After this morning I just have to get it off my chest!

I ride a lot in London. I also drive a lot in London, including my morning commute because I car share and right now, it's drier! Without sounding like Mother Teressa, I think that this makes me a pretty considerate rider and driver. I always keep a good eye out for cyclists when I am driving, even when they do unpredictable and illegal things and vice versa. It's true that when I am riding, I have quite a few near misses with inconsiderate and 'sorry I didn't see you' car drivers, but of late, my biggest gripe has been with fellow cyclists while I am driving. Things like, on my journey to work this morning:

Undertaking a moving car (ie me!) which is clearly indicating left.

Trying (and failing miserably) to race a car from a set of lights and then cutting across his (my) front wing.

Now, at the further risk of sounding like James Martin (which couldn't be further from the truth – I can't even boil and egg – hmmm, maybe that does make me a bit like him?!), some cyclists behaviour is really getting out of hand. Nobody deserves to be knocked off, but some people put themselves in real danger, and I would be devastated if I knocked somebody off, regardless of whether it was their fault.

Can't we all just try to be a bit more considerate of each other? I would be the first to defend a fellow two wheeler, but sometimes I am ashamed to admit to even owning a bike with these idiots on the road.

Now, as I said, this isn't a specific question, it's more of an opportunity to get it off my chest, and I know it might be unpopular, but a balanced debate would be good. I am finding it increasingly difficult not to become anti-bike in London, and I never thought I would see the day I even thought that as a life-long cyclist for commuting, sport, leisure and competition. I guess it's the age-old 'a few spoiling it for the many' situation, but the 'the few' are growing in numbers and declining in ability and politeness!

Somebody restore my faith that most of us aren't such bad riders!

"Some people are stupid" Shocker.

TBH I don't feel any fellowship with people just because they ride a bike.

Can't we all just try to be a bit more considerate of each other?

No no sweet-chick you just can't say that.

i think its all teh fakengers on fixies they are too scared to stop at lights incase they skid so just have to go for it at every opportunity

What is this race of people who ride bikes on roads,and is not London town inhabited by giant steel moles delivering people who cant walk to their offices.

What nick said.

Personally, I don't mind people who ride really badly and slowly, but people who ride badly, aggressively and very fast give me the willies. 🙂

Haven't you heard? The streets are paved with gold. It would be a shame to get them dirty by walking! Given the choice between the 'steel mole' and getting wet, I can understand why so many people ride (I do it myself when I can't car share), but I just think that things are getting out of hand with some of 'them'.

I find it almost impossible to get wound up by other peoples behaviour. If someone does something stupid I'll back off, brake, move, whatever to accommodate them. I don't ride a bicycle on the road but I do ride motorbikes and I feel the same when riding. I account for other peoples behaviour and really don't take anything personally.

Obviously when I'm in a car the end-result of someone else's 2-wheel stupidity isn't going to kill me. On 2-wheels some 4-wheel stupidity could kill me, but I know the risk and I'm willing to take them. It's my risk after all.

It's a stress-free approach.

there are bad drivers, bad walkers and bad riders, usually if your bad at one your bad at them all… i don't care what people do , but i just wish they would be decisive and do it well!

Personally, I don't mind people who ride really badly and slowly, but people who ride badly, aggressively and very fast give me the willies.

I though I would give you hte willies angel-cheeks.

Please call me "honey badger".

Thanks for the Zen lesson 5th Elefant. Sound advice, and something I'll try very hard to emmulate. I would still feel pretty rough if I couldn't avoid one of the idiots, and this morning I had a really near miss which to quote BigDummy 'gave me the willies'!

When I'm in the car I see lots of people driving like total idiots, when I commute on the bike I see lots of people riding like total idiots. I can only control the way I behave so there isn't a lot of point in whinging about it. It'll get you knowwhere, apart from stressed out about it.

I ride. And drive in London. I see more shocking, illegal, unsafe and downright stupid riding than I do driving. Honestly, some people have a) no knowledge of the rules of the road b) no knowledge of the techniques for riding in traffic c) no sense of their own vulnerability or d)ability to assess risk.

Sadly I'm with the OP. When I ride to work I'm usually the only cyclist sitting at the ASL, all the others have gone through. And they all filter on the left, clearly not knowing that the driver has no chance of seeing them. Woefully poor observation, signalling and lighting.

Problem is, I think, that so many are new or don't classify themselves as cyclists. So they don't understand how to ride, don't feel enough of a responsibility to the cycling community to ride legally and don't drive and so have no understanding of the drivers' challenge in spotting them.

There's a lot of work to be done IMHO

More wise words full stop. I'm going to write these on a post-it in my car. Keep it coming. This is like therapy. I'll be driving home this evening full of good karma at this rate. I was feeling like Michael Douglas in Falling Down this morning!

my bad honey badger, come over here I'll make it up to yo uthen 😉

don't feel enough of a responsibility to the cycling community to ride legally

The what? When was that invented? Do they have a council of priests? 😆

Aye, some right twunts on bikes about.

My favorite is the rider in black jeans, a black hoodie, on a black bike, with no lid, no lights, not even the merest hint of a reflector or scotchlight, wheels so out of true he has unhooked the brakes, weaving and RLJ'ing through traffic like a monkey on crack, at night.

