- This topic has 34 replies, 17 voices, and was last updated 12 years ago by nickf.
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Procurator Fiscal summons
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AlcopopFree Member
received a summons in from Procurator Fiscal for recent motoring offences that will take me to
12 points and an automatic ban,im pleading guilty to the charges but there are some reasons
behind the offences
im in a bit of a quandary do i plead by letter covering the reasons,or do i appear? my concern with appearing is that i become a bit tongue tied and flustered im not used to courts and the thought of it makes me feel pretty sick
would a letter be suffice ?
oh go easy on me …MluddeadlydarcyFree MemberDoes it relate to this thread?
If so, and you’re facing a ban, I’d avail of my nearest loophole finding motor specialist solicitor’s free initial consultation to help out. You’ll only get flamed here. Good luck with it.
Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middling Edition
Latest Singletrack VideosFresh Goods Friday 696: The Middlin...nickfFree MemberYou’ve been summonsed. Unless Scottish law differs from English law in this area, you need to appear.
j_meFree MemberWhat kind of car you got?
Could do with cheapish family hatch if you want to offload it 😉mrchrispyFull Memberlook on the bright side…..just think of all the money you are going to save not running a car.
donsimonFree Memberim in a bit of a quandary do i plead by letter covering the reasons,or do i appear?
DO NOT WRITE A LETTER!
TandemJeremyFree MemberA plea in person will always be best IMO
Don’t trot out the usual bullshit excuses – they get bored of them.
maccruiskeenFull Memberi become a bit tongue tied and flustered
Its not an audition,, what you have to say is all thats important, not the flair or eloquence with which you say it. Its not going to be like a court room drama, its going to be like a meeting.
nickfFree MemberIts not an audition,, what you have to say is all thats important, not the flair or eloquence with which you say it. Its not going to be like a court room drama, its going to be like a meeting.
Not my court appearances. I was aked to explain why I had chosen to ride a motorbike, since I had a car. Also asked why it was that despite having had points for speeding I chose to ride my high-powered motorcycle at ‘dangerous’ speeds. All said in the most scathing of Daily Mail reader tones.
Given that I was being done for speeding only (no mention of reckless or dangerous), seemed a rather odd and tendentious line of questioing from the magistrates.
coffeekingFree MemberI recently got got for the same reason (but first points in 14 years driving) – was lost in a dark street in paisley, answered the phone to listen to my other half tell me which road to turn down as I couldn’t find it and had texted when stopped earlier to ask. Police must have spotted me the second I picked it up and darted out of a side alley they had been waiting in. At the end of the day I was breaking the law and I had no argument. The point “but I’m in a dark quiet road with no-one else about and no pedestrians, I wouldn’t have done it had it been busier” doesn’t help (I tried) and the judge will look even less favourably. At this stage I’d be looking for legal representation or hoping I had a bloody good excuse such as “I was on the phone to my kids telling them how to keep my wife alive while I drove round the corner to alert an ambulance” lol
Not my court appearances. I was aked to explain why I had chosen to ride a motorbike, since I had a car. Also asked why it was that despite having had points for speeding I chose to ride my high-powered motorcycle at dangerous speeds. All said in the most scathing of Daily Mail reader tones.
Second point is perfectly reasonable, it’s “why are you driving like a muppet on public roads when you’ve had your warning?” and “Are you likely to do it again?”. None of that seems like an audition.
rickmeisterFull Memberok, bit of sympathy here as I went through this recently.
If you received a fixed penalty and you know its going to take you over 12 points and you think you have mitigating circumstances, get a solicitor to represent you and appear. Dont just write in.
If you have received a summons to appear, see the note above.
A solicitor can speak the legal lingo, negotiate the offence and punishment, not say the wrong things that wind them up (it was a sunny day, no one else on the road etc etc etc)…. as well as offering opinions on options.
If you google motoring offence solicitors, there are a few that come up and offer a first conversation for free. If you go down this route though, its almost a dead cert loophole finder and £3.5 k fee. Is your licence worth that much?
