• This topic has 36 replies, 26 voices, and was last updated 7 years ago by duir.
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  • Laser Eye Surgery Complications- what to do next?
  • mrwhyte
    Free Member

    The OH had laser eye surgery last year, and has since not got back her 20/20 vision, and has been diagnosed with a serious case of dry eye.

    She struggles to drive in the dark, especially when it is wet, and has been told to change her lifestyle and work, as working in front of a computer makes it worse.

    Optical Express have just sent a letter saying they will give her the money back, but she cannot claim any compensation and must sign a confidentiality agreement.

    She just wants her money back, as she has heard others have fought for years without any resolution. I think she needs to at least explore other avenues, as she now has this complication for life, and has to buy some pretty expensive drops to keep putting in her eyes.

    No win no fee lawyers have already said they cannot do anything as it is not negligence.

    Has anyone else got experiences with dealing with this kind of thing?

    shermer75
    Free Member

    I feel your pain for you and your mrs, this cannot be very easy for you!

    Is the refund only available on the condition that you sign the confidentiality agreement? If so that is a spectacularly shitty thing to do, and if that is there game then bat their shitty, underhand little serve straight back to them and ask for loads more money (compensation) or you will feel bound by your conscience to make as many other people aware of the possible consequences of this procedure!!

    Capt.Kronos
    Free Member

    Surely it depends what the contract said? I know that when I had laser surgery it was very much spelled out to me that there was a chance of complications, so proceeding was at my own risk (barring any negligence or malpractice on their part).

    Dry eyes were highlighted as I already had pretty dry eyes – to the extent that the surgeon refused to use the newfangled Corneal Flap proceedure and just went straight at the eyeball Russian Style (which hurt like hell, but did reduce the chances of complications due to dry eyes).

    I would check over the paperwork carefully, perhaps speak to a decent legal practice for them to look over it – and possibly seek the opinion of another surgeon as to whether the correct proceedure was followed and take it from there.

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    midlifecrashes
    Full Member

    A good friend of ours had complications requiring rework and now long term blepharitis, due to bad op and poor aftercare. She got good aftercare eventually through http://www.stjameslaservision.co.uk/ and good legal backup from mrsmidlife’s firm but you are usually better off getting that locally.

    mrwhyte
    Free Member

    I think it pretty much said exactly what yours said Capt.

    However, they want to charge £25 for the signed copy she signed in Optical Express, and she is reluctant to get it as money in general is tight at the moment.

    She does not remember them doing a dry eye test, and the procedure she explained to the consultant after the op, said she should never have been a candidate in the first place. Optical Express are saying she did have the test and they did explain to her about the dry eye after the test, as they are stating that they have recordings of ALL the conversations she has had.

    Capt.Kronos
    Free Member

    Speak to legal folk – I bet they don’t have recordings, and if they were recording the conversations I believe they would have to have informed her first (by law) so perhaps are in breach there.

    evh22
    Free Member

    You are entitled to access your notes, I’d ask for all of them but will charge a fee. This is for NHS but i don’t see it being different for private. £50 appears the going rate for paper copies. They should have a detailed record of all consultations, particularly given this must be a medicolegal mine field. What they will mean is they’ve kept a record in notes, but how detailed depends on the person taking the notes.
    http://www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/2635.aspx?CategoryID=68&SubCategoryID=160

    Dry eye is a recognised complication, it should be stated on the consent form. If you believe she’s undergone an incorrect procedure then you’ll need to consult someone who is an expert willing to state this. They might not do a “Test” for dry eye, it’s often part of an eye history, which should be stated in the notes (e.g. symptoms of dry, gritty eye, allergies etc.). I’m not an expert though, but I’m pretty sure there must be standard operating procedures for laser eye surgery out there on the internet, there’s guidelines for everything else these days.

    If you want this to consume your life there’s a website. Fundamentally you’ll need to decide what your goals are, as litigation is a miserable affair and often exacerbates symptoms due to the stress.
    http://opticalexpressruinedmylife.co.uk

    If it’s the cost of eye drops: if they are NHS get a prescription prepayment card for £120ish per year although things like lacrilube are likely to be cheaper on the internet.

    tron
    Free Member

    I am not a lawyer!

    I’d put in a data access request for the contract and all recordings of conversations.

    To my mind the offer of a refund is an admission of liability and I’d keep pushing. And the confidentiality agreement is definitely an admission that their reputation is worth £ to them. Most no win no fee types won’t want to touch it as it’s not an open and shut case. I’d be inclined to push as hard as possible down normal complaints routes – escalating the complaint to the chief exec and any governing bodies.

    Tom_W1987
    Free Member

    Yeah, never go to Optical Express for laser eye surgery. See a private specialist – eg Julian Stevans at Moorfields or another centre of excellence.

    Daffy
    Full Member

    Tom_W1987 – Member
    Yeah, never go to Optical Express for laser eye surgery. See a private specialist at Moorfields or another centre of excellence.