Brilliant, in a morbid kinda way.

I accept some riders are bad and I could not give a jot, what I hate is when they have a proper mtb and all the kit on for their commute(prob on this forum or another mtb forum) and then ride like total idiots, almost took someone off yesterday outside parkway station (near filton) he did not stop for a roundabout, had the blooody cheek to f and blind at me… swerved 3 times….. never did get him 😉

Trying (and failing miserably) to race a car from a set of lights and then cutting across his (my) front wing.

I also ride and drive to work, mainly ride, in London. I hate it when you pull up at lights and cars pull along side you, rather than behind. You ride off, often fater, then have to pull out to overtake parked cars and then they complain that you cut them up, has happened to me a few times. No, you should have been driving behind me.

Potentially unpopular moan about my fellow pedestrians, but….

…I'm crossing the road earlier in a busy shopping area and everyone is crossing at the pedestrian crossing on red becuase there are no cars. A guy comes up the hill pretty fast on his Gary Fisher mountain bike and the pedestrians are paying him no attention. Now being a cyclist, motorist and a pedestrian I safely crossed the road ahead of him, but the crux of it was he had to skid to stop before he ploughed into a group of people behind me who just acted like he didn't exist much to his annoyance. Afterwards I heard some people saying how rude he was…yet they were the ones who stepped out in front of him!

Solarider most people are retards, roll with the punches.
(…and no one is catergorically 'right' in any situation)

TBF, there were x number of peds and 1 of him, so if he wanted to come through he should have said something, or rang a bell, of got busy with the freehub action. 'Right of way' only exists in courts and common consent. The former is a hassle and the later was against him.

What might be unpopular is linking many of the comments above to a recent report that showed that as a percentage of cycling commuting casualties there is a dispraportionately high number of female cyclists involved? What's that all about?

The Southern Yeti. Not sure about the point you are making. I haven't seen any reference to the report in question.

To be fair, most of the near misses with aggressive bike riders that I refer to happen with male cyclists. I know that isn't statistically robust, but purely my observation. I guess it opens up a whole different debate about whether aggressive, knowingly law-breaking cyclists are any more or less likely to be injured than more gentile, unknowingly incompetent and unstable cyclists. As BigDummy (sorry, Honey Badger) said, the 'wobblers' are easier to spot and give plenty of passing space to. It's the ones that come out of nowhere and know exactly what they are doing that are the most un-nerving to share the roads with.

Londoners in general think they own and rule the world, unsurprisingly non the same when their on their bikes. 🙄 Just run the idiots over serve them right if its down to their riding. Evne better if there a Wbanker.

flippinheckler. Sounds like an informed and balanced contribution. Thanks, I knew I could count on this forum!

I can speak freely as an 'out-of-towner', and yes, some Londoners do actually believe that they own and rule the country, if not perhaps the world. There's this woman who lives in a big house at the end of the Mall. Liz I think her name is. You know her, married that Greek chap Phil?….

Anyway, the point of my post is that nobody (even Bankers) deserves to get knocked off, but some of them make themselves hard to avoid.

Anyway, the point of my post is that nobody (even Bankers) deserves to get knocked off, but some of them make themselves hard to avoid.

Yes they do!

come on flippinheckler like a banker would cycle to work! i know a few they wouldnt dream of been seen on a bike but would rather shell out hundreds a month at a swanky gym to get not quite as fit as they could if they cycled to work

problem is everyone thinks they own the road, drivers, peds cylists, taxi drivers, coach driver white van men, mums in chelsea tractors, moped drivers

each little tribe thinks they are better than the other tribe and that they are the best biker, driver, ped, soccer mum than the rest

and its a **** densely populated city so there will always be issues

re the women thing, i think the vulnerable ones are the less agressive ones, getting away 1st at the lights can bea lifesaver sometimes and you may have to deal with some twunt beeping and swearing at you coz you are in his way but just take up as much of the road as you can imho

Fair point kimbers. Maybe London is just too crowded and encountering idiots is inevitable. But why does everybody else have to be on the road when I am?!

Don't get me wrong, as I said, I am no Mother Teressa myself, and this isn't about who has the most right to be on the road. It's about some riders' inability to cohabit with other road users in a way that everybody gets on with their day without the need for stress.

In London perhaps more than anywhere you have to bend the rules a little just to get around on a bike, and I agree that being assertive is sometimes necessary. But there's a big difference between bending the rules and sticking 2 fingers up to them, endangering yourself and other road users, and being so aggresive about it to boot. There I do take issue with these riders.

Just got back from a holiday in India. Experience some traffic in Delhi and you get a bit of perspective. Cars, bikes, people, cows, dogs, all doing stupid things, in all directions, as quickly as possible, and as close together as possible! An experience, and I return to the UK with a new appreciation for how organised and well behaved our roads are!

I agree. I spend a lot of time in Paris. Far more chaotic, but somehow it works. Possibly because there is less aggression and attitude. A shrug of the shoulders is the most you get from another driver or rider. Things are getting out of hand here.

As BigDummy (sorry, Honey Badger)

Hoi don't you dare calling him like that… Or I'll kick you in the nuts.