Not in the Norman Lamont - "as a means to kick the spirit and fight out of a generation for political means"
No, as a way to make the public realise that they made a serious error in May 2010 and not to do the same again in 2015?
Just a thought, their tool for keeping people down and grateful may just backfire this time
No price is worth paying for a Labour government - there hasn't been a single one that hasn't screwed the country up before being kicked out of office.
Ditto tories.
It's the inevitable consequence of having a growing population in an economy/society that has exceed it's need and capacity to support people.
Is Unemployment a "Price Worth Paying"?
I think your perspective changes depending on if you have a job or not.... 
Unless the Tories are now running the economies of every European country and the USA, I don't think that this is entirely their fault. Somehow I suspect we'd be in a much bigger mess if Labour had stayed in.
No price is worth paying for aLabourgovernment - there hasn't been a single one that hasn't screwed the country up before being kicked out of office.
EAT THE RICH
Supporters of each party inevitably blame the other.
IMO, neither party really has the expertise, vision or sense of responsibility to protect or enhance the UK economy.
Party politics, IMO, is short-sighted, self-willed and led by the inappropriately educated and over privileged. That's why I just can't buy into the red-blue debate with sufficient gusto.
Unless the Tories are now running the economies of every European country and the USA, I don't think that this is entirely their fault. Somehow I suspect we'd be in a much bigger mess if Labour had stayed in.
Didn't they dismiss the whole idea that it was a global issue and was instead all Brown's doing during the election? 
Unless the Tories are now running the economies of every European country and the USA, I don't think that this is entirely their fault.
No, but not every country is using economic problems as an excuse to launch drastic cuts to public services for largely ideological reasons.
I've lost my job a couple of times and I'd never wish it on anybody - but I do hope a lot of people come to regret the way they voted.
Whats more worrying is the nature of the jobs that are being created. Earlier this year George Osborne was singing the praises of the companies that were 'investing in Britain' and creating jobs. Tesco, Asda, Macdonalds. Do you think these are high skilled jobs? Nope the majority will be minimum wage. And part time.
The jobs being lost are high skilled jobs ie: Bombadier in Derby
Will Hutton described what would happen if the City continues its self-obsessed ways, to the inevitable detriment of the rest of the country, and the present employment prospects for the majority continue as they are.
"The city will squat like a bloated toad in the middle of a low skill, low pay economy"
dont worry george and dave are going to reign in their chums in the city..... they are just gonna wait until 2018 to do it 
im not even sure being unemployed will be enough to make people realise that voting tory was a mistake, certainly the boundry changes will make it even easier for them next time
its almost as scary as the uninsured in america being convinced by fox news they dont need obamas health care reforms because its some kind of socialism
Spot on binners, looking increasing like me tat there really is no way out of this and its just the start of the UK slowly getting poorer and as such all our standards of living getting worse.
Its going to take a party with serious vision to get the UK on track.
Unfortunatly no one is stepping up to the plate, they all have their fingers in the big fat pie and thats all that seems to matter.
At least for most people i talk to up here in Scotland quality of life is more important that money.
I hate to say this, because TJ will gloat horribly, but Alex Salmond appears to be the only politician in the UK who seems to have the slightest grasp on what's really going on out there
Should the UK have propped up the uncompetitive bombadier?
Should the UK have propped up the uncompetitive bombadier?
won't we be doing that anyway if we have to pay the employees benefits and UK PLC losing their spending power and tax paid?
Exactly
In Germany, France and elsewhere in Europe, when reviewing commercial tenders, they factor in the 'social cost' in lost employment, benefits payments etc of external/foreign suppliers winning the contract
For some utterly inexplicable reason the Government here doesn't. The Tories keep saying they have to obey European Competition law, yet there is nothing in European Competition law which states they can't do, so to say that it is is completely disingenuous
They base it purely on the bottom line, without even looking at the bigger picture. This is due to either
a) Extreme stupidity
b) Vested interests - keeping their mates in the city happy
c) Both of the above
This makes me very angry...
Ch 4 news last night gave a break down of the employment figures (and I'm not quoting exactly etc...)
40,000 jobs created within the private sector
BUT, 111,000 jobs lost in the public sector, so unemployment massively UP
Therefore UK Economy is in a dire state.
