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Loft conversion ..purely for storage.
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zippykonaFull Member
Would extending our loft for storage rather than to make a bedroom be a lot cheaper?
We have lost our free storage for the shop and are looking at £1200 a year now we have to pay for it.
Would planning believe we really won’t use it as a room? Is it just a case of squaring off our apex roof and putting in a window or would we still need to strengthen the joists?
My go to man is not answering his phone so over to the massive.molgripsFree MemberBiggest differences I could imagine:
1) no windows required
2) don’t need to move/reshape rafters that would otherwise intrude into a room
3) you might not need a proper staircase, you could use a permanent ladder and maybe come up with a lift arrangement.
4) No heating required
5) Might be easier to get building regs approval – after all, we have garages that are designated non-living spaces but they don’t know if we live in them or not..?Actually, not a bad idea at all.
You might still find that the joists need replacing though. Or maybe you could simply supplement the existing ones.. hmm…
I am not a builder.
grizedaleforestFull MemberLoft joists are typically fairly light weight so unless you’re just storing empty cardboard boxes and the like, you will probably need to strengthen the joists.
Is this loft above your shop or in your house; or are they one and the same? If in your house then storing stock will be a change of use and you’ll have to consider insurance?
Fresh Goods Friday 696: The Middling Edition
Latest Singletrack VideosFresh Goods Friday 696: The Middlin...perchypantherFree MemberIn general, if it looks different fom the outside e.g adding windows, dormers or altering the configuration of the roof then it’ll likely need planning consent.
Speak to you local planning officer. They’re normally pretty helpful and will guide you down the path of least resistance if you treat them like actual people rather than the soulless robots most folk assume them to be.
molgripsFree MemberHnmm.. looks like no-one makes a lift to put stuff into a loft. Interesting.
Can any builders tell me about strengthening joists?
nickjbFree MemberYou can normally add a velux window without planning. Worth doing as it’ll let in a load of light. You can usually add a dormer to the rear as well under permitted development and that will give you a load more space but will add a chunk of cost. As mentioned stairs will be the biggest saving as for a habitable room they need to be proper. There are also issues like fire escapes and smoke alarms that you bypass, too.
You can pretty much do what you want internally but its worth do the structural stuff. To strengthen the joists the easiest way is add more joists either along the top of the existing ones to thicken them or at 90 degrees. Which is best will depend on where the joists are currently supported. Basically work out where your load bearing walls are and work from there.
zippykonaFull MemberIt’s above our house.
There will be a fair bit of weight as there will be thousands of greetings cards and bags. Currently we have 7 years of paper work in the loft which will be going elsewhere. So that will be a like for like swap.
Am I already overloading my loft? There’s no sign that we are.STATOFree MemberIs it just a case of squaring off our apex roof
Dont know where you are but that’s not an easy thing to get past planners usually.
zippykonaFull MemberNext door have a proper loft conversion.
Their roof is square at the back but sloped at the front.
I intend for ours to look the same.nickjbFree MemberTheir roof is square at the back but sloped at the front.
I intend for ours to look the same.If you follow the guidelines then you can do that without planning: https://www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200130/common_projects/36/loft_conversion
A loft conversion for your house is considered to be permitted development, not requiring an application for planning permission, subject to the following limits and conditions:
A volume allowance of 40 cubic metres additional roof space for terraced houses*
A volume allowance of 50 cubic metres additional roof space for detached and semi-detached houses*
No extension beyond the plane of the existing roof slope of the principal elevation that fronts the highway
No extension to be higher than the highest part of the roof
Materials to be similar in appearance to the existing house
No verandas, balconies or raised platforms
Side-facing windows to be obscure-glazed; any opening to be 1.7m above the floor
Roof extensions not to be permitted development in designated areas**
Roof extensions, apart from hip to gable ones, to be set back, as far as practicable, at least 20cm from the original eaves
The roof enlargement cannot overhang the outer face of the wall of the original house.You’ll need to do this whether it is storage or a room. Its just building regs you bypass by not making it habitable.
Assuming you aren’t in a conservation area or national park.
ads678Full MemberAs nickjb shows in his link you can even put in dormers under permitted development these days.
T1000Free Memberyou could use something like Telebeam as its got type approval for building regs.
