Ok, just put some flat pedals onto the bike after riding clipped in for years. The flatties feel great on off camber stuff, drops etc but I'm struggling to keep feet on the pedals when going ove jumps, just seems to throw me higher than the bike. Any tips and suggestions?

It's most likely because you're used to picking up the bike with your feet. The switch to flats does usually take a little adjusting but once you've learnt to jump without using your feet you will be a better rider.
Think about using your arms to pull the front end up then rotating them forward and pushing forward with your hips to get the back wheel up. You can practice this by learning a simple bunny hop on the flat. Once you done this translate the same technique to jumps on the trail.

i'm the other way, i can't jump clipped in.

I cant jump clipped in either, always bin it. As above, get used to bunnyhopping on the flat.

People tend to lose their feet on flats for 2 reasons.

If your feet come of the side of the pedals chances are you've let your legs become straight (knees locked), If your feet slip off the back you need to move your foot forward on the pedal … this is very common when people move from clips to flats. When clipped in the ball of your foot will be pretty much over the pedal axle, on flats that position is quite unstable when you're riding technical stuff, so push move your foot further forward … somewhere around an inch should do the trick.

There is a 3rd reason which involves cr*p pedals and poor shoe choice 😉

Cheers
Stuart

Don't pull the bike up at all when you jump – that's not right. Pump the bike down into the face of the jump with your feet, keeping your heels down. You don't need to do the second part of a bunnyhop when jumping. Different thing.

Don't pull the bike up at all when you jump – that's not right. Pump the bike down into the face of the jump with your feet, keeping your heels down. You don't need to do the second part of a bunnyhop when jumping. Different thing.

My experience dribbling over jumps would disagree, but then I'm not a very good jumper so I'll gladly take advice with the OP in this thread!

Wear pads while you learn………………..

My return to flats – after 10 years

That's the way we teach people to jump, the way our system teaches. The correct way. The more you pump down (well, and forward) into the face of the ramp the more lofting energy is paid back to you on the launch. Yanking the bike up is wrong.

Glenps dead right … infact I can't think of many instances where you'd ever want to be pulling up on the bars … one of the most common riding mistakes people make.

Oh and the second half of a bunny hop (moving your upper body forward, dipping your tows down and pushing back through the pedals) will more often than not result in a heavy front wheel first landing when jumping – never a good thing 😀

Stuart

Iride with my feet in the same position on flats and SPD, anything else just feels wierd (burgtech pedals and element or kustom trainers though, so masses of grip).

Its a practice thing, give it a few hours and you'll wonder why you ever used SPD's.

I think there's some good advice in here:

http://www.leelikesbikes.com/effect-of-suspension-damping-on-hopping-and-jumping.html

Ignore the title and read it through. Links in the replies take you to useful stuff as well.

you must push into the jump as glenp and satannorm have said. you only pull once in the air to style/trick
jumping is very easy to learn

For normal riding a clipped in foot position on flats is fine, problems tend to arise on technical stuff particulary if wheels are coming off the ground … the problem (feet slipping off the back of the pedals) is often compounded in these situations by people riding too far off the back of the bike.

Stuart

Just for the record I was trying to keep it simple I explaining the technique but I admit I was over simplyfing. Having said that the way you exain it here is also wrong simply pushing the bike into the back of the take off is not enough. You have to get the bike to describe the trajectory you want. If you simply let the kicker launch the bike then you're in for trouble. Depnding on the shape you could find your rear wheel being kicked higher than the front at which point you're over the bars and face planting.
Of course we could be getting lost in semantics and what I've said could also exactly what you mean.

My trials technique is clearly stumping my jumpign technique then (doesn't surprise me). When I pump into jumps I tend to come off backwards or sideways, I get far better and cleaner air when when effectively bunnyhopping off a jump. I might come knocking for some lessons!

your feet always point to the landing.

Just to throw a spanner in the works … some jumps are that badly made, they're dangerous 😕

If something has a tendancy to 'kick' the back wheel up as it leaves the lip, I'd consider pre-jumping the thing instead.

Stuart

lol 🙂

The way I feel it you want to 'interact' with the bars as little as possible when you're taking off. You push the bike with your feet (a little to start with), this drives the bike through the jump and also means you and the bike won't part company as the bike is being pushed into you. Once you're more comfortable with jumping you can move the bars around but that's once you've taken off, as Jedi says, and if you trying to go fast you probably push down on the bars rather than pull.

i taught jase mk(from here) how easy it is to do last friday. it blew him away how simple it is.

cheers for the advice, I'll persevere… I'm using a set of Superstar Nano pedals and Adidas skate shoes, grip the rest of the time is not a problem so I can't blame it on equipment! The problem seemed to be that I rode light on the pedals when clipped in, weight high and forward and when I try that on flats my feet lift. I'll find a little jump and practice from there. Nice pic Gator. Remember, chicks dig scars (aparently)

wieght high and forward? needs looking at.

Quite probably. Learnt to jump with SPDs so probably didn't learn properly. I jump more over t :?he bike than in the bike if that makes any sense at all.

makes perfect sense. very common error

i taught jase mk(from here) how easy it is to do last friday. it blew him away how simple it is.

Indeed! No pulling involved at all and it's amazing how quietly everything happens when you get it right. Proper revelation.

anyone know of any decent videos that instruct you how to jump properly?

methinks i am doing it all wrong… bear in mind that I am old fart that started late on in life with MTB'ing here is a short vid of me in action

i can jump a tad better when using my Commencal Meta55

Jedi, was I jumping properly on Tuesday? Oh and the wrist is ok, just sprained. I went to the physio today and it feels much better.

Earlier comment on pulling in order to avoid back wheel kicking as it comes through – provided your drive through your feet is with commitment and goes all the way through the take off then there is still no need at all to think about your hands or to pull up. The bike will take a flat trajectory and not nose-dive because the drive is all through the centre of the bike.

As Jedi says it is actually quite a physically simple thing and has a lot less input than, for example, pumping over a bump.

I find if I pull up on the bars I usually go a bit higher and find it easier to do a stunt. Some jumps you can do without pulling on the bars though, others (short steep ones) you need to pull up or back on, i think.

Granted, you won't be getting a back-flip in without pulling (I imagine!) – I'm talking about trail riding! Coming off a jump flat smooth and safe.

Like the jumps at Glentress, you can glide over those without doing anything if you like.

So no one on here has ever had their back wheel kicked up by a short lip? If the lip shape is such that your front wheel has already cleared the take off before your back wheel has got onto it then unless you're adjusting the trajectory at the front Of the bike the rear is going to kick up and you're going over the bars. The start of the red dh run at cwmcarn has a jump just like this and the number of people I've seen almost face plant because of it is scary.

You're not really getting what is being said – the front can't dive because nothing is pushing it down. All the dynamic "drive" of your feet pushing down and forwards through the bb forces the bike (and you) to keep the same trajectory. Honest.

you dont pull to flip either!
pumping over a bump is exactly the same thing