A bit more of a moral question perhaps than bike related.

Jnr did a U8’s race last Sunday and got off to a bad start when he was accidentally rammed in the first 20′ of the start …(It was a definite accident) .. anyway he ended up at the back (or one off) and spent the next 3-4 laps making up places then one of the kids in front of Jnr had a nasty accident and flew off the track into a big gully.

It was not the best as a parent, there was a scream and crunch…(I think the crunch was breaking wood but it sounded bad) and I think quite a few of us breathed a sigh of relief when they started screaming again (as that obviously meant they were conscious)

Anyway … Jnr stopped completely…. he must have stopped for a good 30 seconds (maybe longer) whilst several riders he’d just overtaken on the uphill passed him.
There were several first aid qualified marshals so I kept telling him to get riding…. meanwhile he was being passed by other riders.

The entire race was only 15 mins …. so 30 seconds on top of his previous loss was not recoverable. Up to that point he’d passed 1/2 the riders and still had a pretty good shot at a podium position.

Afterwards i told him next time if there are marshals and the fallen rider isn’t blocking the track that he shouldn’t stop but keep going… but I’m now wondering if he didn’t partly do the right thing…. it would be different on a trail in the middle of nowhere but in the kids races there are always plenty of marshals…

When we’ve been riding trails we have always stopped and helped injured riders (except one who wouldn’t be helped) and stopped with people whilst paramedics arrived etc. (indeed did this a couple of weeks earlier)

What do you reckon ??? Race on ??

would you be bitching on here if he’d been the one to crash and everyone else had just ridden past?

It’s an Under 8’s race not the TdF – whatever he feels comfortable with.

Hmmm. Tricky. Was he helping or just standing around watching / in shock?

Personally I’d always advocate helping etc over going for the podium but I’m not overly competitive at the best of times.

Even in the dog-eat-dog world of U8 racing I’d probably be happier to witness empathy and concern for a possibly broken fellow rider over the possibility of a slightly higher placing.

Always stop if you are the only one there – your race is not that important.

However if there are marshalls, riding buddies, spectators etc attending, then don’t wait. Only so many people can help a fallen rider.

Always stop if you are the only one there – your race is not that important.

However if there are marshalls, riding buddies, spectators etc attending, then don’t wait. Only so many people can help a fallen rider.+1
Make sure not to run over the fallen rider on the way past though, that’s bad form.

I think the message to stop for a fallen rider is probably more important than the message to keep racing if someone else is there to help the fallen rider, particularly at that age.

In an XC race I’d probably shout “you OK” and carry on if they said yes, or make a decision between going to the next marshal point and stopping and getting the next rider to do so.

On track well there are marshalls everywhere I mostly just concentrate on not causing a further pile up.

Even in the dog-eat-dog world of U8 racing I’d probably be happier to witness empathy and concern for a possibly broken fellow rider over the possibility of a slightly higher placing.

and

It’s an Under 8’s race not the TdF – whatever he feels comfortable with.

would you be bitching on here if he’d been the one to crash and everyone else had just ridden past?

Not bitching, just trying to work out what to tell him.

Hmmm. Tricky. Was he helping or just standing around watching / in shock?

He was just watching… the race was vey well organised and lots of first aid trained marshals.
He was also though potentially going to cause another crash… as lots of other riders were not stopping…

Always stop if you are the only one there – your race is not that important.

However if there are marshalls, riding buddies, spectators etc attending, then don’t wait. Only so many people can help a fallen rider.

I think that’s about what I told him…In the past I’ve admonished him when we have been waiting with a fallen rider and he’s been “can we go now” …. but when paramedics turn up unless I can usefully tell them anything then we scoot out of the way…

Even in the dog-eat-dog world of U8 racing I’d probably be happier to witness empathy and concern for a possibly broken fellow rider over the possibility of a slightly higher placing.

There is that as well…

Even in the dog-eat-dog world of U8 racing I’d probably be happier to witness empathy and concern for a possibly broken fellow rider over the possibility of a slightly higher placing.

I was near the back of a lead group of riders on a twisty slightly downhill road doing about 50-60kmh. One of the riders near the front ran out of road, hit a low wall and was ejected into a field landing heavily head first.

Realising no-one else was slowing I anchored up knowing that there would be no cars until the main group came through several minutes later. When I got to him he was motionless but breathing so there was nothing to do but wait. After a few minutes he came back to life and sat up. When he could speak again his first words were to tell me to carry on.

