he’s going to a private school instead.

When my sister appealed she looked back through the admissions for the school she wanted over the last 6 or 7 years. They normally take 20 pupils each year, but she found that for a couple of years they had taken 21, and for one year 22. Not sure what else happened during the appeal, but the basis for her winning was the research she did and the fact that some years the school had taken more than 20. Hope this helps.

<tongue in cheek!>

Can’t you see if you can get a place of a kid whose parents are happy to take them out of school to save on skiing holiday costs? As they shouldn’t mind if their kid ends up going to a worse school if they aren’t going to be there as much due to holiday commitments 🙂

wilko1999 – Member

When my sister appealed she looked back through the admissions for the school she wanted over the last 6 or 7 years. They normally take 20 pupils each year, but she found that for a couple of years they had taken 21, and for one year 22. Not sure what else happened during the appeal, but the basis for her winning was the research she did and the fact that some years the school had taken more than 20. Hope this helps.

That’s OK when a class is <30 pupils (or whatever the government stipulated max class size is), which it looks like in this case (ie. maybe they had a ‘limit’ of 20 due to the physical size of the room). It is more difficult if the school’s normal class size is at the limit of the number of pupils actually allowed by the government, which is a number which cannot shift.

Definitely worth knowing if someone is in a similar scenario to your sister though.

Sorry to hear about all the back experiences

We got really lucky – first place, which is our most local school and the one we liked the most

We had four on our list, the top 3 were all within 0.75 miles but we’re in North London

we were in the process of moving to a new city when we put the application in, we got some sort of deeds transfer type certficiate (even though it was months b4 we finally exchanged and completed) from our solicitor but the local authority accepted it and we got our 1st choice school which is 500m away so very happy

fwiw the admissions staff at our old council and the new one were all very helpful

feel sorry for those who didnt get the ones they wanted, its been stressful enough moving house, the extra grief of not getting the school we want wouldve been a right pita!

The process really is a **** up. We couldn’t apply to specific schools as 3 of them come under an umbrella name, therefore we had to put down the latter as a single choice and wait for the system to tell us which one we’d get.

Logged in last night and found, no surprise, that we’ve been allocated the umbrella name with no way of knowing which of the 3 schools (distributed in different locations across several square miles) is the one monkey jnr would be going to. No way of appealing as we don’t know which school we’d be approving/declining. Am calling the authority Mon morning to see what’s possible. Joke of a system.