Well, my friend had a VP free and it was nice over bumps but it was shit over jumps. Not as poppy as my single pivot made in the uk Orange Patriot, although that was worse over bumps and the 5th element shock was shocker.

Have you considered a 29er?

A five is made by proper british people who ride bikes for king and country.

I’m not sure who makes Santa Cruz bikes,
They are made in Taiwan & China by people who probably care as much about their job as the guys at Orange.

davidtaylforth – Member – Quote
Yeah, well that’s it. Most owners tend to think they ride ok, but whenever I’ve seen photos of them (the bikes not the owners) they’ve looked all over the place

Extensive testing then… perhaps you should try one.


yep all over the place, utter…..

IMAG0341 by Mike Smith 79, on Flickr

That red one looks good mike. Not sure about the white one, I imagine the head angle was steep on that due to the forks losing all their travel??

If you want a single pivot santa cruz, get one of these. There’s a stash hole in the swingarm so you can get rid of your camelback. Way ahead of their time

Mega 2011 by Mike Smith 79, on Flickr
Yes shockingly the HA changed while the forks compressed, like I said it didn’t really hold me back any. I have ridden single pivots a lot, I tried a 5 and an Alpine nice paint jobs – cheap spec. Couldn’t see what you got over a Heckler for the same money as an Alu VPP bike. If the pound ever recovers the maybe the orange will look more expensive and the SC start to look cheaper.

How come you ride Santa Cruz bikes over all the other available suspension bikes? What is it that appeals? I have never understood it really. Apart from the chameleon which looks like a fun bike, none have ever appealed. I did have a go on a lightweight jackal build, that was good fun for messing about on

I got mine because it was cheap and I wanted a reliable and solid full sus. And it happened to be really fun to ride. Chameleons are good as well. Santa Cruz seem to just make fun bikes in my (relatively limited) experience.

got the 1st heckler second hand, fun, cheap and bombproof enough to ride as a trail/xc bike and for DH. Fitted well and rode well for the price I was spending. Got a second one (the white one) as a straight swap once the old one needed replacing. Again cheap and easy, not having a massive purchase price means the second hand prices are sensible unlike some other frames. Demo’d lots of other bikes during that time from Orange, Specialized, Rocky Mountain and a heap more. Kept going back to the VPP felt right & more sorted that a lot of other things out there.
For the LTC it’s carbon so insanely stiff, the 142 rear doesn’t actually seem to make it stiffer than the QR – a compliment to the frame design not needing bolt through to achieve stiffness. I was going for the Alu one as it’s only 0.6lb heavier than the Carbon but a deal came up. The bike sits very well, uses it’s travel well, feels plush it feels like a much bigger bike but pedals like a shorter travel bike. As I said earlier it’s taking some effort to get it properly airborne, it’s something I expected, a friend who got a V10 said the same thing – it takes a different technique to jump with it so I’m prepared to go back and sort myself out as the rest of the package is worth it.

Some interesting posts there, from my experience having owned heckler, bullet, heckler, butcher, nomad in that order.

Firstly the reason why only one person has mentioned bearings is because well “why”
They are free ?

Single pivot ! Relys too much on spring rates air volumes and shock tuning in general, for me the back end was always a bit vague and skippy over corrugations and loose rocky surfaces, was a pig to pedal despite RP23 lock outs and other weird shit. All of the above were there and noticeable throughout my ownership but things don’t really become apparent till you move on upgrade and change. Like I did when I went from heckler to bullet then as trail centres became more appealing I went from bullet to heckler and foolishly bought a butcher !
The worst bike I have ever ridden !!!!!!

To Nomad !
Which is without doubt the best mountain bike I have ever rode, the back end is stiffer it is certainly more plush, its not wallowy and its snappier to pedal, it picks up quicker and definately bobs less, hitting jumps is definately weird but in a good way, I’ve got a pair of 36 Van RC2’s which have only just become apparent since being fitted to the nomad when they were on the butcher they were stiff and tracked well but having used them on the Nomad they seem to set the back end up so well in that when hitting a jump say at degla you can feel the back end doing something as the forks are pre loaded before take off ? Whilst still on the ground !
Then getting off the ground appears more positive and controlled, definately bigger, smoother and more confidence inspiring,

Single pivots I’ve had in the past seemed to snap back once up in the air? Squirm on take off ?

It’s difficult to explain having owned several single pivots, but I won’t be buying a heckler again any time soon !