so any opinions on which? XTR trail, XT or maybe magura? any defo not to on any of these? I really like powerful brakes even though only do heavier end of XC but have to be really good on modulation.

current brakes on a 140mm hardtail are saint 810 levers with 810 caliper on front (love modulation of 4 pots) and a XT cailper on rear both with goodrige braided. 180mm front, 160mm back.

Very very hard to look beyond slx ime. They have the nicer callipers from xt and a simpler lever with less to go wrong.

chain reaction are currently doing new XT’s at £65 an end or the old XT’s at £55. iirc no functional difference, just ones black, ones silver. can’t see you would find much that is better value than those. although there are better brakes around, if you get a ‘good’ set of XT’s (ie without the need to double tap / alarming lever to the bar), i think theyre fine for pretty much all riding

Loving my ‘old’ XTs – you won’t have to dig far to find the XT Brake thread about terrifying moving bite points and such – but, within that thread there’s a link to a Bike Rumour page when a Shimano chap explains the slightly strange set-up procedure – I followed that, used genuine Shimano fluid and they’re not pretty much perfect, lots of power, easy to modulate.

Saying that, if you don’t desire any sort of bling factor – they basic of basic Deore brakes that came fitted to my Tracer Foundation build were, if anything, slightly more perfect to use, just missing some features

Merlin are doing a good deal on Magura’s and I really like the way they feel. If you want power the MT5/7’s are supposed to be eyeball popping.

I run XTR with 160mm.

Also have old LX with 180mm disc.

Both are great but XTR is lighter.

LX 180mm disc makes a huge difference in power and feel.

current brakes on a 140mm hardtail are saint 810 levers with 810 caliper on front (love modulation of 4 pots)

I think you need a pair of Zees then.

At the moment its a no brainer

click here

chakaping

was tempted by new saints but wanted to loose bit of weight ideally. xt bite point problems? is that on the new 8000s as well or 785 and prev?

chrismac

presume link was meant to be to maguras at merlin? i had seen prices hence my are maguras good etc

Shimano have always felt a little on/off to me, given that you like 4 pots and modulation have you considerd Sram guides?

Bags of modulation and bags of power

i had but looked that closely yet. although for same weight would prob get the saints?

The two-pot Shimanos don’t have the same modulation or power as the Zees (I haven’t tried new Saints).

The lever pulling to bar thing seems to happen to some units after a while but they have a two-year warranty. I’ve experienced the issue but would buy again, as they tick all the other boxes.

talking myself into some saint 820s by the look of it! 195 a set @ merlin at mo

Hope – There’s is little better than Tech e3s with Floating rotors. Having had XTRs, XTs and Avid (not guides, I’ve yet to try them), I’ve recently gone back to Hope after previously falling for the bling of XTR. They’re SOO much better, quieter, more reliable, lighter (than my 988 Trails) and I never have to wonder “what will they do in this corner? as the performance from Shimano was variable at best.

I know exactly what they’re going to do and there’s a beautiful linear application of power which corresponds to level position, rather than Shimano’s “nothing, nothing, Nothing, NOTHING!, FULL Lockup, Crash (or just a continuation of nothing)”

I used to absolutely love hopes until the black and silver m4s came out then vowed to never buy again. bought set of 1st generation slx and thought, these just work!!. hence then current shimanos I have.

…the bike point issues are with the current 8000’s, if you go for the previous 785’s you should be fine (I wish I had!).

got zee’s with 203mm discs F&R on my hardtail

vertical climber – Member

was tempted by new saints but wanted to loose bit of weight ideally.

<recommends what he has> CRC has the Formula T1 on sale just now, it’s a fairly old design now but still kicks ass. The set on my fatbike used to be on my XC bike and before that they were on my dh bikes- light enough for one job, powerful and durable enough for the other, and lovely feel (*)

Parts are pisstakingly expensive mind but I’ve run 3 sets for about 4 years now and only had to buy IIRC one seal and an occasional crash damage bit.

(* course, this is subjective- they’re got tons of feel and progression which can feel like weakness if you like the immediate STOP! you get from some other brakes. In fact there’s absolutely tons of power on tap, it just arrives gently and doesn’t really deploy til you tel it to)

…the bike point issues are with the current 8000’s, if you go for the previous 785’s you should be fine (I wish I had!).

Not true unfortunately.

hmmm not really considered formulas

TBH I think Formula have pretty well sabotaged themselves with years of substandard OE stuff- they’re really not very good at it so people reasonably judge the good kit on experiences with the RX and that. But I suppose that’s where the money is!

I got a bit hacked off with XT’s, bite point and leaking etc. I fitted goodridge hoses to sort it and at first I thought they hadn’t. Then after a few rides and a mini bleed a big air bubble came out of each master cylinder and they have been brilliant ever since. Then I fitted the new M8000 levers to my old M785 callipers to fit the new gear lever ispec nonsense. The new levers are better, they are sealed units so that eliminates another XT issue. They have slightly better modulation and the brakes feel massively powerful and very reliable. So for me at the moment XT but add the cost of the goodridge hoses to make them work properly and you are into more expensive brake territory.

hmmm not sold on the formulas at mo, might be erring towards sram guide rsc based on lots of good reviews. not sure about new shimanos yet, mate in trade defo not impressed with quality, finish of xtr so would be xt or saints. have to admit that these days am more of a fit and forget and ride peson then a fiddler so tedious bleeding problems am not nterested in.

New maguras very well regarded by mates,
hopes for me tho, recently dabbled with shimanos, but still prefer the hopes

@PJay – you don’t happen to have a link to the bike rumour page you mentioned? I need to bleed my older XTR brakes in the morning (the ones with the orange end cap), and I’ve never really been able to get them as good as the bike shop does them.

heard magura support was not that good ie spares etc or has that changed?

vertical climber – Member

might be erring towards sram guide rsc based on lots of good reviews

What was that Bikeradar review, “When these work, they’re so fantastic that we can almost recommend them” 😆

@julzm

It’s buried within here –

Tech Speak: Brake Fluid Break Down & Implications for Road Disc

It’s a pretty interesting read and, if you believe the words of the Shimano PR guy, it gives a good explanation of how and why they say certain things and why sometimes they work the way they do.

It might be blind luck, but using Shimano fluid, and following the procedure on that link I’ve eliminated the random bite point thing.