“2/3 of them are doing nothing improper at all. At least 2/3s”

Am I supposed to be impressed with that? No more than 1/3 of them are fiddling the system!

How many consultancies does that **** do anyway?

A lot of it’s not against the rules because the rules are so loose – that doesn’t make it right though.

Ken Clarke is a qualified barrister so he’d know how to make a carefully worded comment.

Why is he a “****” ?

he ate my grant

furry muff 🙂

and if that wasnt offence enough for you, check out his links with british american tobacco

Yeah I heard him say that. Bit unfair to give him stick over it though imo. He might well be ‘a qualified barrister’ but the remark was a spontaneous off-the-cuff one, he wasn’t giving a testimony in a court of law ffs.

I think the point he was trying to make was that the overwhelming majority of MPs don’t try to do iffy stuff even if it is within the rules.

Of course the comments he was making were in response to the real story which was about another ‘qualified barrister’ – that dodgy git Geoff Hoon.

There are few politicians which I dislike more intensely than that **** Hoon. I’m sure that he acted fully within the rules, he’s not stupid, but at least the story has exposed just what self-serving to55er he is.

.

Shame on you chrism for picking on Clark when the real story was about Hoon. I reckon you’ve done it because Clark is a Tory and you wanted to show that you were fair minded in your opinions. Or sumfink.

Hoon is indeed an utter hoon, ’tis true.

Something needs to be done here, and there’s one fairly easy thing that springs to mind – If your job comes with grace and favour accomodation, there’s no place at the expenses trough for you. Surely a simple idea?

Shame on you chrism for picking on Clark when the real story was about Hoon. I reckon you’ve done it because Clark is a Tory and you wanted to show that you were fair minded in your opinions. Or sumfink.

😀

Didn’t really think there was much to comment on about Geoff snout in the trough Hoon – he’s just another one making the most of the system. Presumably your slating of him and standing up for Ken is an attempt to show just how impartial you are? 😉

Clarke’s comment about 2/3 did make my jaw drop though, with the implication (in the same way you imply with “the overwhelming majority of MPs don’t try to do iffy stuff”) that if only 1/3 or a minority are doing dodgy stuff then that’s OK. You’re right the story is about Hoon, but Clarke’s comments sounded like old boys closing ranks.

the overwhelming majority of MPs don’t try to do iffy stuff even if it is within the rules.

2/3 is hardly an overwhelming majority…

mps work in a palace and feel they should be paid like kings

their salaries are relatively modest so they use expenses to top-up

100% of em

Presumably your slating of him and standing up for Ken is an attempt to show just how impartial you are?

By ‘Ken’ I’m assuming you mean Livingstone (I didn’t go to school with the geezer so we’re not on first name terms) I slated Hoon cause he is a complete to55er, nothing to do with being ‘impartial’. But please don’t ask me why I think he’s a to55er as there aren’t enough hours left in the day. Your reasons for slating Clark are somewhat less convincing.

I didn’t think Clarke’s comments “sounded like old boys closing ranks”. Far from it. He freely admitted that the latest revelations didn’t look good. That’s why he chose to make the comment that “2/3 of them are doing nothing improper at all”. And he obviously realised as he said it, that it didn’t sound like a particularly huge majority because he quickly added “at least 2/3s“

It was an unscripted comment made during a causal conversation, and I find pretty pathetic when people try to hang on to every single word a politician spontaneously utters whilst speaking informally.

Dribbling Geoff Hoon on the other hand, undoubtedly gave his decision to take the p1ss out of the British tax-payer some thought.

Although he probably didn’t think too long and hard about it as he has made a parliamentary career out of taking the p1ss.

By ‘Ken’ I’m assuming you mean Livingstone

er, check the title of the thread, GG (not sure how Red Ken would fit in with the context of the comment).

Oh, and also note the 😉 !

BTW, unlike some who’ve used this thread as an excuse, I’m not particularly slating Clarke (I share your opinions on the relative merits of him and Hoon if I’ve understood you correctly). Just pointing out how ridiculous a comment it is – even if off the cuff, he was sitting in a studio, so it wasn’t all that informal.

er, check the title of the thread

LOL !

Don’t know why I thought “by ‘Ken’ he must mean Livingstone” ! ……… you see this is what happens when get all chummy and call politicians by their first names !

I’m ‘standing up’ for Clarke because I don’t think he has committed any sort of mortal sin. Certainly I don’t think his poor choice of words warrants a rant and a thread. On the other hand I did consider posting a thread on Hoon, but then decided that I couldn’t be arsed to get worked up about the self-serving to55er.

BTW, I never made any comments about the “relative merits” of Clarke – he is a Tory after all.

Funny how the terms of reference change. MPs are acting within the rules to claim their entitlement, but people claiming any kind of benefit are immediately ‘scroungers’. Hmmm.

Hoon needs to be cloned, when he was in charge of defence he seemed bullet-proof to all the criticism which just bounced off and he carried on regardless. Clone that and send him to war instead!

I’m guessing on this he’ll be like a new slippier version of teflon and nothing will stick either!

I’m so happy that only 1/3 of them are cheating us their employers, that means we can sack all those ones and carry on with just the few honest ones.

Do we really need this many politicscams and hangers on anyway, surely the country would run more efficiently with a smaller government.

Funny how the terms of reference change. MPs are acting within the rules to claim their entitlement, but people claiming any kind of benefit are immediately ‘scroungers’. Hmmm.

