… have we got the right people for the job? Requesting divine intervention should be off the agenda IMO.

Hey troutwrestler!

I’m out of the loop, no TV 😯

What’s all this then?

BBC Article Apparently the ruling applies to E&W, but Scotland may follow suit. I hope so.

This is what the fuss is about.

They had two votes on whether to have prayers at council meetings, both results were in favour but some intolerant old man decided that since he wasn’t getting his way that he would kick up a fuss until he did.

Intolerant? He was well within his rights and quite correct IMHO.

If anyone wants or needs to pray, they could do it in their own time before work. I don’t pay my council tax for wasters to sit about doing nowt, get on with your bloody jobs!

1. If they voted and it was passed he should mind his own business or join another club.
2. Must admit to having similar veiws regarding religion to the grampy old git who casued all this . How ever he is totally wrong as is any ruling. The religious issue is not the point. Its a) the wishes of the majority present and b) and more importantly tradition. We spend an excessive and immoral amount of time and money destroy all that is old just to to keep some minority happy. If you don;t like it , tough, play else where.

Its the need to pray that worries me. I’d be nervous if a doctor, pilot or plumber prayed before starting their work. You’re either up to it or you’re not. Praying won’t help.

how would christians react if we made them say something rejecting religion if the majority of councillors were in favour of this?

the only way to have equality over religious freedom is to allow people to do whatever they wish in private and nothing in an official capacity.

He felt uncomfortable at having to sit through prayers but did not want to walk out of meetings because it would look ‘discourteous’ to the public.

why should anyone have to sit through that whilst trying to perform their democratic duty as an elected representative of the people. it is not a club it a council chamber and the councillor represent other people.
he was summoned to council chambers then had to sit through that why should an non believer be forced to take part in their ceremony.
freedom of religious belief must surely include the religious freedom to not believe and therefore not have to partake in their archane ceremonies.

Yeah, intolerant. Perhaps you need to hear the interview with him that was on the tv earlier to get it, but I’d say it’s a fair comment to make about the man.

AND WORSE! While they’re praying, Eric Pickles has scoffed the biscuits…

We as a nation are generally happy to support minorities, no? Using tradition to justify practices is a little risky. I think we are best without many traditions.

Joining another club is exactly his point. An elected club which serves the public should not make people uneasy and unwanted because of religous belief.

Hahaha!

God we’ve got a bit of shit to deal with, well actually it’s more like a bath full, since it’s you and you know everything anyway, I might as well tell the truth.

It’s a complete shitemare, they actually want us to do some work and in the not too distance future, we might just have too 😯

Please God send us a sign or some kind of help.

L.Z B.stard

How much are they paid, so how much does it cost for this anachronism? Pray if you want, but on your own time.

we are a Christian country, with an established Church in England, governed by the Queen

Quote from Eric Pickles, says it all really, our politicians believe in top down governance, rather than representation.

So we should offend whoever we please if the majority vote to do so?
Rubbish.
Junkyard has pwned so far.

Apparently changing the law to allow this sort of thing in council meetings and the like changes the point of the argument! It doesn’t it makes it all the more pathetic!

Consenting adults in private please. and don’t scare the horses

pickles also described it as illiberal [radio 4] to not do this.

I dont get this argument at all….it is liberal to force people to pray.

i do feel sorry for christians, it must be difficult to see their exalted position in society slowly eroding away just like their congregation numbers.

Perhaps they should test their faith and pray for more members and see if god helps out?

christians are a tiny minority in the country.

Crickey – slightly tangential, but let’s apply your argument consistently. Bye, bye STW during the day? Post if you want to, but in your own time 😉

…and one of the only tiny minorities in this country against whom everyone is free (even encouraged) to discriminate against?

All hail the Queen!

What? You’re offended?

Off with your head!

😆

Crickey – slightly tangential, but let’s apply your argument consistently. Bye, bye STW during the day? Post if you want to, but in your own time

I don’t force my workmates to read my inane ramblings on STW, I would imagine they would be quite peeved if I did. Although they would probably benefit from my wisdom 😉

How much are they paid, so how much does it cost for this anachronism? Pray if you want, but on your own time.

councillors don’t get paid a salary, only an allowance for time and expenses.

Ahem….

I always post in my own time. Public sector type, taking job seriously, sense of duty…

An allowance for time?

Maybe instead of prayer they could recite a mantra before every meeting, something like-

what do we want?
Evidence based change!
When do we want it?
After peer review!

Maybe the guy who objected should have excerpts of Richard dawkins’ God Delusion read out as part of the council agenda!

Maybe, just maybe they could all stop being bell ends and get on with doing what they are meant to and leave all the crap to one side?

councillors don’t get paid a salary, only an allowance for time and expenses.

An allowance for time? a bit like the hourly rate a labourer is paid?

In these times of cost cuttings, if we remove the prayers do we get to pay the councillors less?

silly god botherers….

Based on my experiences in Broughton In Furness recently I’d say the God bothering ones are the worse liars and corrupt mother councillors out there.

😆 @ MSP

Traditions are what makes society, such as the tradition of not killing others or allowing freedom of speech. Its change that harms in many cases.
I still say, if the majority were happy its his problem. And the very fact that central government/law can affect regional or smaller issues is immoral, disgusting and something the country should hang its head in shame about. The government and courts are our servants not our masters.

If they were elected to pray, then so be it. God works in mysterious ways. Personally I would pick up the first stone….

aye tradition its a great thing
Trial by ordeal
Deporting
Press ganging
Child labour
Husband could not rape his wife
the right of the church to demand money before you could sleep with your wife – ok they did not all do this
ah all great things now harmed by change
No point in cherry picking – so you think the church curtailed the right to free speech – Galileo made to recant his heretical heliocentric view or die for example?
Perhaps the holy wars or the inquisitions that protected all life? these traditions

The whole point of civilisation is generally to evolve and become wiser and leave all old practice and custom in the past. Sometimes this is good sometime it is bad. If you object to change your entire life will be lived with tears in your rose tinted spectacles as you mourn all that has come to pass.

I am not sure allowing regional areas to ignore the law is that good an idea either. I dont see why you think it is immoral or disgusting that the law applies universally to all citizens [ and indeed elected representatives of government in this case] of this land even those is Bideford. Surely it is unfair that some are “exempt” from the law.