So I’m really enjoying my road bike for commuting on. It’s making a huge difference to the time it takes to get to work.

When I first got it the bike was fitted with a 130mm stem which was far to long so i swapped it out for a 105mm which has helped a lot however I still think it’s a bit to long.

The saddle is in the perfect position for me over the cranks however when leaning forward my natural resting position on the bars is about 2cm behind the hoods. If I want to rest on the hoods the it feels like to much of a stretch to maintain and I started getting lower back pain. The drops are out of the question as my hips start rocking.

In my natural resting position on the bars when I look down the bars are still ahead of the front hub.

Does all of this suggest to you that I need an even shorter stem ?

Cheers
Steve.

I know its a bit obvious but go and get a decent bike fitting done,there are loads of them out there.Position is a bit more important on the road bike as you don’t move around anywhere near as much as you do on the MTB

I’d second either a bike fit, or a read at Andy Pruitts book (the spesh BG guy). Road stems are not often much under 100mm, if they need to be it may suggest bike too big or saddle not set up right. Rocking hips on the drops doesn’t sound like setup right.

It feels really nice to ride and not to big size wise. Just a little long to the hoods.

Drops is because of my fat belly

^^^ suggest then stick with 105 stem, ride it, lose belly, sorted 😀

….and do some stretching 🙂

Belly might be contributing to bad back,+1 for the stretching.Hamstrings and glutes

How long have you been on the road bike? Are you coming from mtb? There is a period of adaption where it does feel wrong/long. Smaller riders on smaller frames might be able to drop down to 85/90mm. Also, what are the bars like? Some have a longer reach than others. Also, maybe, if you’re using kops, you could afford to bring the saddle forward a bit. Kops isn’t set in stone and Keith bontrager has done some work to debunk it.

The bars are the standard ones that come on a 2012 equilibrium.

buy this book and it will also help with mtb setup etc

Post a picture of you on the bike side on, on the hoods and drops.

Assuming your saddle is in a reasonable starting position – not always a given – I tend to set stem length by resting on the hoods and leaning forward so that elbow angle is about 100 degrees. Set drops by rotating bars to a comfortable angle with an elbow bend of about 150 degrees.

If the drops are “out” then it sounds like they are too low – pretty standard. Try a saddle top to bar drop of 4 cm. That is fairly neutral, more means you need to be flexible to reach the drops.

As for saddle position. I start with 88.3% of inseam and knee over pedal spindle at 90 degrees. It’s not trendy or fashionable, but it’s a start from which to adjust from. You should be able to pedal and lean forward with very little weight on your hands when set at such a neutral position.

TiRed last time I posted a pic up here of me on a bike I got ridiculed.

Can I ask a question.

88.3% is that length between saddle and pedal at lowest point?

<disclaimer-my own experience only>

When I bought my first road bike it felt very wrong, it came with a 90mm stem (44cm frame) and I just couldn’t get on with it, felt way too long. I put a 70mm stem on and thought it was fine, as I got more used to the bike I realised it wasn’t handling too well so moved up to an 80mm stem.
A few months later I decided it still wasn’t right & ended up with a 90mm stem slammed onto the headset.
This was all because it took me a while to adjust to the very different position needed to ride a road bike & to get confident with the bike.
I’m now considering trying a longer stem/steeper negative rise stem to experiment with getting the bars into a different position.
Everyone is different, my very short legs means there isn’t much difference between saddle & bars – but then again I ride Audax’s not races.

1. show us a pic.
2. it may just be you getting used to a road position.
3.

The saddle is in the perfect position for me over the cranks

is IME in your head only, you can move the saddle forward and it will all be OK, KOPS (and stem occluding hub) have pretty much been debunked and are for guidance only.

It’s BB to top of saddle and know as the Lemond method. It’s a start just to help people set saddle in the absence of fitting. KOPS is the same. Being able to sit comfortably, pedal without rocking and take weight through the core, not arms is what matters.

I won’t laugh 😉

I have the exact same problem if i can get the missus to help i will post a pic also may help us both.

Even a pic of the bike without you on it may help.

This is what it looks like currently……

I had a similar problem and found moving to narrower bars was very helpful.

Not another thread! 🙂

I guess it wouldn’t hurt to get some professional advice

Try 90mm stem and compact bars mate. I run 90mm myself as I have a short reach. Cheap compact bars available from Planet X

Based on your photo and my tape measure, I estimate that you have a 58 cm frame? Anyway your saddle to BB height is 75.5 cm which would give and inseam of 85.5 cm or 33 1/2″. I recall from your last thread you’re pretty tall. The saddle setback from BB is about 7.5 cm, which is quite a lot. That will tend to place more weight on your arms as you lean forwards. Bar drop looks like 8 cm and that is aggressive for a beginner, but measurements are rough.

So after checking your saddle is at a correct height – (88.3% of inseam), I would move your saddle forwards one centimetre to start with. The laidback post isn’t doing you any favours. Mountain bikes have a laid back position and it is tempting to adopt the same for road. You need a neutral, balanced position on the saddle before you can set handlebars comfortably.

The reach from tip of saddle to bar clamp mid point looks like 55.5 cm. That’s not particularly big for a large rider and a 130 mm stem would be extreme, and the stem looks reasonable. I would loosen the bars, rotate so comfortable on the drops (which will now be nearer) then lock them. This normally means you will need to also rotate the shifters down so vertical, but they can be moved without retaping.

