I was hoping it was the one where he tells us how racist Leicester was in the 70’s as a teacher.

To the OP,

There’s no such thing as unqualified ‘freedom of speech’. That is to say you are free to say what you want as long as it doesn’t engage the law.

Khan incited terrorism. That’s not a good thing. The consensus rejects this as acceptable behaviour in the UK.

I don’t know there’s a point. Maybe you don’t understand the law? Perhaps also, you underestimate the power of social media?

Your first page post made it clear that you agreed with the guilty verdict and made no comment on the punishment, Junkyard. Do you agree with me that a five-year sentence is excessive and a better alternative would be a deradicalisation programme. Although I’d like to see emigration as another alternative I agree with those on the thread who posted reservations because no country would want her.

Do you agree with me that a five-year sentence is excessive and a better alternative would be a deradicalisation programme

No the sentence seems reasonable to me as inciting folk to kill is pretty bad IMHO. De radicalisation strikes me as both a tad Clockwork Orange and unrealistic- google translate was poor for that page and i gave up reading.Furthermore, if it worked, we should do it on everyone religious but , I suspect, it might just impinge on their human rights.

Can’t believe the OP thinks this is just free speech & nothing more sinister, longer term

Well, I’m in two minds. There is no doubt there is a need to act in situations where the words or behaviour is such that there is a genuine threat. However, there is also a need to tolerate words or behaviour that, whilst unsavory to the majority, is unlikely to result in any significant event occurring.

Without having sat through the evidence makes it’s difficult to be certain, but it on balance I feel it leans more towards the latter than the former. However, 5 years 3 months is a significant sentence so maybe there is more to it that we realise.

I hadn’t intended it to be a discussion regarding radical Islam which I agree is very much a threat to the UK; more really to sound out where people feel the boundaries of free speech are.

Rich.

will a prison sentence do any good? sounds like she needs psychological help to me! will she just be dumped in prison and free to spread her ideas/mix with like minded types?
fascinating article here
If there was no American prison in Iraq, there would be no IS now. Bucca was a factory. It made us all. It built our ideology.

sometimes governments seem unable to grasp that their methods are often counterproductive, look at Israels increasingly brutal treatment of palestinians further perpetuating violence

To the OP,

She said that when she talks about jihad she does not mean killing innocent people, but people who are a threat to her religion.

Chilling – It’s clear from what’s been reported*, Khan encouraged violence.

Here’s the law – look at the sections/para’s and from your understanding of the reporting, tick the ones that she’s contravened.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/11/section/2

Calling people to commit human atrocities is serious. The sentence must reflect that – to protect and dissuade.

* It will be a matter of public record.

will a prison sentence do any good? sounds like she needs psychological help to me! will she just be dumped in prison and free to spread her ideas/mix with like minded types?

I think there’s a bit of a difference between a UK women’s prison and the internment and torture camps run by the US in Iraq.

No this is going to be a thread in which Konabunny posts nonsense such as…

…I admit my nonsense was nonsense but unfortunately it was nowhere near as nonsensical as the idea that France is a much more tolerant country than the UK because in part there are no citizens arrests in France.

and on that note, you might want to look at article 73 of the (French) penal procedure code, which provides for…citizens arrests: http://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCodeArticle.do?idArticle=LEGIARTI000006575113&cidTexte=LEGITEXT000006071154&dateTexte=20100705&oldAction=rechCodeArticle

The word is “apprehend” and if you read all that you’ll have realised that beyond asking someone to accompany you to the police station there’s not much you can do here unless you are assisting someone in danger.

Have-a-go heros, vigilantes, inventing your own rules and trying to impose them on everyone one else, thought police, a lack of tolerance, bullying, intimidation… . Go through a typical days posting here and you’ll find an example of most. A reflection of UK society.

If you are typical of france then we will find folk who use sound bites to hide their veil [ see what I did there] of intolerance of other cultures and impose their views on them against their will whilst calling others intolerant.

We can find most of those in your posts tbh

Personally I think its right she is being punished, but I’m not sure just throwing her in jail is the best way.
She needs some serious psychological help otherwise she’ll be just as mental in 3 years time when she comes out.
Her kids need to be away from her though, before one of them ends up in a suicide vest for real.

And to all the hand-wringing liberals who think she just needs a cuddle – this is a clear case of encouraging/promoting terrorism. Considering what is going on in Syria/Iraq, and the real danger of another attack in the UK, I think we need to go in hard with these people, just to enforce the fact there is absolutely no place for her views in the UK.

I am a hand wringing liberal I do not believe we should attempt some sort of deradradicalisation reprogramming nor do we have the right to treat her as mad because of her religious beliefs . where would one stop if it was viewed as appropriate for the law to seek to change peoples religious belief structures by compulsion . so in this case I am left with the view she has chosen to adopt beliefs that stand opposed to our free society has actively sought to advance and encourage terrorism and the sentence is from my hand wringing liberal view point too short.

You are not allowed to wear the full face viel anywhere in France, not even walking down the street. The viel she wore to court is full face. I’m pretty sure you can’t even wear a headscarf as a teacher in France.

@kimbers that piece about the U.S. prison in Afgan is pure propaganda from ISIS. it’s just an attempt to appear unbowed by the treatment they received.

Just to be clear as am not advocating a French style ban just pointing out we in the UK are much more tolerant

The word is “apprehend” and if you read all that you’ll have realised that beyond asking someone to accompany you to the police station there’s not much you can do here unless you are assisting someone in danger.

this is absolute cobblers, and I’m fairly sure you know it’s cobblers and are just making stuff up in a vain attempt to cover up from the fact that yet again you have been caught spouting nonsense about the difference between UK and French law. it is not true that people executing citizens arrests in France are only allowed to ask the people they arrest to accompany them a police station – the plain language of the statute is quite clear: they can be apprehended and taken before a police officer.

Have-a-go heros, vigilantes, inventing your own rules and trying to impose them on everyone one else, thought police, a lack of tolerance, bullying, intimidation… . Go through a typical days posting here and you’ll find an example of most. A reflection of UK society.

I think this is an absurd description of both the forum and the UK. but I did laugh at the bit when you criticized other people for “inventing your own rules”. 😆

Tolerant Jambalaya. You personally have been calling for another invasion of Iraq for months.

Read further through your own link Konabunny and you’ll find that even the use of very light force puts the apprehender in the wrong. It would be nice if you remained polite in these debates.

Whoever wins set the rules …

🙄

@edukator I said we as in the UK. On the burkah I am ok with it on the basis it’s a religious belief. I do have concerns that it oppresses women as I suspect in many cases it isn’t a personal choice but an order from their husbands. As I live and work in London I see them on the streets every day.

I cannot decide which is worse your ignorance or your apparent racism
What an outrageous and absurd view to have 🙄
Is the woman we are discussing ordered to by her husband
What a daft statement to make

Read further through your own link Konabunny and you’ll find that even the use of very light force puts the apprehender in the wrong. It would be nice if you remained polite in these debates.

you really will make stuff up to argue black is white, won’t you?

tell us some more great truths about the differences between UK and French law! you’re 0 for 2 so far. I’m sure you can do the hat trick.

allthepies – Member

2. Does this count as a full face veil ?

Look at that slag, she’s got her eyes out and everything!

Junkyard – lazarus

Is the woman we are discussing ordered to by her husband
What a daft statement to make

It is daft.
The fear generated by behaving in a non-Islamic way is down to the society, not the individual.
From my experience, obviously.
I know plenty of Muslims that will, as one example, drink alcohol when alone, but would not dare to do it in front of other Muslims who would equally imbibe when alone.