I took the non £3.5k legal representation route and took it on the chin. 6 month ban negotiated to 28 days and a fine.
HTH
nickfFree MemberSecond point is perfectly reasonable, it’s “why are you driving like a muppet on public roads when you’ve had your warning?” and “Are you likely to do it again?”.
It was the reference to “dangerous” speeds. The police had not represented that I was riding dangerously, nor was I charged with this.
Also, the reference made to my “high-powered” motorcycle. It’s not a crime to have a high-powered bike, so what possible relevance does the question have? Other than the fact that the magistrate clearly didn’t like bikes.
It seemed to me that they were itching to throw the book at me (fast bike, been done before) but as I had a decent solicitor (paid for by my insurance company) they didn’t get the chance.
If you google motoring offence solicitors, there are a few that come up and offer a first conversation for free. If you go down this route though, its almost a dead cert loophole finder and £3.5 k fee. Is your licence worth that much?
I think this cost is wildly overblown for normal representation; you’ll more likely end up paying £500 for a day’s attendance at court for a solicitor or barrister. If you go for Nick Freeman and the like, that will probably cost you a lot more than £3.5k, with absolutely no guarantee of success.
coffeekingFree MemberIt was the reference to “dangerous” speeds. The police had not represented that I was riding dangerously, nor was I charged with this.
No, but speed limits are put in place to define sensible speeds, being over them suggests you’re driving dangerously (but dangerous driving requires a little more work to prosecute I think).
Your high powered bike is bought and designed to be driven fast, most people who own them do so. It’s the main reason people buy them. Hence he’s pointing out that you’ve clearly bought a bike to drive fast, you DO drive fast, you’ve been shown to drive fast twice so yes, they’ll be looking to throw the book at you. How exactly did you get off?
JunkyardFree MemberIt was the reference to “dangerous” speeds. The police had not represented that I was riding dangerously, nor was I charged with this.
well speed does tend to make things more dangerous rather than less
Also, the reference made to my “high-powered” motorcycle. It’s not a crime to have a high-powered bike, so what possible relevance does the question have?
I would imagine someone who owns a high powered motorbike is more likely to like fast motorbikes – as they have bought one – and more likely to drive fast /open it up now and again …why else would you have one? An assumption for sure but probably in the realms of reasonable for most if not all owners
Other than the fact that the magistrate clearly didn’t like bikes.
driven faster than the speed limit in an unsafe manner???
nickfFree MemberHow exactly did you get off?
I was going to answer this, but there’s no point. Obviously anyone who breaks the speed limit by even a few mph is a dangerous loon.
deadlydarcyFree Memberis a dangerous loon
Indeed 😀
A bleedin’ menace to society
JunkyardFree Memberyour original answer was a good one I have not suggested you are a dangerous loon
If it is aimed at me I apologise no offence meantdeadlydarcyFree MemberThe only dangerous loon around here is you JY. 😉
Looking forward to the game this evening?
coffeekingFree MemberI was going to answer this, but there’s no point. Obviously anyone who breaks the speed limit by even a few mph is a dangerous loon.
I was simply stating what the judge and law will see, not passing judgement myself.
AlcopopFree MemberYep deadlydarcy it relates to that thread,looks like accumulated 12points= automatic 6 month ban
quite happy to take the punishment on the chin expecting a fine and ban but would prefer if i could get it down to 3 months,i think the reason i want too appear is that looking at the charges i.e on my mobile and no insurance it sounds like a boy racer in a hot hatch which i am not more mid 40’s in a people carrier!!!
,think i’ll take some free legal advice tomorrow
ironically we have just moved from a two car family to just one and im starting to cycle to work 🙄polyFree MemberAlcopop,
Do you think that the “totting up” approach is a reasonable route to dealing with repeat road traffic offenders? Most people seem to see it as an effective deterrent / reasonable sanction against those who make several (often small) errors of judgement in a period of 4 years (to get caught committing 4x 3pt offences means you’ve almost certainly been breaking the law a lot more often!).