    POSTED 45 SECONDS AGO # REPORT-POST

    Not in the least bit helpful, Tom.

    mrwhyte
    Free Member

    She has just got off the phone from the lady who runs the optical express ruined my life site. She is apparently in court 3 times this week against OE.

    The fact they have given her a figure already, and the consultant they sent her to see for the after care, shows they have really ballsed up, the consultant is the go to guy if they know they have made a mistake. Not too sure if she should take what she says with a pinch of salt though.

    Have persuaded OH to at least fight for more, considering the damage they have done. Will keep posted on how she gets on.
    Cheers for responses so far!

    bedmaker
    Full Member

    Surely it depends what the contract said? I know that when I had laser surgery it was very much spelled out to me that there was a chance of complications, so proceeding was at my own risk (barring any negligence or malpractice on their part).

    Same here.

    I’d say if they are offering money back then take that as some small compensation. I’d be very surprised if they had to give anything. It’s crap, but what she signed up for.

    It was made very, very clear several times to me that there was a risk of issues. Different company right enough.

    Tom_W1987
    Free Member

    Moorfields see people for complications associated with laser eye surgery, so that’s what I’d do.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    There’s 2 very different things… Eye surgery has a natural risk of complication and there’s no guarantees, I assume they still lay that all out in advance? But accepting that doesn’t free them from their duty of care so if they screwed up, it’s very different from if it’s just a forseeable complication.

    cheekymonkey888
    Free Member

    another avenue maybe to check the surgeon. I remember being able to select my surgeon to do my op. I went with one that had did a friends and also checked out other work they had done and papers they had published and their current hospital.

    How long ago was the op. I never knew I had dry eyes until afterwards and I went through a lot of different drops for 1 year. It got a bit better but my eyes definitely look like pink eye from south park after a day infront of the computer or riding without goggles.

    I hope all goes well

    footflaps
    Full Member

    If they didn’t screw up and it’s just bad luck, then the offer of the fee back is very generous. If the problem is a result of negligence then it’s quite shitty. You really need to independently work out if it was negligence or not, which will require independent consultations etc and access to all notes.

    jkomo
    Full Member

    I can’t offer any advice, but I might be able to get the drops for trade, email me what she needs and I’ll get you a price.

    mrwhyte
    Free Member

    The issue is, is she cannot remember doing the dry eye test, which they needed to have done. As from this they would have said that she was not suitable for surgery. I think she needs to get the transcripts of the conversations during the consultation period. If they have not done the dry eye test, I suppose this comes under negligence.

    Cheers for the offer jkomo, have emailed you.

    The surgery was over a year ago now, the first few months were pretty bad, but after trying lots of different drops it has helped a tad.

    The trouble is, is that when we have the log burner going it makes the symptoms worse!!

    cheekymonkey888
    Free Member

    Try flaxseed, I gave it a go and I’m sure it did something .. soluble vitamins made mine worse and central heating over winter is another.

    nickc
    Full Member

    you need to decide whether to pursue or accept the fee return offer. If you’re going to pursue, then seek legal advice, don’t do it yourself. find a competent medico/legal firm who have experience with OE and do it properly; otherwise OE will always have the upper hand as they WILL have legal advice.

    tjagain
    Full Member

    The first offer of compo is merely the starting point. If they have offered her money back now then they know they are in the wrong and a confidentiality agreement is not realistic anyway

    Get all the notes and all the associated paperwork. the tell them you are going to sue for 10 times what they have offered. Settle for 5 times. They will settle I bet.

    Rockhopper
    Free Member

    I had mine done at OE about five years ago now, luckily I have no problems. Anyhow I can 100% say that non of the appointments I had were recorded with my knowledge.

    mrwhyte
    Free Member

    So after a bit of digging on the surgeon who performed the op, he is not registered as an ophthalmic surgeon in the UK!!

    johndoh
    Free Member

    Considering the claimed very low risks of problems, I have heard of so many issues with this sort of surgery (including a good friend who has permanent partial loss of sight in one eye).

    I’d rather stick with my glasses 😐

    So after a bit of digging on the surgeon who performed the op, he is not registered as an ophthalmic surgeon in the UK!!

    But that is simply crazy – is that even legal?

    mrwhyte
    Free Member

    Appears not, but the OH is writing to the GM council to ask for more info.

    alpin
    Free Member

    Is the refund only available on the condition that you sign the confidentiality agreement? If so that is a spectacularly shitty thing to do, and if that is there game then bat their shitty, underhand little serve straight back to them and ask for loads more money (compensation) or you will feel bound by your conscience to make as many other people aware of the possible consequences of this procedure

    +1

    Sod going to a high street chain to get your eyes fricking lazered….

    Rockhopper
    Free Member

    Statistically though the risk is very low, around 15,000 people a year have the treatment (according to Google) with 1-4% experiencing problems (ranginess in severity of course!).

