Has anyone any experience of the new 9020s vs the Hope Tech 3 E4/X2?

They’re a similar price, with the Hope being a little heavier and a lot chunkier in appearance.

No complaints about my E4s just feed them pads now and then

If you want long term then go hope, as all parts are available as spares they are pretty much brakes for life

If you like upgrading things every year or so, shimano

Xtr or hope, it’s hope all the way

The real question is are either of them worth the premium over Std deore…

If you like upgrading things every year or so, shimano

That’s so far from my experience of Shimano brakes…

All of mine have been really reliable, going right back to the original M800 Saints that I used for years. I’m currentlyy running slightly older XTR brakes and really like them – they do feel a bit nicer than my previous XT, Deores etc.

Personally I think they’re much nicer looking and feeling things than the Hopes which I find clumpy and ungainly looking. I’ve not used the modern Hope brakes because I sacked them off after anything with a Mini lever.

The real question is are either of them worth the premium over Std deore…

Having had two pairs of Deores, it is very very hard to justify spending four times more on a pair of XTR’s.

The XTR is better finished and has a slightly sleaker lever design but in terms of power there’s not much in it. My Deore’s were great. I’m currently running XTR because there were almost too cheap to pass up. No other reason.

i have a set of deores that ive been using since about 2005. been on several bikes, had a new hose on the front in that time, several sets of pads, the rear one has 3in1 oil inside it, as it was leaking when i took delivery of the bike (halfords)
now on my commuter P7, so not exactly getting a hard time, but i doubt anything could really have been better ‘for me’ in that time.
still working perfectly.

My experience of Hope brakes was that the spares are easy to find and replace, which was a good thing because thats what i needed to do to them aloty. service and replace. By contrast, i dont mind not being able to buy spares for my Shimano brakes, as after 4 years on one of my bikes, they have not needed anything other than new pads from time to time.

For a third of the price and a load less hassle, Shimano all the way.

No experience of those newer brakes you mention however, asd i’m very happy with my ‘old’ Zee’s, Slx’s, and Xt’s.

The new E4 brakes are amazing. I have 2 sets, one is a year old and was used all last winter and performed flawlessly. Still on the original pads which is amazing considering how much use and the conditions they have been used in. I have a set of the last M4’s which are around 4 years old and pretty much the same brake. These have also been flawless and have just had a clean every now and then and new pads when required.
Ignore anyone telling you that Deore will suffice. Whilst they are great brakes they are not a patch on the hopes. Also ignore anyone telling you that hopes are rubbish based on their experience using a 10 year old brake with mini levers. All brakes have come on so much this is just a stupid thing people keep repeating.
I have no experience of the XTR but I think they look a bit tacky and cheap in the fake chrome finish.

Ignore anyone telling you that Deore will suffice. Whilst they are great brakes they are not a patch on the hopes. Also ignore anyone telling you that hopes are rubbish based on their experience using a 10 year old brake with mini levers. All brakes have come on so much this is just a stupid thing people keep repeating.
I have no experience of the XTR but I think they look a bit tacky and cheap in the fake chrome finish.

In what way are they not a patch on Hopes? Are Hopes really three or four times the brake?

I used to be a massive Hope fanboy. My original E4’s with Pro levers were bloody brilliant. I ‘upgraded’ to M4’s and they were awful as were the following Mono series. I lost faith in their brakes big time, especially given the price. The likes of Shimano came out with a much more relaible (IME) product at a better price.

The latest XTR brakes have a smoked finish now anyway.

Shimano all the way for me but I prefer XTs to XTR (I have both)

For me the hopes are 4x the brake. I don’t need to justify it. I had the money and was happy to spend it.
It just annoys me when someone asks a specific question and people end up going off on a tangent trying to convince someone that they don’t need to spend their money on what they want.

Sorry, Now the XTR look tacky in fake smoked chrome.

For me the hopes are 4x the brake. I don’t need to justify it. I had the money and was happy to spend it.
It just annoys me when someone asks a specific question and people end up going off on a tangent trying to convince someone that they don’t need to spend their money on what they want.

Sorry, Now the XTR look tacky in fake smoked chrome.

Just like people syaing they are four times the brake but not saying why…

I’ve got the XTR’s just because on my current bike. Objectively it is hard to justify them over the Deore’s other than just becuse. The finish is better, they feel a bit better but don’t really work any better.

I did agree that it’s hard to justify the expenditure over the Deore’s when someone else mentioned.

Ignore everyone but me! The ones I use are the best! 😆

The hopes are

4x better looking.
4x more British made
4x more expensive
4x more powerful
4x more purple
4x better modulation

None of the above may be true.
Or maybe I just liked them 4x more than other options and wanted to spend 4x more than I needed too.

The shimano parts availability’s more of a thing with the more expensive brakes imo… If you get an XT or similiar and need a seal you can easily just buy a caliper and swap the seal or fit it, it still makes good economic sense. With XTR it’s a lot more expensive to do the same trick.

In conclusion, Formula R0.

Or maybe I just liked them 4x more than other options and wanted to spend 4x more than I needed too.

Doesn’t make them four times the brake though….and there are no issues with that. As I said, I’ve swapped to XTR because I liked them and I could.

For a third of the price and a load less hassle, Shimano all the way.

This, they just work. I used to have XTR, now have XT and there’s no functional difference.

Thing is, it doesn’t have to be 4x the cost. Some bargains out there in the used market if you search for them.

I have a Mono M4 and an M4 with Tech levers (pre-Evo). Fairly sure the Mono M4 caliper is nearly 10years old. And I bought it all second hand. Overall cost of the set not far off XT’s with the added bonus of being able to get spares.