It’s an Under 8’s race

And clearly at this point in his life checking if a fellow riders is OK is more important to him than his race result, IMO that can only be a good thing.

I don’t mean to imply that you’re one of ‘those’ parents but it would be easy to mis-interpret your post and conclude that his race placing was important to you, when it should be all about his happiness and the joy of taking part.

based on this:

He was just watching… the race was vey well organised and lots of first aid trained marshals.
He was also though potentially going to cause another crash… as lots of other riders were not stopping…

If you want to discuss it with him in a ‘what should you do if this happens again’ kind of way then do so, it’ll probably be a useful discussion, and that’s the time to talk about in a race Vs. on a trail, but let him think about it and come to conclusions himself about what is appropriate.

And tell him good luck from me for next time! Love seeing the little ones racing and having fun 😀

This the southern xc at Pippingford? I heard the noise from the climb and saw marshalls and parents in the gully/stream bed. The kid was fine according to the marshall.

Anyway, the kids races are so well marshalled and covered by parents all round the course that I would encourage your son to crack on. Obviously this would not be the case for normal trail riding or longer/less well marshalled races, but at the southern xc the track is well covered.

When he could speak again his first words were to tell me to carry on.

I came upon a guy who’d come off and hit his head – along with a few other people who were all helping out. He seemed fine but shaken. He said ‘did I come off?’ and we told him what happened. Then about 2 mins later he said ‘what happened? Did I come off?’ Then again about every two mins until the ambulance came. So although he seemed ok, he really wasn’t.

As an aside, in that situation I did hang around despite several other people being there because I lived nearby and I knew they’d need someone to sort his bike out so I offered to pop back in the car.

Thought this might have been prompted by one of my earlier posts.

Raced a time trial yesterday. All going well until I got to a queue of traffic with a couple of miles left. Race over at that point. Filtered through a long queue of traffic and just saw a rider down and a mangled bike. Couldn’t really see how bad it was but could see a few people already helping. So, a split second decision, I rode on and let the nearest marshals know there’d been an incident.

Found out today that the rider died at the scene. I now wish I’d stopped, despite knowing there was nothing I could have done. If I’m ever in that situation again and see a fallen rider then I will stop.

This the southern xc at Pippingford? I heard the noise from the climb and saw marshalls and parents in the gully/stream bed. The kid was fine according to the marshall.

Yep we found out later it wasn’t serious… It did sound quite nasty though…. it was the scream-crunch-few seconds silence …. I was the one in the sling 😀

Anyway, the kids races are so well marshalled and covered by parents all round the course that I would encourage your son to crack on. Obviously this would not be the case for normal trail riding or longer/less well marshalled races, but at the southern xc the track is well covered.

Yep … that was my first thought …. and especially all the marshals are first aid trained and they really do have every section covered…Also you hardly want a under 8’s or even well meaning parent moving a kid with a potentially broken neck…. or if it had been serious getting in the way trying to help ….

I still think that the stopping was a good first response ….and then he should/could have seen the marshals were attending.

I rode on and let the nearest marshals know there’d been an incident.

Found out today that the rider died at the scene. I now wish I’d stopped, despite knowing there was nothing I could have done. If I’m ever in that situation again and see a fallen rider then I will stop.

That sucks obviously for the rider and family/friends as well as you but you could have done exactly the same and saved their life by alerting the marshals and a paramedic arriving sooner….

If you want to discuss it with him in a ‘what should you do if this happens again’ kind of way then do so, it’ll probably be a useful discussion, and that’s the time to talk about in a race Vs. on a trail, but let him think about it and come to conclusions himself about what is appropriate.

We had a discussion the week before .. he entered a local race (just local clubs) and we knew from last local race he would very easily get 1st… (barring any guests) so I asked if he wanted to perhaps race in the U10’s where he might not get a podium space but have a fun race.

So we had a discussion if he wanted to have a fun race and perhaps not get a medal or race/ride U8’s and pretty much get a medal barring coming off or a puncture etc. and I was quite pleased he opted for fun race.

As it happened the organisers wouldn’t let him race in the U10’s… so he did the U8’s anyway…

Aha, yes I did see you. I was the dad with the 2 Pedal 2 Pedal kids. The marshall reckoned the kid controlled it well on the way down and avoided all the logs and rocks. Crashes are inevitable in kids racing, but this has reminded me to ensure the kids know when to stop and when to crack on.