    Also from OE’s web site:

    “Every Optical Express ophthalmic surgeon specialises in the field of refractive surgery and each is registered with the General Medical Council (GMC)”

    From another web site:

    “The big problem is that, other than being a doctor, no specialist qualifications are legally required to carry out laser eye surgery.”

    DezB
    Free Member

    Sod going to a high street chain to get your eyes fricking lazered.
    Especially one that gives it the hard sell as soon as you make enquiries. Had to block them on my phone in the end. Tossers.

    I know that when I had laser surgery it was very much spelled out to me that there was a chance of complications, so proceeding was at my own risk

    Like any surgery..? Which is why I’ll stick with contact lenses.

    (Sorry, not helpful!)

    hora
    Free Member

    I would check the contract and take legal advice. I wouldn’t accept my money back and I wouldn’t sign any compromise.

    Even if it turns out they are not negligent at least you would have investigated this and not have a serious regret 10yrs later.

    Take legal advice. I’ve been in that shop twice and both times their amazing deals advertised become £400+ (I’m distance/single vision) so I (from my perspective) question how they approach things anyway.

    pictonroad
    Full Member

    She struggles to drive in the dark, especially when it is wet

    I had laser eye surgery at OE and I’ve been very pleased with the outcome. However, I had awful trouble driving in the wet and at night especially a wet night. I’d say it was bad for about 2 years. This has settled down, it’s still not perfect with more ‘halos’ than I had with glasses but it’s perfectly manageable.

    So, just to give a positive spin, hopefully the driving at night thing will get better, it did for me.

    blurty
    Full Member

    I’ve not used them myself, but Centre for sight is apparently the place where people take themselves, when a lazer treatment has had complications.

    augustuswindsock
    Full Member

    I had mine done a few years ago – worst money I’ve ever spent!

    sharkbait
    Free Member

    [balance]I had mine done 14 years ago ….. possibly the best money I ever spent.[/balance]

    OP: I didn’t use Optical Express but I did have to sign a document in a lot of places confirming that I was aware that (as with all surgery) it can go wrong. I’d be amazed if your other half didn’t have to do the same.

    Considering the claimed very low risks of problems, I have heard of so many issues with this sort of surgery (including a good friend who has permanent partial loss of sight in one eye).

    It’s the internet, far more people use it to complain than they do to praise.

    FuzzyWuzzy
    Full Member

    I had mine done about 15 years ago and was the best money I ever spent too. I was aware of the possible complications (more dry eyes, halos at night, compromised night vision etc. rather than blindless) but chose to take that risk and other than being overly sensitive to lights for a few months (my eyes would stream if sat in traffic and cars had their brake lights on for example) I’ve not had any complaints.

    I don’t recall having a test for dry eyes (unless they do it as part of the scanning thing before to check your suitability from an optics point of view). Are you sure they’re supposed to do a test or is it a case of just asking if you suffer from dry eyes at all?

    If they just ask you then would your OH have said she does or did it just become a thing after surgery?

    I’m struggling to see the negligence case here, it’s more your OH was one of the unfortunate few that had complications. You could either view the refund + hush clause as them trying to cover up negligence or just they’re making you an offer they don’t have to but want something back in return, i.e. you not posting all over social media how bad they are.

    And no I don’t work for OE, nor would I actually recommend to anyone they have laser eye surgery (as I wouldn’t want to be partly responsible if it went wrong…) but I’m glad I had it myself and don’t have any regrets in using OE for it.

    mrwhyte
    Free Member

    It is a tough one, as I have seen how she has suffered. Last winter was awful, as she had to change all her working hours, just so she could get home before dark as her eyes were so dreadful. Plenty of halos and glare etc. made worse in the wet. She became really depressed.

    Looking at it subjectively, I am wary to say it is negligence, however from looking at transcripts of conversations and some of the T&Cs, it appears they really glossed over the complications, and did not communicate these clearly enough. Whether there is a case to be brought here, I am unsure.

    footflaps
    Full Member

    Whether there is a case to be brought here, I am unsure.

    You really need to speak to a medical negligence lawyer and find out….

    duir
    Free Member

    I am booked in for laser surgery in December after 3 years of research. I have opted for Dan Reinstein at the London Vision Clinic, Google him and try to find a bad review, you will not. Excellent results without complications is not only down to the surgeon but also the testing and equipment. I had 4 hours of tests before they accepted me for surgery and they made all the associated risks very clear. The surgery is preceded by a final consultation with the surgeon to ensure the correct settings and has follow ups the day after and a month later. The surgeon gives you his personal number to call and any further treatment required is included in the original package. This sort of expertise and care is not provided by cheaper places that require high volumes of custom for profit.

    Of course all that doesn’t help now but Dan Reinstein specialises in putting right eyes that have been botched by other surgeons so maybe he can help here.

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