Even if you don’t plan to form a habitable room then at least you could prove its ok for building regs if a future owner wants to or you change your mind
fongsaiyukFree MemberCan any builders tell me about strengthening joists?
generally put larger joist to side of existing – you may or may not require steels depending on existing supports and building inspector
Molgrips – if you are in Swindon and are doing a loft give me a shout – I can point you to the right people to help
GrahamSFull MemberFor reference, we got ours done in 2010.
We went for a halfway house of storage room – but make it nice enough that we can store a bed there and use it for the odd guest. 😉
Floor joists and floorboards, several leccy points, lighting, walls plasterboarded and eves turned into cupboards, two velux window installed, access via a wooden attic ladder that drops down from the hatch.
Cost was £2650 with all work done by a local firm.
Sketchy as you like mind you: no planning, no inspection, “plans” drawn in biro on a bit of A4. But it all worked. 😀
avdave2Full MemberWhat are the implications of turning your residence into, in part, a business premises?
molgripsFree MemberMolgrips – if you are in Swindon and are doing a loft give me a shout – I can point you to the right people to help
Thanks, only working here temporarily mind.
I’d be looking to DIY my loft I think but I’d need to be sure I was doing it right. Don’t want my roof collapsing 🙂
DrPFull MemberYou can achieve a lot under permitted developments…
We went from this:
To this beast of a dormer:
And apart from the cladding issue (which I had to retrospectively apply for planing!) it was under PDs..
It’s huge!
DrP
zippykonaFull MemberTo the nearest £5k how much would it cost to put this on my roof?
Assuming the existing joists are ok and I would insulate it myself. Leaving a bare finish inside. The chimney has already been taken down. Surrey prices.
fongsaiyukFree Member[/quote]I’d be looking to DIY my loft I think but I’d need to be sure I was doing it right
– doing mine atm – happy to show you if you want – old town Swindon
Assuming the existing joists are ok
– very doubtful – where abouts in surry – I have a contact in Surbiton if you’re near for pricing
DrPFull MemberI’d guess at £15-20 for that dormer and new joists, with NOTHING being done inside – no plastering, no floor boards etc.
IANAB
DrP
nickjbFree MemberWhat are the implications of turning your residence into, in part, a business premises?
Not much for storing a few boxes in loft. There may be covenants in the deeds that prevent certain types of business (selling alcohol or working on cars are more common) and some types of business require planning/change of use but that is usually retail from the site. Also if you claim income tax relief you risk paying capital gains tax on a portion of the property when you sell.
ourmaninthenorthFull Member£1200 pa storage costs do somehow seem materially cheaper than the capital costs of even a partial loft conversion….
zippykonaFull MemberJust exploring options. The stuff we are storing is probably only worth £3k tops so paying £1200 to store it hurts.
And no,Mrs Zip won’t ever throw anything away!GrahamSFull Member£1200 pa storage costs do somehow seem materially cheaper than the capital costs of even a partial loft conversion..
As above, we paid £2650 (in 2010) for ours so equivalent to a couple of years storage.
Plus the money spent adds to the value of your house, rather than storage company profits.
thestabiliserFree Memberwe did a bedroom with ensuite for 24k about 5 yrs ago. Carrying the blocks up to save a few quid in labour costs was a pain in the harris.
thisisnotaspoonFree MemberOur loft is a storage room with a velux window, ~7ft headroom in the center, so nowhere near enough space for a bed, and accessed by a permenant ladder/staircase in one of the spare bedrroms. Suspect that at some point it’ll become a teenagers den/porn stash/loveshack if/when we have kids :?.
Great for storing camping stuff though. Like having a shed garage, that’s warm and dry and no mice so down bags and self inflating mats can just be left out to air.
It doesn’t have approval, and we had to get an indemnity when we bought the house.
Be interesting to know how much a full dormer would cost, been umming and ahhing over what to do with our house long term, either go up into the loft properly with a dormer, or demolish and rebuild the double length garage as a 2 storey extension, with a single garage at the front, then knock through the dining room into the back of the garage, ‘conservatory’ and kitchen. Which would get us the same amount of upstairs space, and probably add more value by increasing the downstairs too. Downside it would probably mean moving out in order to do it!
brFree MemberJust exploring options. The stuff we are storing is probably only worth £3k tops so paying £1200 to store it hurts.
And no,Mrs Zip won’t ever throw anything away!Is this stock that is constantly changing, or just stuff she won’t throw out – if the former you’ll need access and carrying boxes up/down a ladder isn’t fun, if the later…
Also if it’s for business you’re taking £100pcm that can be ‘expensed’ to +£5k (or multiples of that) that can’t be.
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