FFS - That is entirely within the Government's gift. Unemployment up directly because of UK Govt policy to reduce public specding.
The knock on effect on benefit payouts, decreased consumer spending, decreased public secotor procurement of private sector services etc will hugely hurt the economy
The tories favour policies that mean money does not loose it s value [ low inflation ] as many of its core supporters/donors/MPs are very rich.
I think they do think it is a price worth paying tbh
Labour used to be different but they are not any more.
It is hard to think that the current policies are working as the growth is reducing and they are now capital spending
Tbh we will never eally know if altenative approaches would have been better
Binners for PM
The Bombardier deal (or lack off) was based on a tendering process that was put in by the Labour government. Once the process is running you have to award the contract based on the rules put in place.
You can blame plenty of things on the Tories but this is not one of them.
the red-blue debate
but if we take it as a given that the deficit has to be cut (the greek\irish model of not doing so doesn't appear to be working to well) - how would you have done it? increase taxes? if so, where? Surely taxing the rich more has the same net benefit on the country (in reducing the amount of money kicking around) as reducing payments to the poor?
It's only a red-blue debate in England...in the past. You've heard of the Lib Dems, right?
Yes.
On the political divide, though, isn't it still essentially a two-way debate? Including the Lib Dems as peers of Labour and Conservative because they have facilitated a route out of a hung parliament surely overstates their importance.
Yeah, I know it's different in Scotland, NI and Wales.
They don't Have too do anything of the sort. They can revue this. They just don't want too. Call-me-Dave dismissed it out-of-hand. Then bleated a load of lies about Euro Competition Law
For a party that puts itself across as anti-European, they don't half like to hide behind (real, imagined or just plain made-up) Euro legislation.
I wouldn't defend the labour party, they're just as bad. The self interest, and limitless greed of the 'Elite' at the top of our wonderful society is now so all-encompassing that they're prepared to sink the whole country so they are their friends can carry on accumulating obscene levels of wealth
They're selling the lot of us down the ****ing river!
Once the process is running you have to award the contract based on the rules put in place
total bollox
The last lot screwed up the process, this lot had/have the right and ability to scrap it and start again
lunge - MemberThe Bombardier deal (or lack off) was based on a tendering process that was put in by the Labour government. Once the process is running you have to award the contract based on the rules put in place.
You can blame plenty of things on the Tories but this is not one of them.
im not sure thats entirely the case...
http://www.togetherfortransport.org/node/211
but if we take it as a given that the deficit has to be cut (the greek\irish model of not doing so doesn't appear to be working to well) - how would you have done it?
so they've managed to reduce it since coming in then?
The whole deficit reduction thing is a smoke-screen. The conservatives neo-liberal agenda is driven purely by ideological zeal. And the pace of change is to make sure what they do is irreversible, for when they get booted out. Which they know they will
Here's the whole thing laid out in black and white
Including the Lib Dems as peers of Labour and Conservative because they have facilitated a route out of a hung parliament surely overstates their importance
What the Lib Dems think about Tory policy (and vice versa)
Nearly
What the libdems and some of the Tories think about Euro policies will destroy the coalition IMO
The Tory right is behaving as if it won a stonking great majority at the election.
I'd like to hope that at some point someone in the Lib Dems is going to grow a pair and remind them that they didn't. I'm not holding my breath though. I think they'll do the full 5 year term.
And Christ only knows how much damage they'll have done by that point!
even if the coalition were to collapse (i dont think it will as the limp dems know its the only taste of power they'll have for some time)
i doubt labour have the initiative or even the inclination to reverse the damage
Bring in the BNP, they will quite happily reduce the amount of people on this overcrowded little island.
When they've accomplished that, put them all on a boat, and send them out to sea.
Then bring Labour back in...
Labour is having its Ian Duncan Smith moment. In fact Ed Milliband makes IDS look like a towering political colossus in charge of a devastatingly effective opposition. Worse than useless. He looks like the kid that everyone used to bully at school. He has all the presence and authority of a sponge cake
Is it any wonder the tories are getting away with murder
Binners, that is a very fair point. It is a great time to be in opposition at the moment yet Milliband seems to be making a right royal hash of it. With a good leader I think there could already be calls for a general election, as it is there is just lots of chat about how equally bad both parties are.
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