Once dialled in, learn these measurements
1) BB to saddle (540 mm)
2) Saddle tip to bar stem clamp (55.5 mm)
3) Tip of saddle set back from BB (50 mm)
4) Bar drop from tip of saddle (75 mm)

The numbers in brackets are mine and I am 178 cm and absolutely average proportions. Yours will differ. Measure them.

Tired, Thaks for the help.

I am 183 cm or 6 foot in old school.

Roughly without measuring properly I have a 32 inch inseam(thats my leg length in jeans) So I guess I have a slightly longer torso than legs.

I tried to set the saddle up so that my knee was over pedal spindle however it may be slightly further back than that. I do seem to want to push my self further off the back of the saddle if that helps at all?

It’s a can of worms. Only thing really worth mentioning is it’s a road bike, not an mtb so the setup is generally totally different. Looking at that pic of the bike, it looks like you’ve set it up just like your mountain bike, which is fine, but not really a good position to have for road riding.

You could just carry on moving your saddle further forward, fitting shorter stems and raising your bars. You’ll eventually end up with a position that you can ride in. But the bike will handle like shite and won’t be very good for going fast on. You may aswell have just got a flat bar hybrid instead.

The key to a good fit is correct rotation of the pelvis. Without this, you will always sit like a sack of shite and never get a good fit. Also; your trouser leg size is not your inside leg measurement.

@renton

find a good bike fitter (does not have to be the latest motion capture studio, but an experienced fitter will do just fine using turbo trainer, goniometer, plumb line and tool kit).

I’ve had a number of bike fits – BG Fit, Retul, Powerfit and old school, they all have their merits. I’m the baldie in this photo below!

the guy doing the fit is Matt who manages bike fitting for the Cycle Surgery group, he was trained by Specialized on BG Fit and has experience with Powerfit, Guru and Retul.

well worth some of your time and some money paid. a good road bike fit is happy cycling!

esher shore – Member

@renton

find a good bike fitter (does not have to be the latest motion capture studio, but an experienced fitter will do just fine using turbo trainer, goniometer, plumb line and tool kit).

Surely all of those tools are the signs of a bad bike fitter?

Infact I’d definitely avoid wasting money on a bike fit until you can figure out how to sit properly.

I find myself moving around a lot on the saddle to.

Perhaps you’ve got worms?

Nah I find it rubs in certain places if I sit in one position too long

🙂 do you wear padded shorts?

On longer rides yes. Commuting to work I have a pair of Madison zeniths.

Try 90mm stem and compact bars mate. I run 90mm myself as I have a short reach. Cheap compact bars available from Planet X

This is me too and also 6ft on TT 56cm. I like to take in the scenery.

@davidtaylforth

goniometer and plumbline are very basic fitting tools?

turbo trainer to allow the client to pedal whilst on their own bike

tool kit (i.e. allen keys) to allow finishing kit adjustments

@renton

if you are constantly moving around on your saddle its generally caused by a poor fitting saddle and / or incorrect setup causing your body to ‘hunt’ for a better position

without a well fitted saddle, its very difficult to get a good fit

@davidtaylforth

goniometer and plumbline are very basic fitting tools?

If you were any good at bike fitting; why would you need them?

OP the setup doesn’t look bad – as it’s a layback seatpost I’d move the saddle forward (and up to compensate) and see how that feels.

Like Tired I start my bar set up with being comfy on the drops then set the stis.

I don’t get too hung up on mm measurements, each of my (4 drop bar) bikes is probably a bit different, due in part to purpose but also the shape of the frame gives rise to a slightly different position.

And as above I don’t see the need for a plumbline, other than to get a starting point/reference.

If you are rocking on the drops it does sound like the saddle is at the wrong height. As above adjust at 1cm at a time till you find a sweet spot.

I struggle with the drop position as a mtber, it’s just wierd and hurts my neck. Someone suggested I try some salsa woodchipper bars that have an easier drop position. On one do a similar drop bar.

http://salsacycles.com/components/category/road_handlebars/woodchipper

@davidtaylforth

“If you were any good at bike fitting; why would you need them?”

Why wouldn’t you need 2 basic tools of the bike fitting trade?

Like saying you are a bad bike mechanic because you need an alley key to adjust a bolt!

Goniometer is vital for accurately setting saddle height, unless you have magic hands with a built in protractor?

davidtaylforth is a subtle but serial troller. Don’t bite.

Renton, inseam is not inside leg. Stand against a wall without shoes and put a book as far up to your pubic bone. That is your inseam. It’s about an inch and a half longer than your inside leg.

There’s a lot written about bike fitting, but to be honest, most people, after adjusting for height, really aren’t that differently proportioned. So the same rules apply.

Saddle forward and check BlackBerry to saddle. You can’t measure KOPs on your own easily. And you definitely can’t measure knee bend! Some nice apps can do this automatically but you need a static trainer.

Can anyone recommend a free app to help bike setup?

The Sanity Assassin – Member
davidtaylforth is a subtle but serial troller. Don’t bite.

It’s hardly trolling. I’m just brave enough to question the stupid industry conventions and fashions (plus I’ve read Steve Hogg’s blog 😉 ).

I’ve seen two (“reputable”) bike fitters; both were pretty much a waste of time and both did not correct the problems with my legs/feet. One of them hadn’t even heard of heel wedges (a basic tool of the bike fitting trade), and why I should need them. Surely you’d have thought foot correction would be the key thing to get right for the basis of a good bike fit?!

So I speak from experience.

But it looks like Renton is using flat pedals and trainers so foot correction is less of a point.