All going well I should be on the road in a couple of weeks.

My head is still spinning with car options, but I’ve had a look at a few and narrowed down the field.

I had been looking at a couple of Mercedes and BMWs, and I had expected to buy a spare set of rims and cold weather tyres to use between November and March (I travel up to Glencoe area most weekends).

However, a friend has recommended something like an A4 Quattro, on the basis that its AWD. I must confess, I don’t really like the A4 (or many Audis for that matter), but I’m willing to MTFU if it’s in the interests of sensibility.

But…after doing a bit of digging online, it seems the Quattro isn’t exactly great on icy/snowy roads with all weather tyres anyway, and would really benefit from winter tyres.

On that basis, if I’m going to have to buy winter tyres regardless of what car I bought, I’d rather stick with my preferred choice of the BM or Merc.

Anyone got any experience of RWD with winter tyres v Quattro with all weathers?

Thanks 🙂

If you’re buying a new set of rims anyway, why not stick with Quattro?

We’ve got Quattro on our TT, and it’s fantastic in crap (really wet!) weather. Sticks to the road like poo to a blanket.

Not tested it in heavy snow yet, but come winter time I’ll get some cheap steelie rims and winter tyres.

No experience of rwd + winter tyres (my car is fwd) but I can get around with no problems at all in a full 6″ of snow with conti winter contacts on.
I imagine rwd will be fine with the right tyres (if you are careful with your right foot). All those bmws and mercs manage fine in Germany after all.

Wife had a Skoda Yeti and in epic snows of 2 winters ago and it was awesome. Maybe not in a real offroading buffs book but better than any 2wd drive car i have even driven short of snow chains being fitted. I think the 4wd system is the same as the quattro.
Given the chance of snow i know whick i would rather be in.
#edit….. Tyres were standard OEM jobs and rather wide to hint at snow competance.

Winter tyres every time I reckon. Huge difference. AWD only helps you go, doesn’t help you corner or stop (yeah yeah unless you are rallying whatever)

In general 2WD + winters is better than 4WD without, as I understand it, dirt landrover tyres notwithstanding.

As above, people in cold countries don’t drive 4WD any more than we do in the UK, but they do have winter tyres.

I have an A6 quattro estate.

Pretty good in the snow on the normal tyres, gets me up to the ski resorts when all around are stopping to fit snow chains etc. Got me in and out of the drive last winter in 8″ of snow.

Now the downside. It is good on standard tyres while accelerating on snow, less good when trying to brake or go downhill. Depends on the depth and nature of the snow. Even with quattro, no grip is no grip, and stopping/steering can be almost impossible. Compressed snow is the worst. Great fun on mountain roads . . .

This winter I will probably buy four snowsocks for when it gets really bad, then it will get me places 2wd vehicles can only dream of.

Re the Yeti – isn’t that part time 4wd? A quattro is full time.

A mate has an A4 allroad and we drove to Vervier in it last winter.

It managed the climb up to the resort and the steep road that goes up to Pub Mont Fort to the car park in the icy snow without any special tyres – I was quite impressed.

Consider Performance Alloys for some cheap wheels:

http://www.performancealloys.com/

Thanks guys.

The more I think about it, it doesn’t really matter what car I buy, I’d be foolish not to stick on cold weather tyres. So I suppose that opens back up all the options 🙂

If you’re buying a new set of rims anyway, why not stick with Quattro?

I don’t really want a Quattro, it would have been a practicality purchase if it was better with summer tyres than a RWD with winters. If i’m going to have to buy rims/tyres anyway, I’d rather have the Merc or BMW.

I’ve driven a lot in Scotland in Winter with the Haldex Golf (4motion / Quattro / AWD) system and summer tyres – it won’t help braking on snow / ice, but you get noticeably better traction and can get places you couldn’t with 2WD and summer tyres.

E.g. this winter got up the Struggle on sheet ice with normal summer tyres in a Kia Sportage (Haldex AWD + summer tyres).

Can’t comment on the quattro bit, but I have a BMW 3series, and run winter tyres on it.