I wouldn’t touch second hand Shimano brakes at all, and I like Hope kit. I’m sure Deore or even SLX just works, but it’s not shiney enough for me.

Oh look a shimano vs hope brakes thread again.

Shimano all the way. The only spares Ive ever needed is pads, hoses and olives when I have swapped them onto the next bike. Plus they are dead easy to bleed and use mineral oil rather than that nasty DOT stuff

Never had any problems with either. Just depends which feel you like (on/off or more modulating).
Gotta say that so far, Guides are nicer to use than both (at least to me).

Stevelol – Member
Oh look a shimano vs hope brakes thread again.

Agreed, but my question was quite specific and aimed at current models. The last thread in this vein was last year.

Is there really any difference between XT and XTR, other than cosmetics?

I love there aesthetics but id stay well away from xtr. From my own experiences I went through about 4 levers in the past 2 years. The latest ones they have sent out with the carbon blades are complete dog sh*t.

I have given up now and bought slx’s instead. The issue I had is quite common specifically to XTR if you google it – a piece collapses in the master cyclinder which means the lever gives way and wont return! the master cyclinder is sealed and so the xtr levers are a right off. The issue doesnt seem that common with the “lower” spec shimano brakes so Im guessing whatever collapses has had weight shaved from it to lighten the lever up.

I’m a Shinano man through and through, but have just got a pair of Formula RX1 off CRC for less than £80. I thought I’d try something new.

Is there really any difference between XT and XTR, other than cosmetics?

Having had both, not that I can tell so far. The XTR’s are marginally lighter and have the dimples at the end of the blade.

They both have tool free reach adjustment and the freestroke adjuster.

The Tech 3 E4 are really nice. At the moment, for their price they’re not proportionally as many times as good a brake as the Deores on my old XC bike (though they’re certainly much better). But over time I expect them to keep working great and be easily and cheaply serviced to maintain excellent performance. I don’t expect the Deores to last a fraction as well. Short term cost vs long term value?

neither, get saint or zee.

I had the XT’s for 2 years and they performed well. They’re like the Ronseal of brakes. They do what they’re supposed to and do it well. They are very on or off with not much in between so if that’s your thing then go for it.

Eventually the spring that keeps the lever forward went in one side so it developed an annoying rattle when I wasnt covering the brake, and after that the pin for the lever developed some movement which caused the lever to stick a couple of times when I didnt want it too 😯 ! Chatting to a few people this is quite a common issue on both the XT’s and XTR’s. The answer was a whole new brake and my rear disc was ready for replacing so I bought the Hope Tech E4’s.

Build quality the Hopes look and feel better, far more adjustment than the XT’s so you can get them exactly where and how you want them to feel, and far more progression and a lot less grabby but stop you when you need them to. Second ride out I had an off and snapped a lever…. no problem, levers sold separately and piece of p155 to replace on the kitchen table.

I can’t tell you if they’ll last because I’ve only had them 2 months, but for me the Hope brakes over the XT’s and the XTR’s are not worth the extra money over the XT’s.

E4s over XTR but agree if you’re going Shimano why pay more than Deore?

Have XT on the hardtail, E4s on the FS, I definitely rate the Hopes over the Shimanos, are they worth 3 times as much? Probably not but they are better.

Leftyboy – adjustability. Deores arent great for little hands!

Ah OK not had any Shimano since my XTs (6 years ago) fell apart.

I don’t know why the love for deore on here. I’ve had a few new sets and yes they work but the quality of the finish is so cheap they spoil a quality build. Slx aren’t much better to be honest but they are better.

Since when has four times the price equaled four times the performance, how often does paying double the price for anything double the performance?

Brakes like everything else in his world follow the law of diminishing returns.

people still use Hope? 😆

Always Hope, whenever I build a bike hope brakes are the only constant. probably first and foremost of all components.

I’ve not tried the new M8000 series Shimano but I’ve heard the big S may have addressed the horrible feeling which has plagued their previous brakes, doubt the spares issue will be sorted though.

For the same money I’d be also looking at the SRAM Guide Ultimates.

I’ve had all the small lever Shimano brakes, the best for me overall was the SLX, as they were cheap and worked as well s the XTRs.

I’ve had Hope Tech3 E4, and X2 and I’ve also had Hope Tech X2 and Race X2.

The Tech3 E4 is a big step up from the previous Hope brakes.

There’s no right or wrong answer, just choice. If you like power immediately available, with no modulation to get there, then go for the Shimanos.

If you like less power immediately, with it building up the more you pull the levers. Get the Hopes.

If you like a huge amount of modulation, which means its pretty easy to not lock up the wheels, get the SRAM.

They’re all similar in weight. Shimanos warranty is fine, so is Srams, but Hope really are better in that department.

Generally, my advice would be… Buy the brake you like the look of, and makes you want to buy it. Otherwise you’ll just end up going round in circles.

So… Which brake do you really *want*?

“Shimano have no modulation” is rubbish, i can easily do everything from a light feather, gradual slow down and cool skids with my deores, it’s really not hard.

fd3chris – Member
I don’t know why the love for deore on here. I’ve had a few new sets and yes they work but the quality of the finish is so cheap they spoil a quality build. Slx aren’t much better to be honest but they are better

Erm, the love for deores is being able to buy a reliable powerful brake suitable for xc and dh for £60 a pair!

Also, shimano have a 2 year warranty. Comments saying shim are great if you want to replace them every year conveniently gloss over this.

I’ve never had to bin any shimano brakes in all my years riding bikes.