Viewing 36 posts - 1 through 36 (of 36 total)
  • Is this codswallop? frame & Brooks
  • oldgit
    Free Member

    I recently turned my old steel race bike over to winter riding duties. Which at the end of the day just means adding guards, a Brooks, heavyweight tyres (Gatorskins) and a 39t inner instead of a 42t.

    And now it rides like a pig, unless you crank it up. Sit down for some LSD and it doesn’t want to move. Is this because it was a pure race bike with very compact geometry?

    The Brooks? I’ve been patient, I’ve proofed it and I’ve only ridden using guards. But it’s so high maintenance. I had to bring it indoors after Sundays wet 60 miler, but it was dry for today’s ride. The thing is even when it’s dry it sags under bodyweight, so how you set up saddle height millimetre perfect with one I don’t know. So it’s coming off later today to be replaced with an old Flite.
    Note though. I’ve heard rumour that the Swifts tend to be like this?

    thisisnotaspoon
    Free Member

    I dunno, but I struggle to average 13mph on my tourer/commuter. Similar position to my ‘summer’ bike, Ok it’s effin heavy in comparison, has 32mm tyres and guards, but I still can’t figure out where 20% of the speed goes.

    ctznsmith
    Free Member

    How old is the Brooks and have you ‘tensioned’ it using the nose bolt?

    If it’s relatively new and sagging still with tension then it’s not right.

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    milleboy
    Free Member

    Sit down for some LSD

    Drugs and cycling……more fun than EPO I’d imagine 🙂

    oldgit
    Free Member

    The Brooks is about a year old with very little use.

    milleboy it’s the only way the trees will talk to me.

    trail_rat
    Free Member

    i have a brooks swallow

    as you know im a brooks fan.

    but the swallow isnt a patch on my b17 for being robust.

    crikey
    Free Member

    It’s the tyres.

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    Answer is bound to be psychological.

    No way is any change to that bike going to slow it down significantly – the tires might make a tiny difference tho (they are at the right pressure?)

    Anyone who believes otherwise is probably on the fortune-telling thread tho.

    trail_rat
    Free Member

    i agree probablt the tires

    and as for setting up saddles mm perfect …..your not in the TDF its a club ride on a sunday with friends 2mm wont kill you

    druidh
    Free Member

    Gatorskins are hardly heavyweight. I run Marathons on my tourer and still manage to average around 13mph over longer days.

    As for the Brooks, my B17 is a couple of years old now and hasn’t been “looked after” in any way. Yes – I normally run with mudguards if I’m on the road but not when off-road. No – I don’t cover it when wet or take any care in drying it out (the bike just gets thrown in the garage). I should probably take some Proofide (or Sno-Seal) to it, but that’ll be only the 3rd time.

    trail_rat
    Free Member

    thats obviously subject to how light the tires he had on before were.

    druidh
    Free Member

    I’m betting the Gatorskins are nearer the weight of his original tyres than the weight of a set of Marathons 🙂

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Only 110g per tyre heavier. And I reckon that Brooks sag a good 20mm.

    Dyffers
    Free Member

    I’ve come to the same conclusion as the OP about Brooks saddles: too variable between what should be identical saddles (no two cows identical), too much maintenance required and not worth the half a kilo it adds to the bike.

    I have a couple of B17s that I gave up years ago trying to keep in perfect condition. I just drilled, laced and rode them when wet. They survived alright but are both well sagged.

    On the other hand I also have a Swift which is like sitting on a rock after 1000’s of miles in all conditions.

    All three have been removed and put in the ‘might use in the future’ box in the garage.

    I would also agree that my Roberts is nicer to ride on a clubrun or commute with a 200g rather than 500g saddle. Maybe that’s psychological though.

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    weight in itself doesn’t slow you down significantly on the flat*

    *or even on climbs, and yes the rolling resistance of a heavier tire may be greater.

    trail_rat
    Free Member

    im betting your fitter than the op though druidh …. willing to bet you do more milage 😉

    cynic-al
    Free Member

    druid races a lot of Sportives too 😉

    crikey
    Free Member

    druidh
    Free Member

    That can’t possible be the case. Everyone knows that the fittest folk are those in road clubs that go “racing”. 😆

    druidh
    Free Member

    crikey: Old data. The X-Axis starts at 20, thereby exacerbating the difference. And where are my 700×28 Marathons? 😆

    njee20
    Free Member

    Interesting graph that, do we know how they did it?

    The X-Axis starts at 20

    Still >25W difference.

    brakes
    Free Member

    of the changes you have made, I can only think that it would be the tyres.

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Everyone knows that the fittest folk are those in road clubs that go “racing”.

    Yeah and don’t you forget it. 🙂

    oldgit
    Free Member

    I usually use Diamante Pros

    crikey
    Free Member

    Sorry, I was in a rush, gotta get that green bin out!

    http://rouesartisanales.over-blog.com/article-1503651.html

    It’s from here.

    and contains:

    In general terms, the total drag of a cyclist will consist of 80% tire rolling resistance and 20% wind resistance at 10 km/h or 6 mph. At 40 km/h or 25 mph the numbers will reverse, with total drag consisting of 80% wind resistance and 20% tire rolling resistance.

    druidh
    Free Member

    That’s the answer then – go faster and your tyre choice doesn’t matter so much!

    BTW – my 700x28mm Marathons weigh 560g each…..

    julianwilson
    Free Member

    that graph: 😯
    25 watts difference at 18 mph!

    oldgit
    Free Member

    That’s the answer then – go faster and your tyre choice doesn’t matter so much!

    That’s what I found, horrid at low speeds, okay when cranked up.

    crikey
    Free Member

    In amongst all the marketing rubbish and old wives tales about cycling equipment, in my experience, buying good road tyres is worth it. I’ve never bothered with winter tyres after working it out.

    tracknicko
    Free Member

    that graph has GP’s and Shwalbe stelvios needing more ffort than gator skins.

    that can’t be right???

    crikey
    Free Member

    that can’t be right???

    Seems to be supported by the figures from the test in the link?

    Liking my Michelins…

    clubber
    Free Member

    It explains why I always liked my Michelin Pro2s and hated Conti GP3000s….

    ctznsmith
    Free Member

    The Brooks is about a year old with very little use.

    Under a year then return it under warranty.

    ourmaninthenorth
    Full Member

    I’ve never bothered with winter tyres after working it out.

    Do you mean cheap tyres? I’ve never got that either. I spend disproportionately more on decent tyres, though I do tend to ride two types in the winter: Vittoria Pavé or GP4S. Love both of them. TBH, I’ve ridden them year round too.

    That graph does explain why I always felt faster on Vittoria Corsa – sadly I wasn’t stronger, just deluded by rubber.

    oldgit
    Free Member

    Under a year then return it under warranty.

    I used it last winter and got it soaked on one of it’s first outings. I don’t think it’s been used since February up until now.
    It has a massive sag in the middle? when I look at google images they seem to have a nice straight top, not mine.
    It’s probably just over a year old.
    It’s comfy, very comfy. Just hard work.

    So I don’t know if it’s rose tinted specs or what, but when they were common in the 70s I don’t think anyone maintained them and they were as tough as old boots.

    ourmaninthenorth, I’m tempted to go back to Pavés, expensive but bloody great. These Contis have dreadful grip as well, I’m cornering like a tart.

    ctznsmith
    Free Member

    The ‘old boys’ say the leather is thinner than the 70’s saddles.

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