On packed snow/ice, it’s WAY better behaved than it is on summer tyres. You still need to think about what you’re doing, but it is possible to stop and go under control. Mine has a poncey body kit on, so is crap in fresh snow. Obviously, if you drive it like a t!t, the laws of physics say you’ll still end up in trouble, but that’s true of Quattros too.

Driving around Sweden in winter in heavy snow I was impressed by the BMWs and Mercs happily taking it all in their stride on winter tyres.

As someone mentioned above stopping is probably more important than traction and AWD is no help there.

I have an A3 haldex Quattro. awesome little car.

ground clearance stops me a long time before grip does.

doesnt matter what car – winter tires make a huge difference

spent time in ukraine in -28 this year , RWD car is the norm , winter tires are a must and we got on just fine.

how ever doesnt matter what you have you need to be respectful of it- even a chain shod defender will slip under hard braking.

I would imagine the quattros problem comes about from wide tyres on a low profile, which 4wd will not really negate.

Its a difficult one to call. A fwd drive car with snow tyres will be better in snow that a rwd car with snow tyres, a 4wd will be better still.

I think to drive a rwd on snow takes more skill and and in some respects braveness as you have to keep momentum going.

I had an older A3 Tdi quattro.. probably the best car I have owned. Took a lot to stop it in Scotland with the snow up north on regular tyres and coped with 6 ins of snow fine..

As others said, the laws of physics still apply and stopping may be the major factor as the haldex will disconnect.. but if your paying attention and judge distances….

Also, Quattro, its not just for winter… a lot depends on how folk drive to the conditions too.

I had an older A3 Tdi quattro.. probably the best car I have owned.

mine is a 2003. the older shape. awesome car but burning through tyres at an incredible rate…

Jambo, thats the one. Last of the Quattro sport 130’s, mapped up to 180, drilled discs all round, Bilstein kit, uprated roll bars, bose, forge rear suspension arms, RNS-E nav…

Abslutely loved it.

I wish I hadn’t etc etc etc

It is all about tyres. Neighbour has managed couple of winters with an M3 on proper winter tyres here (Scandinavia). Why not get a xDrive or 4Matic if Audi is not up to your liking?

I’ve got an MR2 (Mid-engined, rear wheel drive) and in spite of all the horror stories about handling on snow/ice, i’ve found i can get around just fine with a set of winter tyres, even on quite steep stuff.

As above treat the conditions with respect and there’s no reason you can’t use a rwd car in all but the very worst conditions.

Abslutely loved it.

I wish I hadn’t etc etc etc

mines pretty much standard, last year they were made. I won’t be selling any time soon….

I lived in the wilds in a bit of a valley and many years ago had the preasure of driving both a Golf Synchro and RWD with snow/winter tyres.
The Golf was awesome at accelerating and controling on the snow, but not much of a benefit under braking.
The RWD with snow/winter didn’t really stop me from moving and never stopped me getting out of the valley as the first car out in snowy conditions. The only problem was getting enough weight over the rear wheels, 2X25 litre drums of water were a big help. 😛

Winter tyres will cost you naff all in the long run – the cost of wheels really, since although you need two sets of tyres you will wear them at half the rate.

4WD though will cost you a lot of money up front, fuel all the time*, and be another thing to possibly fail.

* although if you are comparing high powered cars that may be negligible!

Winter tyres and RWD is fine. If a BMW is what you want then go with that and budget the extra for winter wheels and tyres. You will be better prepared for winter than 95% of other people on the road.

Evo magazine did a test a couple of years back with a powerful RWD Jag – an XF-R I think and summer and winter tyres round a snowy and icy Beford Aerodrome track. They did back to back test of lap-times, 0-60 and braking distances with summer and winter tyres. The differences were astonishing. I think it stopped in half the distance with winter tyres and was 25seconds faster round the track (about 25% quicker)

They then put a Evo IX (not exactly slow or bad handling) round the same track with summer tyres and it was 20 second slower than the Jag with winter tyres.

So you while times round a track aren’t always reflective of the real world its a fair indication of how much more grip you have in icy and snoy condition with winter tyres. The braking distance stuff alone was pretty scary.