If it is a reasonable approach – what makes YOU different / above the law / special that it should not apply on this occasion?
legendFree Memberi think the reason i want too appear is that looking at the charges i.e on my mobile and no insurance it sounds like a boy racer in a hot hatch which i am not
nope it makes you sound like an idiot. Seriously, you were on your last chance and you didn’t make sure you kept within the law? There’s nothing minor about either of those offences in my book, you were just lucky to get caught by the police rather than getting caught after ploughing into someone.
I hope they up the bad to 12months – would you learn your lesson then?
deadlydarcyFree MemberYay, it’s the pitchfork brigade. Mind you, it took long enough.
I’m guessing that both legend and poly, have never ever done something in a car* for which they might get points if they had been caught.
Ever crept over the speed limit by accident for a few seconds?
Ever driven with a hangover?
Ever looked at your phone when it went “bing”?Alcopop, get yourself some legal advice. Every other fecker does it. You sound like you’ve already learned your lesson anyway.
* given of course that you’re both drivers…if you’re not, then fair enough, you’re just sanctimonious non-drivers 🙂
JunkyardFree MemberThe only dangerous loon around here is you JY.
that is ssssssoooooo unfair on all the other loons on here
Looking forward to the game this evening?
Forgot it was on till I heard it on the radio ..plastic fan and all that 😳 GK playing a blinder GRRRRRR but they are being mullered so far
rickmeisterFull MemberIf you google motoring offence solicitors, there are a few that come up and offer a first conversation for free. If you go down this route though, its almost a dead cert loophole finder and £3.5 k fee. Is your licence worth that much?
Nickf, your correct, its my clumsy writing. I went with a local solicitor for a much more reasonable £250.
The £3.5k was basically, it sounded, dragging the case out over several months of appeals and requests for different types of documentation…. basically to grind the court down.
polyFree MemberDeadlydarcy – I have indeed done all* of those things, at various times in plenty of years of driving. I should have had some points. I haven’t (perhaps because I’m lucky, perhaps because by driving with due care and attention I usually spot the ‘rozzers’ before they spot me?). However getting caught once is probably just the law of averages – we all slip up occasionally; getting caught twice is unlucky. At that point you are just a single serious offence away from a ban and a bit of extra care might be reasonable to keep his license – but no he drives without insurance (maybe that is a 100% genuine mix-up) but electing to use a mobile is not – its a calculated risk – one with much higher risks at 6 pts than 0pts. It could have been a bald tyre, a dodgy bulb or numerous other things that got him a second strike. He’s has 2 warnings already – time to get your house in order?
However rather than being sanctimonious – my post was exactly the “story” he’s going to have to tell the Sheriff/JP in order to keep his license. Why is he special? Why will it never happen again – even although they will see him as a “serial” road traffic offender? and Why will it inconvenience people other than him (e.g. a disabled child, a number of employees who might loose their jobs) etc – if he is without his license for a period.
* I would point out that its a very, very long time since I’ve driven a vehicle whilst hungover; probably wasn’t over the limit – but felt like shit and shouldn’t have been behind the wheel.
molgripsFree MemberHow exactly did you get off?
I was going to answer this, but there’s no point.I’d like to know.
Anyway, to the OP:
I don’t know why you all don’t have one.
CharlieMungusFree MemberSome of these posts are really long and whilst i’ve scanned them, I’ve not got a good idea of folks’ opinions. Could someone just tell me which bandwagon to get on?
bruneepFull MemberJust wait until it comes to a complete stop before you decide.
molgripsFree MemberYou can jump on mine – only one other passenger so far so plenty of room. It’s the one about ‘get a hands free kit’
nickfFree MemberI’d like to know.
Nope, I’ll get flamed and I really can’t be bothered.
I’ve responded directly to the OP by email. Hope it assists
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