Boring topic, apologies – but normally STW comes up with decent answers for this stuff.

I’m trying to sort out planning permission for a dormer loft conversion. My understanding was that if it didn’t add more than 50 cubic m, you no longer needed planning permission, just building regs.

However, if you want to use normal glass in side facing windows (rather than obscured task) you DO need permission – and as we wanted normal glass we put in a full planning application.

None of our neighbours minded (there are other similar conversions on the street and no-one objected to planning) but we’ve just had the application refused, on the grounds that it is out of character in a victorian semi. The planning officer just doesn’t like it, basically. This seems ridiculous as we could build the bloody thing without permission if we used obscured glass.

Any ideas on how to proceed with an appeal? We’re not in a conservation area or anything. Can we just go back to building regs, and build it with obscured glass (as this was the only reason we went to planning anyway?).

any similar experiences/advice much appreciated!

Cheers,

Ian

Is it a conservation area, a lot of Victorian terraces are. If so you might have restrictions on your permitted development. If you have no restrictions then go for it. You could probably even use clear glass if no neighbours complain and the planners don’t check up.

If you do need permission then get a copy of the planning guidelines, should be on the council website. That’ll give reasons why permission should and shouldn’t be given.

If you’re putting in clear glass to the sides then it will be a planning issue because you’ll be looking into other people’s properties. Also if its within a certain distance of the boundary it’ll require to be fire rated as well I thought.
You’ll still need to apply for permitted development anyway, so you can;t just build it and be damned.

good advice here, you might not need planning permission http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/permission/commonprojects/loftconversion/miniguide

I’d always advice chatting to Planning before you submit anything, then you have a pretty good idea what to submit / how to phrase it etc. I’d phone them up and have a chat.

Same goes for building control. I found both really helpful.

This seems ridiculous as we could build the bloody thing without permission if we used obscured glass.

Why is it important that you don’t use obscured glass?

Build it with obscured glass & then put in planning for clear glass.

Why is it important that you don’t use obscured glass?

In the end that isn’t a big deal – it just lets in a bit more light. But we’ve gone from being able to build the conversion with obscured glass under permitted development, to not being able to build it at all, because of our planning application refusal…

In the end that isn’t a big deal – it just lets in a bit more light. But we’ve gone from being able to build the conversion with obscured glass under permitted development, to not being able to build it at all, because of our planning application refusal…

How come? Surely if it’s permitted development, then refusal for something that isn’t permitted development doesn’t matter?

Can you find a solution that will not have side windows

We used hip to gable with a rear dormer with a massive floor to ceiling window and then front velux, was more than enough light.

Our neighbour did a similar development with a hole for a clear glass window, I invited him in to see the view: straight into my toilet (only lower half of window was obscured glass), they bricked it up the next day!

How come? Surely if it’s permitted development, then refusal for something that isn’t permitted development doesn’t matter?

you’d think so, wouldn’t you? We went permitted development first, they said “it’s fine, but if you want clear glass, get planning permission”. So we did, and now planning are saying it isn’t permitted development because they don’t like it.

Actually, having spent the afternoon looking at the internet, I think they may have us on a technicality as our proposed dormer goes straight up from the side wall, not 20 cm back from the eaves, which is part of the permitted development guidelines. Seems the guy who did our drawings may have f**ked up to me, although the permitted development folk at the council didn’t object at the first submission…

you’d think so, wouldn’t you? We went permitted development first, they said “it’s fine, but if you want clear glass, get planning permission”. So we did, and now planning are saying it isn’t permitted development because they don’t like it.

Actually, having spent the afternoon looking at the internet, I think they may have us on a technicality as our proposed dormer goes straight up from the side wall, not 20 cm back from the eaves, which is part of the permitted development guidelines. Seems the guy who did our drawings may have f**ked up to me, although the permitted development folk at the council didn’t object at the first submission…

Yes, but your planning application was for clear glass. Obscured glass is a different design, and as long as the rest of it meets PD requirements, I can’t see that planning have any right to get involved. Or am I missing something here?

You could try applying for a lawful development certificate if you can get your plans revised to meet PD?

Yes, but your planning application was for clear glass. Obscured glass is a different design, and as long as the rest of it meets PD requirements, I can’t see that planning have any right to get involved. Or am I missing something here?

You could try applying for a lawful development certificate if you can get your plans revised to meet PD?

No, I think you’ve nailed it. That’s the conclusion I’ve come to as well (revise plans, PD, and LDC).

cheers,

Ian

where are you ianpv? what local authority?

Radical suggestion I know, but have you phoned them up and asked what changes would be required to get it to pass?

Agreed. Build it under PD and get a certificate of lawful development before you start to cover. You can always apply for permission to change the glass at a later date.

I’m in Bristol, BS3, Andy.

Footflaps, the planning people don’t like us going to the ridge, but we have to given the headroom. PD doesn’t care about that, so I think we’ll have to go that way. We have spoken to them!

We were denied planning due to ‘setting a precedent’.

ie Everyone with an equivalent house would do the same…