Of course no amount of preparedness and driving ability will help you when you are stuck in the middle of a massive jam caused by all the other drivers who don’t have the equipment or wherewithall to deal with the conditions!

When I had my A4 Quattro is was brilliant on Snow even with worn tyres, got out of a few scrapes on ice more luck than Quattro, but with ice you need proper tyres to deal with it.

Of course no amount of preparedness and driving ability will help you when you are stuck in the middle of a massive jam caused by all the other drivers who don’t have the equipment or wherewithall to deal with the conditions!

It does allow you to take detours on minor roads though 🙂

I don’t really want a Quattro, it would have been a practicality purchase if it was better with summer tyres than a RWD with winters. If i’m going to have to buy rims/tyres anyway, I’d rather have the Merc or BMW

It sounds like you’ve very little experience of driving full stop; the safest option is to realise when you shouldn’t be out, irrelevent of car/tyres…

And, for the record, a 5 series on normal tyres struggles on a flat road if there is snow on it, and will get stuck at the slightest opportunity.

If you are concerned, and actually will need (rather than want) to drive in the Highlands in snowy conditions buy either a Subaru or proper 4*4.

It sounds like you’ve very little experience of driving full stop; the safest option is to realise when you shouldn’t be out, irrelevent of car/tyres…

And, for the record, a 5 series on normal tyres struggles on a flat road if there is snow on it, and will get stuck at the slightest opportunity.

If you are concerned, and actually will need (rather than want) to drive in the Highlands in snowy conditions buy either a Subaru or proper 4*4.

Very little experience of driving? Indeed, I will be sitting my test in a few weeks (hence the first line of my first post).

Lack of experience driving a car doesn’t mean I have no knowledge of road conditions in the West of Scotland (I picked that up from living here for a few decades).

There are very few days in winter when the A82 cannot be driven in relative safety with proper precautions (i.e. winter tyres). I’m quite able to identify when those conditions are present (i.e. lots of snow in winter 🙂 )

If there’s 2ft of snow on the road then we tend to stay at home and build snowmen.

However, we have struggled to get cars moving out of a bit of snow a few times at the side of the road after being left for a day in bad weather, but it’s not something we’ve ever needed a 4×4 for (or a subaru, you don’t see many of those in the highlands tbh)

Also, it’s not always possible to predict when the weather may turn bad, so it’s entirely possible to set off in blue skies and then have to drive home in snow. So how do I decide when it’s “safe” to drive?

Perhaps I should just stick to driving on motorways in fair weather until i’ve been driving for a few years?

Michelin Alpins, it doesn’t matter what you put them on.

It sounds like you’ve very little experience of driving full stop; the safest option is to realise when you shouldn’t be out, irrelevent of car/tyres..

Wtf? Tyres are hardly irrelevant – they are the difference between being stuck and not. You need to know when you shouldn’t be out with the equipment you have, that is important.

I think he means irrespective. 😐

I think he means irrespective

Nah, what I really mean is ‘get off the road knob until you’ve learnt to drive properly’ – as said last winter to the X5 driver who’d blocked the road.

tbh The cars I drove as a ‘boy’ were perfect for all year driving – small FWD hatchbacks with 145 section tyres. Never got stuck, and the only 4*4’s were Landies – only Farmers/Military bought these. Those were the days…

The cars I drove as a ‘boy’ were perfect for all year driving – small FWD hatchbacks with 145 section tyres.

Shite for everything else though.

In 2005 I bought a MKIII Fiesta, actually a later model than the one in which I learned to drive. It had a scarily small amount of grip compared to the other car we had, a 2003 Ibiza. And it was just about sturdy enough to protect biscuits, never mind people.

peterfile winter tyres is all you need, i’m running a full set on my astra in the highlands and i cant really see any situation they’ll not be enough. Parking on verges etc in snow is no problem, perfect for crag and ski access when the snows right down to the glen. Apart from a couple of obvious routes that get blocked, not much stays uncleared for long these days, and definitely not the likes of the A82 or trunk roads. I’m running gislaved nordfrosts which are incredible, mine are still on now and mpg not affected. About 90 quid each for my bog standard wheels.