Its part of a general assumption in this country, that poorer people are all a load of sciving scroungers who lie at the drop of a hat and the better off are always decent honest people full of integrity.

This is even echoed where I work, where ‘higher’ levels of staff can ‘work at home’ without question by anybody, but lower levels are forbidden as it is assumed they will be sciving off (being poorer is proof of dishonesty).

Clarke might conceivably be one of the straight ones – although only because he was raking in so much from his outside jobs.

“he wasn’t giving a testimony in a court of law”

or even a court of tennis! 😉

Clarke might conceivably be one of the straight ones – although only because he was raking in so much from his outside jobs.

A bloke who worked for BAT murdering people for profit is one of the straight ones, if you think that then it really will depress me.

given his consumption of tobacco products, it’ suicide, surely?

Feel free to toddle-off all depressed.

I’m not sure how cigarettes work but does smoking one indicate to some paid hit man of BAT that they can pick you off from a distance with a sniper rifle? “Murdering people” would otherwise seem a poor choice of words for what is basically illness brought about on people who through their own idiocy decide to ingest harmful (but legal) chemicals of their own free will, though pay somone for the privilage.

Think what you like but I dont feel someone who was working in public service and a key member of the government should have been director of a company whos product is responsible for killing more people than hitler. Lets not forget BAT peddle their whares in developing countries where people are not educated.

Damn , Godwins already. It was going so well too.

is it though, I havent called him a nazi, he’s a pretty left wing tory. People who work for cigarette companies are knowingly killing people though which is fine if your happy with that, but not if your were in the government of the day IMO.

No they are not. People who work for cigarette companies (are you including everyone btw, even the bloke who cleans the factory toilet or just the evil management?) produce a product that is legal in every country on Earth. It is the stupidity of the individual that decides whether or not they decide to smoke them and the governments of countries have it well within their power to educate or just plain ban if they wished to but choose not to as idiots still have the power to vote.

No they are not.

No they are not what? Dont understand that bit.

Anyway as I said I wouldnt work in any many for a cigarette company, others would and good luck to them, but dont be a memeber of government too. As I said its my opinion and you wont change it. I do think your view of the world is simplistic and nieve though

No they are not knowing killing people, people choose to do that everytime the idiots put a cigarette in their mouth. Do kitchen knife producers get this much grief over knife crime? Thanks for belittling my ‘life experiences’ as symplistic and nieve btw. When you’ve done a bit more with your sad little life than sit in a cubicle and post tin foil hat waffle on a mountain bike forum I might, possibly, consider any tripe to pour from your keyboard worth heeding. Change your view point, why would I want to? Nuts like you are far too entertaining. No offence like.

When you’ve done a bit more with your sad little life than sit in a cubicle and post tin foil hat waffle on a mountain bike forum I might, possibly, consider any tripe to pour from your keyboard worth heeding.

People in glass houses?

people choose to do that everytime the idiots put a cigarette in their mouth

So uneducated poeple in Africa are able to make informed choices are they? Righto! Like I said nieve and simplistic.

To hear you rant on about BAT anyone would think they made something like, you know, weapons or fighter planes, or something. They make cigarettes, people smoke them for pleasure. That slightly reduces the age at which their individual mortality rate approaches 1. 🙄

And “naive” is a really easy word to spell. That goes for both of you. 😉

I met a bloke who worked for BAT out on a club run once. HAving a general chat about life and he mentioned who he worked for. My jaw hit my handlebars as I tried not to look too suprised. He’s a really nice bloke and rides a much nicer bike than I did so I dont suppose he cares what I think. I wouldnt work for them and I dont want my cabinet ministers too either.

My spelling is shite I apologise

Have you seen the film “Thank You for Smoking”? It really is rather funny.

I don’t particularly approve of BAT, but we also have people right across government who work for companies which manufacture equipment which is actually designed to kill people, companies which sell things designed to save lives but which are too expensive for the most vulnerable to afford, companies that sell things that nobody needs which are made by people who aren’t paid enough to live on etc etc. If one did a serious audit of all one’s friends vaguely unethical interests I suspect most of us would get quite lonely, and government would be completely decimated!

🙂

>I wouldnt work for them and I dont want my cabinet ministers too either.

I don’t believe Clarke works for BAT any more BTW.

So uneducated poeple in Africa are able to make informed choices are they? Righto! Like I said nieve and simplistic.

They may not but there are plenty of aid agencies/charities tripping over themselves to get out there and help the poor dears and those who run the countries have a degree of education, no matter what you may think of their personal opinions.

Nieve and simplistic? A realist perhaps who has actually been to some of these ‘developing countries’ rather than occasionally spot them on the news and think “oh my gosh” before swiftly moving on to consider which trail centre they’re gonna ride this weekend.

If you don’t like opinions that may be a little more brutal and honest than the rose-tinted and extremely simplistic ones you’re spewing forth where the bloke making the fags is the Devil and the poor chaps in developing countries is purely his bitch then perhaps the internet isn’t for you.

completely decimated

10% of MPs lost?! Nooooooo!!!!! 😯

Nieve and simplistic?

closer. Nearly there.
😀

I recall a cartoon showing two roman legionaries standing with a dead one lying on his back between them and remarking “decimation isn’t too bad, is it?” 😉

You could have jumped in earlier Stoner when Mr Worldly Wise used ‘nieve’, then I wouldn’t have naively copied his poor spelling.

Tobacco companies – I wouldn’t work for one and doubt I could be friendly with someone who did…. I once met somone who worked for De Beers and questioned how they could work for a company like that; hate them I do.